No respect for scooters

[mukaiboston]

Seriously, I'm beginning to believe that a lot of motorists don't actually consider scooters to be legit vehicles despite having a license plate.

Multiple times, I've been on a one-lane road, usually going higher than the speed limit, and someone is trying to pass me on the double-yellow line. A few times I've almost hit people because I did not see them trying to squeeze in next to me even though there is clearly not enough room in a lane for both of us.

A scary event happened tonight when I was making a left turn at an intersection. The car behind me accelerated trying to pass me on the left. We were making a left hand turn and I was not expecting to see a car in my way. Unfortunately for him, I was going to fast for him and he didn't make it and was forced to fall back in line after me.

[ericalm]

Seriously, I'm beginning to believe that a lot of motorists don't actually consider scooters to be legit vehicles despite having a license plate.

That's pretty much the case. You can be going 15mph over the limit and some jerkhole will be tailgating you

Stay alert and ride safe!

[Dr. Rock]

Yah for sure, I have had some hard lessons lately that we don't exist on the road. KEEP YOUR EYES OPEN!!!!! safe travels =)

[Keys]

I think it's just an ego thing. "I CAN'T allow a SCOOTER to be in front of ME!!"

--Keys

[dawg onit]

A scary event happened tonight when I was making a left turn at an intersection. The car behind me accelerated trying to pass me on the left. We were making a left hand turn and I was not expecting to see a car in my way. Unfortunately for him, I was going to fast for him and he didn't make it and was forced to fall back in line after me.

What I have learned here...
Let them pass
Let them think they are cool
Its not fun unless you live to talk about it
Dress for A holes
Don't f*** with Jesus
I am having fun on my scooter, I won't let this idiot ruin it

Glad you are all good!

[JHScoot]

i'm not sure if i have been disrespected on the road yet. but i have begun to leave traffic behind at lights in gridlock. i just slide right up to the front of the line and go heavy throttle as soon as the light changes. i think thats cool

i do pay attention to how traffic has been moving before i do it, though. and i wouldn't try to beat a car that looks like a speed demon might be in it. mustangs, sports cars, etc. but the average compact or family sedan? i just blow right past them and get out in front of 'em

i had one guy from a passenger seat of a daewoo yell sarcastically out his window "cool scooter, 'bro!" as the driver made a left turn. this was when i first started riding. i caught them at the next light and the guy was all wife beater t shirt, tattoos up and down, smoking a cig. i looked in the car and said "it does ok." he looked at my scoot and smirked "yeah not bad. what do you have in there? a V8? i just laughed and said "i'll race you to the next light." he looked at the girl driving and said "alright lets smoke it"

stupid little 81hp car with about 600 pounds worth of passengers. i thought it was going to blow up from the sound it was making as i left it behind

yeah it was my first scooter drag race. i laughed and laughed for a few blocks after that

[jasondavis48108]

I'm not saying I havn't had a few issues here and there, but for the most part folks are fine when I'm on my sh150i. They sometimes got a bit testy when I would ride my Buddy 50 on 45-55mph roads but then I would just pull over when I could which would remedy the situation.

One thing I have learned is that its not a good idea to shout back to folks, even if you think they deserve it. Your on a 230lb scooter and they are in a several thousand lb car. They have the upper hand and its best to keep hot headed drivers in front of you anyway so let them pass and don't worry about it.

As for the whole people don't respect scooters thing. I didn't buy the scooters so folks would respect me. I bought them cause they are fun as hell to ride. If some idiot wants to yell out fag or "nice scooter Ahole" or any of the many insults some of us have heard who gives a F*ck. Most of the time its just some D-bag in a beat up sedan trying to prove to is friends or girl friend that he's a bad ass. Silly really

[Stormswift]

Disrespect? Yep, you bet. Plenty of it. They get especially nasty when they see a female rider. Must be a testosterone overload. I am too new to riding. When I see jerks riding my tail I pull over if I can and let them pass even when I know I am going at or above speed limit. Not worth having an accident. Some cagers out there just cannot tolerate driving behind anyone. They will cut you off, get in front of you even if you are driving a truck. Some folks have issues that go beyond that and really should not be allowed to drive. The fact is they are on the road. In addition to personality issues consider that in our society many people drive with chemicals in their systems, both legal and illegal. Even with simple cold meds you can have serious judgement impairments. Then you have various diet pills, too much coffee, stress, sense of entitlement - and watch out. I get nervous driving my car sometimes I was out riding a road with curves that clearly state 20 mph and show curve sign. This part of the road is really dangerous because the curves are sharp and short and change directions one after another. The moron behind me yelled obscenities when he passed me illegally at the light after we came out of the portion of the road with curves. I did what any dignified lady who is out riding would do: ignored the moron.

[TVB]

Disrespect? Yep, you bet. Plenty of it. They get especially nasty when they see a female rider.

That sword can swing either way. Testosterone poisoning can lead to hostility, but at lower doses it can trigger the "chicks are nice" reflex, which can get you out of the line of fire.

