Stella 4T 2010 is GO! for CA

[ericalm]

The executive order from California's stringent and pokey Air Resources Board has been issued, paving the way for sales of the 2010 Stella 4T.

Of ye of little faith: It's coming and it's coming this year.

http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/onroad/cert/hmc/2010/genuinescooter_m1460010_148_1d0_h.pdf

The Stella performed well below the limits set by the state for emissions. As odd as it may seem, the Stella 4T will likely be Genuine's "greenest" model, with 130 MPG and lower emissions than many other carbed models on the road.

I'm pretty excited about this. The Stella was the scooter I would have bought instead of my Vespa if it'd been available new in CA at that time. There's a good chance this will wind up in the stable.

[jijifer]

HURRAY! will kits for 2 strokes work for 4 stroke? isn't there like 190cc kit for the 2 stroke?

[Lostmycage]

[jijifer]

[rsrider]

Another option when I move up to a larger displacement scooter. I still like the Buddy's look though, so it will be a tough decision.

[laxer]

[bigbropgo]

I thought the reason many fell in love with it was that it was a twist n go. I'm still waiting for the MSRP. if its not to bad I might sell a kidney and get one.

[laxer]

[Lostmycage]

By all accounts (including 2StrokeBuzz!) It's a 4T shifter that's specced at 130 mpg. This one's going on my list!

[KRUSTYburger]

WOOHOO!

[Kaos]

[KCScooterDude]

I might put one in the garage. I've been looking for an '80s PX to totally rebuild, but why make more work for yourself? I figure the 4T Stella would have better reliability, but still need a bit of know-how to keep in tip top shape, which is what I am aiming for. There is plenty of bolt-on stuff to buy and play around with in the garage. Right now I'd like a classic scooter, a Majesty or Burgman for commuting and a Vulcan cruiser in my dream garage. The cage can live outside.

FYI, I'm taking this motorcycle repair class at the local CC. My instructor is a scooter guy. Even owns a Doodlebug, if you know what those are. He has or has owned everything from a Harley scooter to Allstates and currently has a Burgman (I think I have it right) with a sidecar. I've got a ton of projects planned for my GS50 (I'm veering off into NBR/NSR land here, sorry). I'm going to wrap the headers this weekend and black out the mid-pipe and muffler.

Ah, sorry. I'm watching Jimmy Fallon and just feel like rambling for some reason. Maybe it's that KFC I had for dinner.

[ericalm]

Very shifty.

No upgrade kits for this engine yet. LML has a 200cc engine that will be available as a separate part, but I don't know if Scooterworks will carry it.

Make no mistake: This is not going to be a speed demon of a scooter. Those who gripe about a 55mph top speed are, IMHO, full of beans, so to speak. A Stella 2T or P150 will top out at 60! None of them belong on the freeway. So what difference does it make?

I'm not certain of pricing yet, but my guess is it'll probably be a little more than the 2T ($3600).

[DennisD]

130mpg??? Hmm. Uhh, well, umm, ya know, I might just change my mind. 130mpgt?????? Uhoh, I'm gettin' that itch again!

[bigbropgo]

D'oh! Shifty it is. 130mpg is pretty amazing by any standard. Be nice if the mph where at least half that.

[pcbikedude]

FYI, 130mpg is a big boast. Just for a point of reference, the real world mpg will vary greatly ex. the Bajaj Chetak 150cc 4T gets about 90mpg in the same design footprint.

But it should be a fun ride.

[BuddyRaton]

Just remember that the Stella is going to be a completley different scooter than a Buddy. Different handling, suspension, braking, power and with a lot less storage.

I must admit that I am still a bit conflicted about a 4T "classic" scooter being the 2T kinda guy I am! If you want one...great!...just be aware of what you are getting into!

In my opinion as a daily all around scooter the Buddy is still the best bang for the buck!

[Anachronism]

[Kaos]

[Anachronism]

[illnoise]

Awesome, thanks for the news, Eric!

Posted some of my brilliant insight (snarf) here:

http://2strokebuzz.com/2010/02/02/carb-approves-stella-150-4t

[bigbropgo]

[Anachronism]

[illnoise]

I really don't think there were many people "intimidated by a 2-stroke," while a 4T is easier to maintain in the short run, a 2T certainly has its merits, long-term maintenance is easier, the design is simpler, parts availability is amazing…

The 4-stroke has two benefits, one a result of the other: It is more technologically efficient and thus runs cleaner than the 2stroke, which only a small group of rabid environmentalists* and gas penny pinchers** will care about. As a result of that , though, it's legal in California (and Europe), which opens up the Stella (and LML Star) to a huge target audience of vintage-style scooter lovers in sunny climes who were unable to buy the 2T version because of local emissions regulations. Those people would have owned a Stella years ago, if they'd had the opportunity.

