Forums
 FAQHelp  LinksLinks    SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

thoughts on scooter theft (directors cut, aka long)
Goto page 1, 2  Next
 
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Forums » General Discussion Previous topic :: Next topic  
Author Message
chelsea
Dealer


Joined: 01 Aug 2007
Posts: 34
Location: richmond, va
small engines = big fun

PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 5:54 pm    Post subject: thoughts on scooter theft (directors cut, aka long) Reply with quote

Good morning, modernbuddy folks!

Here in Richmond, VA, we are in the middle of what even the police are calling an epidemic of theft. Scooters are only one part of the thefts that are occurring here. Cars, trucks, bicycles, mopeds, kayaks, canoes, lawn mowers, hedge trimmers, picnic tables. You name it...if it isn't nailed down, there is a good chance someone has stolen it (or at least tried to). As scooterists, we only hear concentrated info on the stuff that we are into, so the other thefts go under our collective radar.

The Richmond Police are more aware of the situation now than a year ago. I am in regular communication with a detective. He put together a presentation last fall which gave the guys on the beat a lot better chance of identifying a stolen scooter. They are on the lookout for scooters that have visibly damaged ignition switches, are being ridden without keys, or have engines that are larger than 50cc and are therefore going faster than 35mph without a license plate (see below for more info on virginia's screwy system of licensing). Most importantly, I have heard from many sides of the story that lot more folks are getting pulled over on untagged scooters. It can be a little irritating if you are legit, and a little bit fantastic if that helps someone get a stolen scooter back.

I've got a few suggestions in terms of keeping your bike on lock down, making sure your ass is covered if your scoot DOES get stolen, and a project that I'll be pitching to the RVA police sometime in the next week in order to perhaps make some progress to help keep scooters in the hands of those that own them.

How are the thieves stealing the scooters?
One of the sales guys at Scoot Richmond had his Buddy 150 and his friend's Buddy 50 stolen from his apartment building last fall. The building's security cameras did a nice job of demonstrating the general procedure by which many scooters are stolen (but it didn't give us a good enough face view to get anybody). These scooters were not locked via an external cable or chain lock--just the column lock. The thieves rolled the scooters away, making the column lock a non-issue by simply pulling on the handlebars in order to lift and move the front wheel every few feet. The Buddys are relatively lightweight, and while this procedure is not graceful, it gets the job done. They rolled the scooters in this fashion out of the parking lot and down the side street. Out of sight of the camera, they rolled the scooters into the alley on the next block over. Here, they forced the column lock until it broke, probably by wacking on the left handlebar grip with a blunt instrument...or more simply, by running at it full force. Once the column lock was broken, they removed the front legshield plastic. We've seen this operation performed by someone with a screwdriver, but often it's done with a brick or rock, causing the front panel to partially shatter. And then they do some of the worst nastiest wiring bodgery known to mankind in order to bypass the battery and electric start. This allows the scoot to be started with the kickstart lever, no matter what position the key switch is in.

How do we know the details of this event? Matt's friend's scooter was actually recovered by the police in that alley a block or two away. Either they couldn't get it started or they were disturbed while working on them, we'll never know which.

Some of the scooters that are stolen in Richmond turn up with a heavily damaged ignition. These look like someone has tried to use a screwdriver, drill, or even a pocket knife to jimmy the ignition. We used to see more of this on stolen scooters. The ones that feature this sort of damage of late are obviously folks that have only stolen a few scooters. You see, it looks like a number of the thefts in Richmond are being done by people that have done more than a few of these, as the workmanship on the bikes is getting more sophisticated. We've recently seen some that have had whole new generic ignition switches installed, so the bike DOES have keys. We've seen some with a large portion of the VIN on the frame obliterated, making it impossible to identify the vehicle. This is an important point, and I'll come back to it momentarily.

Last but not least: Once a scooter has been successfully stolen, what happens to it? Last year, we saw recovered scooters with nasty horrible spray paint being ditched everywhere. Sometimes the scoot would have less than 100 miles on it. Those were scoots that were driven until the fuel ran out, and then ditched because someone couldn't get to the gas tank. But currently, the thieves' plan is to sell the vehicle as fast as possible for not very much. Very few of the scoots that have been recovered lately are spray painted. Flip the scoot quick, don't do a damn thing to it, and the thieves get the maximum pay out with the least work. A few questionable scooters have turned up on craigslist, and I know that many people in the area check it every day for possible theft recoveries. But mostly the scooters are sold to other people without advertising the fact. Some of the stolen bikes have been purchased at places like the Bellwood Flea Market, in deep southside Richmond. Other times, a scooter is seen being ridden with a "FOR SALE" sign on it, advertising something in the $300-$850 range.

I used to joke that pink Buddys had the least risk of being stolen, because what young male would ride a pink scooter? Now I know that that doesn't make the vehicle unstealable either (although it may keep the thieves from trying too hard to get it running).

Your scooter is in the greatest danger when you are the places that you go on the most regular basis. Your home is obviously #1 on the list. Your work is probably #2. The parking lot of the grocery store, the post office, while out to lunch, etc is considerably further down the list, because obviously the scoot is only there every now and then vs being there on a super regular basis.

Discussing the problem with a customer over the weekend, she told me how she doesn't ride the scooter to the office much these days. If she has to go to a meeting, she doesn't like having to find a parking space that is actually secure and has a good solid place to lock the scoot. That makes her Buddy considerably less practical than she hoped, and therefore she generally takes her car to work. Note that this customer lives in a part of town that always has a VERY high theft rate, and she had her first Buddy 125 stolen in the dead of winter. I showed her the features of the Xena Disc Brake Lock with Alarm with an explanation of what we usually see when scooters are stolen (pickup and roll, pickup and roll), and then I showed her how the Disc Lock can help with that (makes the scoot's front wheel almost immobile and makes a crazy loud alarm if the scoot is moved). She was stoked about it. The Disc Brake Alarm Lock adds an extra layer of security to her Big Ass Onguard Lock at her house. It gives her more flexibility when locking her scoot during a meeting or at the grocery store, places where she would be able to hear if someone messed with her ride.