[KABarash]

making a left turn at an intersection. The car behind me accelerated trying to pass me on the left. We were making a left hand turn .

Same scenario happened to me the other evening, except I let him pass, a 'Bubba' in a puck up. I was pelted with empty beer cans as well. I followed the S-O-B for the next 3 or so miles with my highbeam right in his mirror.....
I see this particular truck in the parking lot at the VFW frequently, it's amazing what a small pocket wire cutter can do to valve stems...

[Rippinyarn]

I agree - little to no respect for a scooter, but this post might help... it's long, but possesses more than a dollop of schadenfreude:
Just this morning I was happily scooting my way to downtown Detroit. Traffic rather heavy, I took my alternate route winding south on mostly back roads east of Woodward. As I was heading back to Woodward, I pulled up at a red light meaning to go forward under a train overpass, but saw that there was significant water over the road from the rain last night. Probably 6-8 inches of water, so there was no way I was going through it on the Bajaj. I was the first vehicle at the intersection and was in the "command" position, slightly to the left in the single lane. A car pulled up on my right, turning right, I thought. It was a hearse, one of those wagon-converted ones with the rear as a closed metal pod type of thing. It was immaculate, and began creeping forward. I changed my mind about going forward and turned my right blinker on, ready to slot in and follow the hearse through the right turn. I then realized that he was going straight (from the right portion of the single lane) and was going to "race" me off the line to pass me. I though about warning him of the water that he obviously didn't see, but as he was creeping by to get the jump, I decided to let him go. The light turned green and he roared off, down the incline to the watery underpass. I didn't wait to hear the splash. I smiled and completed my right turn, as the next driver paused to let me go.

So yeah, no respect, but we get ours back every once in a while

[mukaiboston]

stupid little 81hp car with about 600 pounds worth of passengers. i thought it was going to blow up from the sound it was making as i left it behind

This is hilarious. I think a lot of cagers are not familiar with how fast scooters can drive.

[loodieboy]

All too frequently I have had people pass me on the double yellow, tailgate, deliberately encroach into my lane, etc. etc. It's just a pisser and, unfortunately, part of riding (the same thing happens sometimes when I am driving my Smart car).

I think it comes down to one of two things: 1) some people, far more important than you, believe that you will delay them in reaching their far more important destinations, and / or 2) some people feel compelled to demonstrate the obvious inferiority of both you and your chosen mode of transportation, a fact you otherwise are too stupid to grasp. Come on, a scooter???!!!

[sunshinen]

That's pretty much the case. You can be going 15mph over the limit and some jerkhole will be tailgating you

Stay alert and ride safe!

I think it's just an ego thing. "I CAN'T allow a SCOOTER to be in front of ME!!"

Of course, these are also true of other cars. Some egos just can't handle ANYONE being in front of them, find they have to go 50mph over the limit to make up for not being loved enough as a child, and must take their anger out on anyone (such as a scooter) who is obviously questioning their masculinity.

Ride like you got nothing to prove — because you don't.

[KABarash]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9FPv2toi5og

[jrsjr]

Seriously, I'm beginning to believe that a lot of motorists don't actually consider scooters to be legit vehicles despite having a license plate.

That's pretty much the case. You can be going 15mph over the limit and some jerkhole will be tailgating you

Stay alert and ride safe!

Eric is soooo right. I ride a big scooter that can make serious speed and folks still tailgate and act like I have no business on the road ahead of them. It's just the way it is.

Mukaiboston, I'm going to pin my doomy-gloomy Eeyore tail on for a moment and be very straight with you about riding in dangerous conditions like you are riding in. I hope you won't be hurt or offended, but I've been riding since 1978 and there are some realities about it that aren't nice. Here's a couple thoughts...

EEYORE
I see that you list your location as Boston. As I'm sure you already know, driving any vehicle there is a risky proposition. I've driven a car there quite a few times and it's the scariest place I've ever driven, and I've even driven all over Italy and France. Boston is just a special case. Always has been.

My suggestion? If you're determined to ride there, you're going to need serious street survival skills. You need to take classes. I'm thinking the MSF course and the Advanced MSF course and any other classes you can find on advanced street survival. It wouldn't hurt to take the advanced course twice with some time in between so the pros can evaluate your skill development. There are books out there on street survival riding, too.

It goes without saying that you need to make sure you wear safety gear. A couple other things to consider - If you don't have an ICE number (In Case of Emergency) programmed in your cell phone, pull it out and program one right now. That's about the first thing the paramedics would look for in an emergency. Make sure you have your ID and your health insurance information on your person. I say this because, regardless of state law, many for-profit hospitals would only do minimal stabilization of your vitals before putting you back in an ambulance and telling the driver to take you "anywhere but here." Can you tell I worked in a hospital for 7 years?