* I'm not knocking the environment, and I'm glad standards are improving, but I see that as a hive-mind decision that's thankfully enforced by governments, and given a choice, most individuals wouldn't make responsible choices in that regard, i.e. there aren't many people who buy a motor vehicle with environmental impact as their primary concern.

As far as gas savings, I've long argued that people use that as a misguided excuse to justify a scooter purchase, rather than a real economic argument. Fuel efficiency savings level off at about 60mpg, and over that, you're not really saving much more money see:
http://2strokebuzz.com/2008/06/22/more-mpg-math
When you factor in the costs of buying, insuring, maintaining a scooter, and it's useful life, it's not saving any money unless you're buying it INSTEAD of a car.
and

[PeterC]

I love my 2005 Stella. I love the shifting, the smoke and the smell, the (Sito+ enhanced) sound and the traditional look. That said, I'm also quite attached to my 2009 Vespa GTS 250. It's a lot less fatiguing on longer rides, smoother, quieter, faster and more powerful. Two different scooters, two completely different personalities. Vive le difference!

[ericalm]

There were plenty of rumors the couple years or so about various engines showing up in the 4T Stella (Kymco and SYM) and I'm sure that was explored but I think the engine is actually from LML. I don't think it's a straight port of the 2T 150. If so, they probably wouldn't have had to lengthen and re-engineer the back end.

LML had a 4T Star a few years ago that went into the existing Star/Stella body. It had very limited distribution and its performance was supposedly not great. Genuine and LML have spent a few years working together to create the new Star/Stella 4T. If it had been an easy process, I assure you Genuine would have had a 4T Stella out as soon as LML went back into production after the strike there ended.

The plus is that the new design will accommodate a much larger, injected 4T engine. The rumor from a dealer in the UK is that LML will have a 200 next year, injected models in 2011/12 and eventually have a 250 and an automatic version. He says he got this straight from LML but you know how that goes. Another strike, another severe downturn in the industry, change in company goals… who knows?

[brape]

[TVB]

[brape]

[rondothemidget]

[laxer]

Maybe this means I can get a 2-stroker real cheap in the coming years!

[JSharpPhoto]

[laxer]

[ericalm]

Well… The 2T version will still be available in most states for at least a year. Whether they manage to retain value over time remains to be seen. As is, you can get a good, fairly low-mileage used Stella for around $2500 or so now. It'll be a while before prices really start to come down. It'll never retain its value as well as a P-series Vespa but I don't think they'll be dirt cheap either.

But pricier than a Bajaj, for sure.

[laxer]

[TVB]

[laxer]

Sorry, when I said "save on gas," I meant they were looking to cut their costs, it was all about saving money. But, like I said, I'm sure that it didn't hurt that the cars are "green."

[Kaos]

[pocphil]

The Stella 4T's were on our 2010 Order sheet and it looks like availability will be in April.

I've ordered a pile of them. If they actually arrive in April it will be an absolute coup in the scooter industry. A scooter that arrived and launched when it said it would.

Performance parts WILL show up for the Stella 4T, it's just a matter of time and market demand.

I think it's a great Idea, it has the front disk the Chetak was always lacking, the classic style, the excellent parts support and a ready accessory supply.

I also agree that the 2T Stella's remaining will be sold at a premium. The first time the Stella went away we saw dealers selling available bikes at $500 over MSRP.

[Anachronism]

[ericalm]

There's a whole psychology behind who buys something like the Prius and why. While buyers may have some overarching concern for the environment, that's usually not the only motivation for buying one. I think it's pretty safe to say that if the Prius looked like a Yaris, wasn't so well-marketed and didn't have such a high trendiness factor, it wouldn't have been so successful. I think we can also assume that the overwhelming majority of Prius owners don't have solar panels on their house, aren;t collecting rain water for their lawns, composting, or only buying sustainable and organic foods and household products. Their commitment is usually limited to the hybrid car, recycling, voting and shopping at Whole Foods.

I'm not saying they're hypocrites, just that—like most of us—they care about the environment but their actions on its behalf are limited by practicality, time, cost, and so on.

Environmental benefits, on their own, are rarely sufficient to motivate sales. They need to be combined with design, functionality, ease of use and the right price point. Consumers want to be green, but any inconvenience or sacrifice involved in owning and using a green product has to be offset by other benefits. Some of these are tangible (save at the pump), others less so (brag about your MPGs, social status).

Of course, that's pretty much true for all consumer products, but I think the balance between tangible and intangible benefits is more important when it comes to anything sold as being "green." For the most part, modern scooters tend to favor the less practical benefits. Cost savings aren't that high unless you're getting rid of a car or buying a scooter instead of one but they're fun as hell to ride, come with social benefits and are cool (in some circles).

But ratchet up the practical benefits (to, say, 130mpg), with little sacrifice (a little slower, lower top speed, higher but not ridiculously higher price point) in a more appealing package than most (the classic P-series design) and I think you've got a winner.

[illnoise]

[illnoise]

[Kaos]