Make sure that you scoot is on LOCKDOWN when you are at home at night. Never ever ever take your home for granted. Even if it is in a fenced yard, even if it is locked in a shed, no matter where your scoot is, it is currently a target. The column lock is NOT enough. Depending where you live and work, you may want to consider using multiple layers of security. Locking the scoot to something that isn't going anywhere with a heavy duty chain lock that cannot be cut using normal methods is a must. I've seen several cable locks of varying sizes get seriously manhandled and cut through of late, but we still haven't seen any of the big chain link Onguard or Krypto locks get cut.

Add a Xena Disc Brake Alarm Lock to your front end if you can. Owners of Buddy 50-125-150s, Roughhouse 50s, SYM Mios, SYM Fiddle IIs, and others can all comfortably use any of the Xena Disc Locks with the 6mm locking pin. Owners of Rattler 110s, Blackjack 150s, or Buddys with the upgraded front disc rotor as well as HD125/200s and Citycoms can use the fancier double locking pin Xena locks, such as the XH14. Sorry Stella riders, SYMBA folks, Ruckus and Metro owners, either you don't have a disc brake or your disc rotor is mega weird and not compatible. However, you CAN still take advantage of the disc alarm by combining it with a Xena chain lock or cable lock. These have special ends that fit into the disc lock itself and activate the sensors of the alarm. If the lock unit or the chain/cable is tampered with and moves the contacts in the lock unit, then the alarm is going to go off and you'll hopefully scare off the potential thieves. However, using the lock in this fashion does not keep the front wheel from moving.

Some other helpful tips:
1. Do not lock through or around the front wheel rim--one guy had his front wheel removed and the thieves drove his scoot away with the help of a 5" pocket bike wheel that they brought with them
2. Do not put the lock around the fork tube on the side of the front wheel which does NOT hold the front disc brake caliper. You CAN use the locking hasp itself to secure the front fork tube on the side with the disc brake caliper as long as you put the lock hasp above the caliper. Then the potential thief cannot remove the front wheel and slide the lock down the fork tube. Sure, he can take off the caliper and all of that crap, but we've found that the more stuff someone has to do, the less likely they are to mess with your bike.
3. Do not trust the circle on the sidestand mount of the Genuine Roughhouse/Rattler alone. I'm reasonably sure that that circle is there specifically to allow you to lock your scoot to something, but it can be hacksawed through. Only OK if you have coupled that lock with a disc brake alarm.
4. If you must lock to a street sign, make sure it is securely in the ground. Make sure that the post doesn't just lift out of the sidewalk or exhibit any movement.
5. Do not park locked to a parking meter or other not tall solid object. Two men can generally muster the strength to lift a wee scooter up high enough to clear something like that.
6. Try not to park someplace too secretive. It's a plus if passers by cannot see your scoot, but it's a definite minus if passers by also cannot see people doing terrible things to your scoot. Private is good, dark and sketchy is not.
7. Your shed is probably break-into-able. If you do not have security on the structure that holds your scoot, then you should probably still use a disc brake lock or lock it to something. Yes, we've had scoots stolen from locked sheds.

Going into a store for a few? The column lock may be enough, and even more solid if you add an easy-to-tote disc lock. Park close to the building rather than close to the street, so that a passing pickup truck can't stop and dump your scoot in the back lickity split. Park near windows so that people can see if something sketchy starts happening. Park where someone doesn't have room to get in on the left hand side and force your column lock.

Important thing to keep in mind in relation to the above point: Of late, the theft capital of Richmond seems to be the intersection of Boulevard and Monument. The closer you are to that intersection, the more you need to use every locking device in your power every time you lock the scoot. Seriously. Recently a scoot was stolen on Monument within 30 minutes of it being parked there for the first time, cable lock severed.

What else can you do to make sure you don't get screwed? Make sure you have theft insurance. It doesn't cost much more than the basic minimum liability insurance you have. If the unthinkable does happen, then at least you can get what you deserve, which will hopefully be enough to replace your scoot.

For owners of 50cc vehicles in VA, this can be more difficult than you'd guess. A 50cc scooter is technically considered a moped rather than a motorcycle, so getting standard motorcycle coverage may or may not be possible. Call a company that specializes in recreational vehicles and they may tell you that they only cover things that happen in an offroad scenario. Try your home owners or renters insurance and they may only cover a theft if it occurs at your house. But as we've seen, most thefts DO occur at the owner's residence. Even though it's not the best most comprehensive coverage ever, it may be the best option for the time being. When inquiring, ask about coverage for a motorized bicycle because that's basically what they consider it.

What is Scoot Richmond doing to recover scoots and hopefully prevent some from being stolen? Well, we definitely have a database of all of the vehicles that have been stolen to date which contains VIN info and such. If someone comes to my shop looking for an ignition switch, we tell that person that there are a few different models and each uses a different switch. We collect the VIN of the scooter and we check it against our list of stolen vehicles. If we get a winner, we call 911. Then we stall that person until the police arrive.

However, my plan is to expand our database significantly in order to identify where thefts are more common and to attempt to sift through particulars found on recovered scooters to find patterns. I think it will help the police narrow down the search area and help identify a good place to work out a sting operation. I'll be starting work on this project this week. If your scooter has been stolen in Richmond at any time and any place, whether it has been recovered or not, I'd like to hear from you.

In addition, I've been mulling over the details of a possible scooter registry. I've got a few ideas on this, but it's not totally formulated in my brains quite yet. Give me a week.

dear christ, I'm long-winded. thanks for reading and please contribute your ideas, thoughts, etc. if you are someone who has had a scooter stolen in the central VA area, please DM me and I'll ask you a hundred thousand questions so that I can add you to our database.

NOTES:
In Virginia, any 2 wheeled vehicle with an engine capacity of less than 50cc can be ridden without a motorcycle license, license plates, inspection stickers, insurance, etc. In fact, it is legal to ride a 49cc scooter even if you have had your drivers license revoked due to a DUI, causing 50cc scooters to be fondly known as "liquorcicles". The catch is that those vehicles cannot be ridden faster than 35mph. Since in many cases the larger engine version looks almost identical to the smaller version, and since in many cases even the 50cc scooters go faster than 35mph, there has been LOADS of confusion about which which is which.

Further complicating things is Virginia's system of handling motorcycle dealers. If you sell vehicles that are under 50cc, the business is NOT required to have a Virginia motorcycle dealers license, and therefore that business is NOT capable of issuing the purchaser a Manufacturers Certificates of Origin (aka MCO or MSO...the piece of paper that becomes a title). The businesses selling those scoots without proper licensing themselves are generally selling to people that *also* want to avoid proper licensing. And of course the only manufacturers that will sell to those folks are Chinese scooter makers, who probably ALSO lack proper licensing. It's a total disaster, and has led to people riding 50s, 125s, 150s, and larger without tags, license, and generally without a proper title or ownership documents either. The whole thing is simply ridiculous.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message [ Hidden ]
Lostmycage
FAQ Moderator


Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 4499
Location: The Interwebz!
Scootypuff Sr.

PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Excellent write up, Chelsea!
_________________
Check out Arrow Scoot Richmond's new site: My awesome local shop.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
siobhan
Member


Joined: 01 May 2008
Posts: 1331
Location: Providence, RI
many / most running

PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 7:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great write-up, Chelsea!

I would add:
Don't leave stuff in your scooter. Take your helmet and whatever other gear you wear with you. Less things you'll have to replace.

_________________
Fahr mit mir!
http://scootcommute.wordpress.com/
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message   Visit poster's website AIM Address
r0sa
Member


Joined: 12 Apr 2008
Posts: 1337
Location: Austin, TX
07 Buddy 125

PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

all of this was very informative chelsea, thanks for informing everyone Smile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message   AIM Address
Latch
Member


Joined: 03 Mar 2009
Posts: 83
Location: RVA
Rough House 50

PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 7:36 pm    Post subject: Re: thoughts on scooter theft (directors cut, aka long) Reply with quote

chelsea wrote:

For owners of 50cc vehicles in VA, this can be more difficult than you'd guess. A 50cc scooter is technically considered a moped rather than a motorcycle, so getting standard motorcycle coverage may or may not be possible. Call a company that specializes in recreational vehicles and they may tell you that they only cover things that happen in an offroad scenario. Try your home owners or renters insurance and they may only cover a theft if it occurs at your house. But as we've seen, most thefts DO occur at the owner's residence. Even though it's not the best most comprehensive coverage ever, it may be the best option for the time being. When inquiring, ask about coverage for a motorized bicycle because that's basically what they consider it.

.

First, nice write-up, very informative. Regarding getting insurance on a 50cc, I recommend Progressive, they offer up to full comprehensive coverage for all scooters including "moped" 50cc scoots, they even have all the Genuine models in their system. When I called to get coverage for my Rough House, they already knew what a Rough House was.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message   AIM Address
blue88
Member


Joined: 26 Feb 2009
Posts: 19


PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dumb ?
Any way to lockup the rear wheel? Seems like that being locked would make it harder than a locked up front.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
ScootStevie
Member


Joined: 22 Apr 2009
Posts: 645
Location: Long Beach, Rome, London (I don't know anymore)
'09 Blue 125 Buddy

PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice write up Very Happy I personally ALWAYS double lock my scoot. Hope you out in Richmond have success with your scoots.
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
chelsea
Dealer


Joined: 01 Aug 2007
Posts: 34
Location: richmond, va
small engines = big fun

PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 9:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

blue88 wrote:
Dumb ?
Any way to lockup the rear wheel? Seems like that being locked would make it harder than a locked up front.


I didn't mention the rear wheel because:
1. Some scooters do not have a rear wheel that can be locked through because the rim simply doesn't allow it. The Buddy 125/150s and Stellas come to mind.
2. The exhaust is hot. Really hot. The closer to the exhaust I get, the more likely I am to end up with a 3rd degree burn.
3. Locking through the rear wheel means that someone dicking about with your ignition switch may not see that the scoot is locked. We have had this happen several times, with the customer generally needing to replace the ignition switch (and potentially more than that) because the thief was too stupid to realize that there was a lock in place.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message [ Hidden ]
MrsLatch
Member


Joined: 01 Mar 2009
Posts: 124
Location: Richmond, VA
Rough House 50'

PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i was locking my scoot up via the rear wheel after a group ride and I burnt my thumb...................it hurt
_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message [ Hidden ] Visit poster's website AIM Address
ScootStevie
Member


Joined: 22 Apr 2009
Posts: 645
Location: Long Beach, Rome, London (I don't know anymore)
'09 Blue 125 Buddy

PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

MrsLatch wrote:
i was locking my scoot up via the rear wheel after a group ride and I burnt my thumb...................it hurt


Bleh

_________________
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
ericalm
Site Admin


Joined: 10 Jun 2006
Posts: 17502
Location: Los Angeles, CA
STELLA FOUR STROKE FURY! + Vespa LX 150/190 + '87 Honda Helix CN250

PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 11:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chelsea, thanks a billion for this. Unfortunately, RVA is not the only theft hotspot right now. It seems to be hitting several Mid-Atlantic and southern states as well as others.

The economy is having a weird effect right now. Aside from rising crime, we've seen some continued demand from scooters carrying over from last year, but buyers unable or unwilling to pay new scooter prices. The new scooter market is down, the legitimate used scooter market is depressed (compared to last year), but I suspect a lot of would-be buyers are hopping at "deals" without questioning their origin. So it's probably easier to move stolen scooters now than two years ago.

Also, what may have been a "safe" spot last year, may not be this year. After a daytime break in at my next door neighbor's house (they just walked in the backyard, right into his garage office and walked out with computers and other items), I've had to reconsider what was secure. I'm now using a Xena.

_________________
Eric // Flickr group // LA Scooter Meetup Group // twitter: @scooterism // ScooterFile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message [ Hidden ] Visit poster's website
robby
Member


Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 369
Location: Somerville, MA
2009 Roughhouse 50

PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 11:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for such an informative post.

I think the idea for a scooter registry is a great one. Something like NBR for scooters could be very helpful, and the mere sticker, if recognizable, could help to deter thieves. Check your PMs. Smile

--Robby
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
jijifer
Member


Joined: 30 Mar 2009
Posts: 1456
Location: Carlsbad, CA
Voodoo 2009 Buddy 125- aka 161

PostPosted: Mon Jul 20, 2009 11:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

robby wrote:
Thanks for such an informative post.

I think the idea for a scooter registry is a great one. Something like NBR for scooters could be very helpful, and the mere sticker, if recognizable, could help to deter thieves. Check your PMs. Smile

--Robby


and another thing I learned while working for Schwinn was to stuff your info in a ziploc bag down your tube. The idea being stashing/etching something identifiable that a thief wouldn't necessarily look for but would make it so you could be it IS my scooter- LOOK! there's ..... that proves it.

I'd suggest not telling or even agreeing on what that identifier be since thieves can be among the lurkers but it's something to consider it if you don't have register your scoot and VINs are being destroyed.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
reenie
Member


Joined: 23 Jul 2008
Posts: 15
Location: Richmond, VA
'08 Pamplona

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 2:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great info Chelsea! Made me stop and think about locking mine up more often.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Lostmycage
FAQ Moderator


Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 4499
Location: The Interwebz!
Scootypuff Sr.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 2:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arrow I've added a link to this post from the Guide/FAQ section. I'd like to put together a section in the FAQ about these sorts of topics, because questions about this do arise quite often. For now, this is an excellent start!


On a side note concerning theft, I wonder if there was a dressy way to remove the kickstart and replace it with a dummy knob or something. If a 250cc scoot can get away without a kickstart, I'm sure I'd be OK - the only times I've ever kicked was when I was priming the carb after a rejet or just screwing around to make sure I could kick it. Maybe something that looked like a ninja star or something would be kinda nifty.

_________________
Check out Arrow Scoot Richmond's new site: My awesome local shop.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
betsy q. bramble
Member


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 497
Location: portland, or
2008 buddy 150 italia

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 3:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

jeeez, i'm glad i don't live in richmond!

i've always been pretty annoyed by how difficult it seems to be to find a place to securely lock up my Buddy with my chain lock.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message   AIM Address
ericalm
Site Admin


Joined: 10 Jun 2006
Posts: 17502
Location: Los Angeles, CA
STELLA FOUR STROKE FURY! + Vespa LX 150/190 + '87 Honda Helix CN250

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 3:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

betsy q. bramble wrote:
jeeez, i'm glad i don't live in richmond!

i've always been pretty annoyed by how difficult it seems to be to find a place to securely lock up my Buddy with my chain lock.

Yup, no crime in Hartford from what I hear, right?

_________________
Eric // Flickr group // LA Scooter Meetup Group // twitter: @scooterism // ScooterFile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message [ Hidden ] Visit poster's website
Lostmycage
FAQ Moderator


Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 4499
Location: The Interwebz!
Scootypuff Sr.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 4:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's not all that bad. Some parts of town are nicer than others. My personal paranoia/over-cautiousness has proven to be perfectly adequate so far.

Then again, there are some parts of town I just won't go to, scooting or in a tank. I think most cities are like that though.... aren't they?

_________________
Check out Arrow Scoot Richmond's new site: My awesome local shop.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
r0sa
Member


Joined: 12 Apr 2008
Posts: 1337
Location: Austin, TX
07 Buddy 125

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 4:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

reading things like this makes me cringe, i can't wait till i move into my new apartment with a garage, until then, im hoping and praying that nobody will touch my baby
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message   AIM Address
chelsea
Dealer


Joined: 01 Aug 2007
Posts: 34
Location: richmond, va
small engines = big fun

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now, I personally have been riding scooters in Richmond for over 9 years, and I've never had a bike stolen. This is a result of me being overly paranoid at first, and then paying attention to all of the info I am able to collect because I hear *everybody's* stories. Therefore lots of this info is the result of years of anecdotes etc.

Thanks for bringing that up LMC, I nearly forgot two other points.

1. Once an automatic scooter is hotwired, the ONLY way to start it is to kickstart it. That means that large engine scooters without kickstart levers are less likely to be successfully stolen. It also means that kickstart lever removal MAY be an effective way to keep your scooter in your possession. The thief may not notice it is gone until the scooter is in the alley a block or two away, but if he can't start it, it's likely that he will ditch it.

This is still an experimental idea. I cannot vouch for its effectiveness quite yet.

2. It's relatively easy to install a secondary kill switch in most scooters. This is a factory item on many SYM models these days. Adding either a toggle switch or a keyed switch to the locked underseat bucket will keep the engine from running on AC power alone. AC power is the juice that the stator and stuff on your scoot's engine, and the AC power is totally unaffected by the removal of the DC power (aka the battery, which equals the electric start, horn, and some of the lights on your scoot). When the scooter is kickstarted, the engine runs off of the AC power it creates. Adding a kill switch to the underseat area makes it so that the engine will not run even if kickstarted, because the switch will not allow the AC power to connect to stuff like it needs to.

Again, this may not keep your scoot from being damaged and pushed around the corner and down the alley, but it's likely that it will be found dumped within a few blocks.

Lastly, you'll note that I've mentioned scooters being dumped in the course of an unsuccessful theft attempt several times. If your scooter DOES step out of your possession, make sure you comb the alleys of your neighborhood. Loads of scooters have been recovered in Richmond less than 4 blocks from the original parking space. Make fliers and give them to your neighbors in the event that someone else finds it first.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message [ Hidden ]
redcass
Member


Joined: 27 Aug 2007
Posts: 339
Location: philadelphia, pa
2007 Buddy SI 125

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 4:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've had my scooter for 2 yrs, and when I use my chain lock I put it around here (see photo). It's worked so far, but does anybody see any issues with this?

Thanks!

_________________
RedCass
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Lostmycage
FAQ Moderator


Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 4499
Location: The Interwebz!
Scootypuff Sr.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Spring is held on by one bolt. We've seen a lot more prepared theif around Richmond. If they case your scooter, they'll find out what size the bolt is and be prepared the next time they come.

For a general deterrent and to keep honest thieves at bay, the Spring works well. It's also a good place to lock to while out running quick errands and the like.

_________________
Check out Arrow Scoot Richmond's new site: My awesome local shop.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
CitizenX
Member


Joined: 03 Apr 2009
Posts: 31
Location: Richmond, the 804
Honda Ruckus...That's Right

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice write up Chelsea. Although only 50cc, I have my Ruckus fully licensed and insured (State Farm) because:

If stolen, it has plates and an inspection sticker.

It goes well over 35mph. If caught going over 35mph your 50cc is concidered a motorcycle and must be tagged and insured.

I got my M class license designation with my scooter.

If I do a 150cc motor swap, it is already considered a motorcycle.

_________________
...settle down there Frenchy
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
redcass
Member


Joined: 27 Aug 2007
Posts: 339
Location: philadelphia, pa
2007 Buddy SI 125

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 7:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lostmycage wrote:
The Spring is held on by one bolt. We've seen a lot more prepared theif around Richmond. If they case your scooter, they'll find out what size the bolt is and be prepared the next time they come.

For a general deterrent and to keep honest thieves at bay, the Spring works well. It's also a good place to lock to while out running quick errands and the like.


Do you mean the red part is on by 1 bolt or the post it wraps around? I attach my chain at the top around the black post the red spring wraps around. (Sorry don't know what it's called.)

What's a better place to secure a large heavy chain lock? I've heard lots of ideas about where NOT TO secure it, but I'd like to hear some more about where TO secure it. Thanks.

_________________
RedCass
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Lostmycage
FAQ Moderator


Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 4499
Location: The Interwebz!
Scootypuff Sr.

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can't offer a pic right now (We sold the Buddy a while ago) but the best place I found to lock it to is the frame right above the centerstand. With it on the centerstand, get on the ground next to it and look at where the stand bolts on. Right above that is a cross frame.

I locked it to that since it can't be unbolted, nor easily gotten to for that matter. It's not the most conveinient place to lock to, but it's the most secure that I've found. Don't bother trying to get a chain around it, but the U-bar will loop up over it relatively easily (once you get the hang of it).

One note of caution: the exhaust is really close to that bar (it's on the right hand side of the scooter), so watch your fingers. It's best to lock it on the left side of the scooter.

_________________
Check out Arrow Scoot Richmond's new site: My awesome local shop.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
betsy q. bramble
Member


Joined: 16 Jun 2008
Posts: 497
Location: portland, or
2008 buddy 150 italia

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 10:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

betsy q. bramble wrote:
even in hartford i don't have to be THAT paranoid.


I should rephrase that...I don't mean paranoid...that isn't fair. I mean cautious. Obviously it isn't just paranoia in Richmond if there is this serious wave of crime.


Last edited by betsy q. bramble on Tue Jul 21, 2009 11:29 pm; edited 1 time in total
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message   AIM Address
rvajma
Member


Joined: 14 May 2009
Posts: 59
Location: Richmond, VA
2009 Blackjack

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My kick-start delete solution
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Syd
Member


Joined: 18 Jul 2007
Posts: 3882
Location: Tempe
BV350

PostPosted: Tue Jul 21, 2009 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lostmycage wrote:
For a general deterrent and to keep honest thieves at bay

Nice line LMC.

_________________
Get off the phone and get on the gas.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Alix B
Member


Joined: 10 Jul 2007
Posts: 656
Location: Richmond, VA
Buddy125

PostPosted: Wed Jul 22, 2009 12:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Fantastic write up Chelsea. Yet again, you prove you are my hero.

I live in RVA and use the Xena. (Thanks polianarchy!)
I set it off intentionally sometimes just so my neighbors know what I'm working with.

I'm really sorry for any RVA peeps who have had their scoots jacked. This is sad news.

Of course, I doubt many thieves want a Buddy with hundreds of signatures and 23,000 miles, BUT....you never know...and I'm not tempting fate....

Lock it UP!

_________________
www.peacescooter.com
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message [ Hidden ]
ScooterSkater
Member


Joined: 04 Aug 2009
Posts: 7
Location: Greenpoint, Brooklyn, NY
Buddy International St. Tropez

PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2009 1:38 am    Post subject: I needed that Reply with quote

I think I nearly got my scooter stolen this weekend (I posted about it Aug 3rd). After posting, I read your article. Thank you very much.

Mean people suck.

Nicola
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Kaos
Member


Joined: 19 May 2008
Posts: 4881
Location: Portland, OR
'08 vOoDoO Buddy 270cc,'74 Vespa Super with 200cc Rally180 Engine, '89 Honda CB-1 400cc Cafe

PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2009 1:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alix B wrote:
Fantastic write up Chelsea. Yet again, you prove you are my hero.

I live in RVA and use the Xena. (Thanks polianarchy!)
I set it off intentionally sometimes just so my neighbors know what I'm working with.

I'm really sorry for any RVA peeps who have had their scoots jacked. This is sad news.

Of course, I doubt many thieves want a Buddy with hundreds of signatures and 23,000 miles, BUT....you never know...and I'm not tempting fate....

Lock it UP!


Hey, *I* would love to have your scoot Wink

Granted I somehow doubt a thief would know your scoot's awesome history Razz

_________________
Checkout Voodoo Buddy for current mods.

Current Top speed:88MPH
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
polianarchy
Moderator


Joined: 04 Dec 2006
Posts: 2438
Location: SJCA
'14 Stellamatic & '06 Buddy 125 & '78 Vespa P200E

PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2009 8:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

rvajma wrote:
My kick-start delete solution


Is this reversible? Like, do you stow your kick lever in the pet carrier in case your fuse is blown or something? I've actually needed to use my kickstart a few times.

_________________
ModBud #442
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message   Visit poster's website
rvajma
Member


Joined: 14 May 2009
Posts: 59
Location: Richmond, VA
2009 Blackjack

PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2009 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Completely reversible. I took off the kick-start lever and pit it and the corresponding allen wrench in the critter carrier. The cover is just a foam eight ball from MINI that comes right off. It is just a visual deterrent, since if they got into the trunk, they would find it.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
BootScootin'FireFighter
Member


Joined: 19 Jul 2009
Posts: 2062
Location: (Metro DC) Alexandria, Virginia
2012 Suzuki TU250x

PostPosted: Tue Aug 10, 2010 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Chelsea, if you're still active on here and read this. I'll contact ScootRichmond with my specifics. Even though I'm in NoVA, maybe you can put the word out in RVA for my wife's Buddy.

The reason I'm resurrecting this thread (thanks Eric for the think), is because there are many new members on here recently who like myself may not have read this valuable advice until now.

_________________


DC Scooter Group

Scootercannonball 2012 blog
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message   Visit poster's website
zombrii
Member


Joined: 24 Aug 2010
Posts: 7
Location: West Seattle
'07 Red Buddy 125 named "Dolly"

PostPosted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 7:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Earlier this year I had my little old ('91) yamaha zuma stolen. I assumed because it was old and not a sought after scooter (in terms of vintage-ness..is that a word??) that it would be safe. But if it's out there and an easy steal, it WILL get taken. I most certainly wont make that mistake with my Buddy! Thanks for posting this!
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message   Visit poster's website AIM Address
bigbropgo
Member


Joined: 31 Jul 2008
Posts: 1646
Location: gotham city and the 801
pgo pmx, cousin to the rattler

PostPosted: Tue Aug 24, 2010 7:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zombrii wrote:
Earlier this year I had my little old ('91) yamaha zuma stolen. I assumed because it was old and not a sought after scooter (in terms of vintage-ness..is that a word??) that it would be safe. But if it's out there and an easy steal, it WILL get taken. I most certainly wont make that mistake with my Buddy! Thanks for posting this!


Welcome to the modernbuddy family. Enjoy and ride safe.

_________________
no i don't ride a scooter, i am a scooter pilot!

VICTUS MORTUUS VENATOR
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
rv-rick
Member


Joined: 01 Aug 2010
Posts: 37
Location: VA

PostPosted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lostmycage wrote:
I can't offer a pic right now (We sold the Buddy a while ago) but the best place I found to lock it to is the frame right above the centerstand. With it on the centerstand, get on the ground next to it and look at where the stand bolts on. Right above that is a cross frame.

I locked it to that since it can't be unbolted, nor easily gotten to for that matter. It's not the most conveinient place to lock to, but it's the most secure that I've found. Don't bother trying to get a chain around it, but the U-bar will loop up over it relatively easily (once you get the hang of it).

One note of caution: the exhaust is really close to that bar (it's on the right hand side of the scooter), so watch your fingers. It's best to lock it on the left side of the scooter.


Using this idea, would it be possible to weld a piece of plate steel to the frame that would stick down ~2 inches with a hole big enough to pass a chain or U-lock through? It could be awkward enough for a thief to have second thoughts about trying to break it off. Just wondering.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Stormswift
Member


Joined: 07 Nov 2009
Posts: 1309
Location: Maryland
Prozac 150 cc/aka Buddy Itallia

PostPosted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 12:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I wrap the chain around the middle of the scooter and make sure there is no slack left. There is also Xena in the front and wire lock on a back tire. If someone wants to they will get through all of that but it will take too much time and they want to grab and ran quick. So all of the measures I have taken are deterrents that would make my scooter less "appealing". I am one of the lucky ones, thanks to Xena alarm . They left my scooter on its side right next to my car. It was parked in front of the car before, had cover on and was not that visible so it WAS cased. At that point I was only riding around my development, nice residential middle class neighborhood. So I know it was someone in the development. This means my scooter is never safe. They would be looking for me to make a mistake. They know it is alarmed now but I know they are watching,
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
the3rdleonard
Member


Joined: 25 Oct 2010
Posts: 20
Location: Lexington, KY
2008 Buddy 125

PostPosted: Fri Dec 31, 2010 5:28 am    Post subject: Lock size Reply with quote

Great write up! Thank you for the knowledge, I'm still so new to all this and some of what you point out [and most of the reply posts] really got me thinking about safety. You point out that with a Buddy 125 a 5mm lock will work, what about a 10mm? Is that too big?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
BlueMark
Member


Joined: 30 Oct 2006
Posts: 545
Location: Toledo, OH
Genuine Blur (RIP)

PostPosted: Fri Dec 31, 2010 1:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's what I'd lock to:
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
michelle_7728
Member


Joined: 12 Jun 2009
Posts: 1914
Location: Renton, WA

PostPosted: Fri Dec 31, 2010 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow Chelsea, I hadn't seen this thread until now. Very informative!

I currently use the column lock, cable through the front tire and around the place where you put your feet, then around a post or column (wrapping the cable around itself so there is no slack), then put my Xena on the front tire.

However, I wonder now if a chain is the better thing to do. May have to give it some thought.

Also, I do keep my Buddy in our shed sometimes, though:
* The column lock is engaged
* I have a cable wrapped around the foot area of the scooter, then the cable wrapped around itself to take up slack, then the cable looped through the second up of our metal shelving (so assuming they don't have bolt cutters, they'd need to disassemble two metal shelves full of stuff, ie heavy or time consuming to empty, and it's a small shed so where to empty it and still have room to move the scooter...?).
* Door is padlocked
* SMALL (can't climb through) windows are covered so you can't see inside.
* Padlock on gate to back yard.
* Big recycling, yard waste and trash bins blocking easy access to side yard leading to back yard.

So they would really have to want the scooter badly to go through all that to get it. Smile

However, sometimes I keep it (along with our other scooters) in the garage, where we just use the column lock.

We recently got our regular bi-monthly report from the police stating that in October 5 out of the 20 local robberies were forced entry, but in November 15 out of the 20 local robberies were forced entry. Shocked

This tells me that we need to start using more than column locks in the garage. Maybe installing lockpoints in the garage floor we can chain the scooters to. Until then, cabling/chaining them all together is better than nothing, I guess... Rolling Eyes

Regarding the post before this one...it's too cold to go out to the shed and look: Is that bolt something that a sledgehammer could break off, or a hacksaw could be used on? If not, then it does look like a good place to lock to.

_________________
Past bikes: 08' Genuine Buddy 125, '07 Yamaha Majesty 400, '07 Piaggio MP3 250, '08 Piaggio MP3 500
Current bikes: Two '09 Genuine Buddy 125's, '08 Aprilia Scrabeo 500ie.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
killbilly
Member


Joined: 09 Jul 2010
Posts: 392
Location: Austin, TX
Blur220i

PostPosted: Fri Dec 31, 2010 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This might sound silly, but I have one thing to contribute....

If possible or feasible, run two disc locks and hide one.

It's possible to stuff a wad of chewing gum into the sound hole on a Xena and it DRASTICALLY diminishes the noisemaking ability.

With two, it's a little harder to a) find the hidden one and b) it buys you some time while the thief (if he was smart enough) chews up another piece to stuff in the hole.

I know it sounds silly, but could work.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
BootScootin'FireFighter
Member


Joined: 19 Jul 2009
Posts: 2062
Location: (Metro DC) Alexandria, Virginia
2012 Suzuki TU250x

PostPosted: Sat Jan 01, 2011 3:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

michelle_7728 wrote:
We recently got our regular bi-monthly report from the police stating that in October 5 out of the 20 local robberies were forced entry, but in November 15 out of the 20 local robberies were forced entry. Shocked
Did they specify what was taken during the robberies? Reason I'm asking is scooter thieves often times case out what they're looking for and have a means of getting away, either hotwiring or in a van/pickup. Many of the local burglaries around here are smash and grabs. Junkies who need small goods they can stash in backpacks, get away on foot, and pawn off for their next dope fix.
_________________


DC Scooter Group

Scootercannonball 2012 blog
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message   Visit poster's website
redhandmoto
Member


Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 250
Location: NoVA
whole buncha things...

PostPosted: Sat Jan 01, 2011 4:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Our scoots stay in a locked (and alarmed) shed behind a locked fence, but in prime riding months, we like to have one just outside our side entrance for quick trips and errands. This area is also surrounded by a six-foot fence, but that won't slow thieves down much.

The solution was to make a "tie-down" point. We sank a three foot steel pipe into the ground, all but the top buried in concrete. The top is a "tee" junction of 2 1/2 inches inside diameter, threaded and welded onto the buried pipe.

We pass a Krypto chain & lock through the tee to tie the bike down, and throw a tarp over all to keep the dew off. Stealing it would require a long session with a carbide saw; even deaf as I am, the racket would quickly be noticed.

Easy-on, easy-off; so far, so good.

_________________
I'm Swiss on that.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
michelle_7728
Member


Joined: 12 Jun 2009
Posts: 1914
Location: Renton, WA

PostPosted: Sat Jan 01, 2011 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

BootScootin'FireFighter wrote:
michelle_7728 wrote:
We recently got our regular bi-monthly report from the police stating that in October 5 out of the 20 local robberies were forced entry, but in November 15 out of the 20 local robberies were forced entry. Shocked
Did they specify what was taken during the robberies? Reason I'm asking is scooter thieves often times case out what they're looking for and have a means of getting away, either hotwiring or in a van/pickup. Many of the local burglaries around here are smash and grabs. Junkies who need small goods they can stash in backpacks, get away on foot, and pawn off for their next dope fix.


In most cases it was a laptop, camera, jewelry, tv, game console, or DVD player. Only in one case was a vehicle stolen. I guess the fact that most are now forced entries is what's really getting to me. It tells me that they are getting more brazen.

We have an alarm, and use visible wedged door and window bars, but I'm always worried someone will break in anyway. Aside from the scooters, I worry about our Bostons if we weren't home to protect them. Sad

_________________
Past bikes: 08' Genuine Buddy 125, '07 Yamaha Majesty 400, '07 Piaggio MP3 250, '08 Piaggio MP3 500
Current bikes: Two '09 Genuine Buddy 125's, '08 Aprilia Scrabeo 500ie.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
ericalm
Site Admin


Joined: 10 Jun 2006
Posts: 17502
Location: Los Angeles, CA
STELLA FOUR STROKE FURY! + Vespa LX 150/190 + '87 Honda Helix CN250

PostPosted: Sat Jan 01, 2011 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

redhandmoto wrote:
Our scoots stay in a locked (and alarmed) shed behind a locked fence, but in prime riding months, we like to have one just outside our side entrance for quick trips and errands. This area is also surrounded by a six-foot fence, but that won't slow thieves down much.

The solution was to make a "tie-down" point. We sank a three foot steel pipe into the ground, all but the top buried in concrete. The top is a "tee" junction of 2 1/2 inches inside diameter, threaded and welded onto the buried pipe.

We pass a Krypto chain & lock through the tee to tie the bike down, and throw a tarp over all to keep the dew off. Stealing it would require a long session with a carbide saw; even deaf as I am, the racket would quickly be noticed.

Easy-on, easy-off; so far, so good.

I'd love to see a pic of this if you get the chance!

Kryptonite and others make anchors that work pretty much like your DIY solution. Some have the advantage of being less obtrusive than something sticking up from the ground.

_________________
Eric // Flickr group // LA Scooter Meetup Group // twitter: @scooterism // ScooterFile
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message [ Hidden ] Visit poster's website
redhandmoto
Member


Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 250
Location: NoVA
whole buncha things...

PostPosted: Sat Jan 01, 2011 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ericalm wrote:
I'd love to see a pic of this if you get the chance!

Kryptonite and others make anchors that work pretty much like your DIY solution. Some have the advantage of being less obtrusive than something sticking up from the ground.



Sure thing - here 'tis, between the pavers outside our side door, ready to have the Krypto passed through. A very cheap-o solution.

A tad overbuilt: didn't really need all that concrete, and an 18" pipe would have been enough. The biggest cost - $15 - was having the tee fitting welded to the end - actually, I had tees welded-on at both ends so that the pipe couldn't be turned out of the lump of concrete.

Doesn't get in the way of lawnmowers or anything; I ride right over it all the time... if I were a scoot thief, I'd find this depressing...



_________________
I'm Swiss on that.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Lostmycage
FAQ Moderator


Joined: 17 Jun 2008
Posts: 4499
Location: The Interwebz!
Scootypuff Sr.

PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2011 6:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's clever, but don't they make a threaded "T" fitting that would make the welding a non-issue?

This is a really clean solution. I like it even better than the Omega shaped rebar anchor that I have next to my patio slab.

Well done.

_________________
Check out Arrow Scoot Richmond's new site: My awesome local shop.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
redhandmoto
Member


Joined: 01 Jul 2008
Posts: 250
Location: NoVA
whole buncha things...

PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2011 6:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lostmycage wrote:
That's clever, but don't they make a threaded "T" fitting that would make the welding a non-issue?

This is a really clean solution. I like it even better than the Omega shaped rebar anchor that I have next to my patio slab.

Well done.


Thanks!

Yep; and that tee is indeed threaded onto the pipe - it was also welded in place to prevent it's being "unthreaded", and thus ridden/pushed away with!

If, for instance, we were out for the afternoon and had left one of the lighter bikes locked to the tie-down, two thieves, or even one, if determined, could just pick up the bike and unthread the tee with the chain/lock in place...

_________________
I'm Swiss on that.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
jasondavis48108
Member


Joined: 24 Apr 2009
Posts: 2943
Location: Ann Arbor
2010 Honda sh150i

PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2011 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

redhandmoto wrote:
Lostmycage wrote:
That's clever, but don't they make a threaded "T" fitting that would make the welding a non-issue?

This is a really clean solution. I like it even better than the Omega shaped rebar anchor that I have next to my patio slab.

Well done.


Thanks!

Yep; and that tee is indeed threaded onto the pipe - it was also welded in place to prevent it's being "unthreaded", and thus ridden/pushed away with!

If, for instance, we were out for the afternoon and had left one of the lighter bikes locked to the tie-down, two thieves, or even one, if determined, could just pick up the bike and unthread the tee with the chain/lock in place...


That's a really nice system you have there. One thing I would say though, is that you still can't beat really good insurance. I saw a video (posted here somewhere I think) where they tested various motorcycle chain locks and the longest any of them lasted was about 50 seconds against a good cable cutter. I think the kryptonite ny fahgettaboudit lasted all of about 40 seconds. No chain can stand up against those big arse cable cutters and the sad thing is that most of them were rated to be able to resist cutting for several minutes. None of then lasted anywhere near that long. I do have to say though that it seems like your system would deter all but the most determined thief. I might have to think about something like this for my fenced in back yard.

_________________
"Only the curious have, if they live, a tale worth telling at all" Alastair Reid
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message  
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   Reply to topic    Forums » General Discussion Previous topic :: Next topic  Time: GMT
Goto page 1, 2  Next

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
You cannot attach files in this forum
You cannot download files in this forum

  Scootergear designed by riders for riders


Powered by phpBB © 2001, 2005 phpBB Group
All Content Copyright 2007-2011 by Modern Buddy. All Rights Reserved.