Finally, remember that the soft, gray matter between your ears is the best safety equipment you can possibly have. Every moment you are on the road, you need to be alert, focused, reading the condition of the road surface, reading the traffic around you, formulating escape plans in case something goes wrong, evaluating the behavior of the drivers around you (a driver with a cell phone is a vehicular manslaughter waiting to happen to you), reading the road signs and lights, staying calm about stupid drivers around you because being angry will distract you from riding, monitoring the behavior of the car and the driver behind you, looking out for anybody turning in front of you from left or right, planning your next next braking or steering operation, making sure you don't leave your turn signal on when you're going straight, strategizing ways to use automobiles going in the same direction as you are as shields in intersections, and always riding with that perfect mix of aggression and hyper-paranoia that scooterists refer to as "ride it like you stole it."

The funny thing is, if you ride around in the state of mind that I describe above, it's hugely exhilirating. When you get off the scooter, you'll feel, like, superhuman or something. You won't even want to hang with dull folks who don't ride.

Good Luck!
/EEYORE

[illnoise]

I say this everytime someone posts a 'no respect' thread, but a large part of the reason we get little respect is because so few scooterists have respect for the law, and it reflects poorly on all of us.

If you want scooters to get more respect, it's up to you to set a flawless example of what scootering should be. Wear safety gear, license/title/insure your bike properly, follow traffic instructions, don't block the sidewalk when you park, don't illegally lane split, don't pass on the right at stoplights, keep your bike looking respectable, DON'T RIDE IN BIKE LANES, DON'T RIDE DRUNK, etc. Some people will never come around, but a lot of scooterists think it's cool to flaunt the rules and get away with everything they can, and it's up to us to counteract that attitude.

Make fun of the old man if you want (i'm 41, I've been riding scooters since 1995) but I really think that's the key. You're in Boston, which along with Denver, I'd argue are the two worst cities for respect, and part of that is because the laws there have been confusing for years, and scooterists have taken advantage of that. You can't argue it's a bicycle sometimes and it's a car or motorcycle other times when it's convenient, you need to treat it as a motorcycle (not that motorcycles don't have their own respect problem) and stick with it.

Not targeting you at all, I'm sure you're a respectful rider, just trying to explain what I see as a large part of the problem that's rarely talked about.

[mukaiboston]

Thanks for the tips you guys. It's true; even in Boston I have seen a lot of scooters not obey the rules...then again, a lot of them are beat-up looking and only have moped stickers. I keep my buddy well-maintained with proper plates and inspection but it seems those that break the rules reflect badly on us all.

This weekend, I am going to try to get my winter jumpsuit. I have gloves and boots and a full-face helmet so far.

Jrsjr, do you really think Boston is worse than Paris? When I worked in Paris, my boss would drive me around in his truck and there I thought I was going to die. Boston I am used to in a car, but it is definitely scarier on a scooter. Just today, I was driving past Harvard and was nearly flattened by a merging cager that failed to look before turning.

[jrsjr]

Jrsjr, do you really think Boston is worse than Paris? When I worked in Paris, my boss would drive me around in his truck and there I thought I was going to die. Boston I am used to in a car, but it is definitely scarier on a scooter. Just today, I was driving past Harvard and was nearly flattened by a merging cager that failed to look before turning.

I got rammed on a motorbike by an automobile driver who was peeved that I hadn't yielded the right-of-way during rush hour on the Périphérique, so I have a slightly skewed view of Paris traffic, but, yeah, Boston takes the cake. Interestingly, there are threads about this going on right now on our sister site, Modern Vespa. Here is the thread about Boston and here is the thread about Paris. How odd...

[BootScootin'FireFighter]

Finally, remember that the soft, gray matter between your ears is the best safety equipment you can possibly have. Every moment you are on the road, you need to be alert, focused, reading the condition of the road surface, reading the traffic around you, formulating escape plans in case something goes wrong, evaluating the behavior of the drivers around you (a driver with a cell phone is a vehicular manslaughter waiting to happen to you), reading the road signs and lights, staying calm about stupid drivers around you because being angry will distract you from riding, monitoring the behavior of the car and the driver behind you, looking out for anybody turning in front of you from left or right, planning your next next braking or steering operation, making sure you don't leave your turn signal on when you're going straight, strategizing ways to use automobiles going in the same direction as you are as shields in intersections, and always riding with that perfect mix of aggression and hyper-paranoia that scooterists refer to as "ride it like you stole it."

Very good information there, and it does take a lot of time to develop and perfect those reflexes and behaviors. And what's the deal with Boston, it's not as bad as everyone describes it.

A scary event happened tonight when I was making a left turn at an intersection. The car behind me accelerated trying to pass me on the left.

I've had that once or twice before. keep and eye out and don't advance too far into the intersection giving them a chance to attempt that. Another big hazard is left turns with 2 lanes each way and no turn lane. Initial reaction would be get all the way to the left, but that opens up an opportunity to get clipped by the mirror of the passing car that decides they'll just squeeze past you without getting over. I try to take up as much of that left lane as I can and always watch the mirror to see that they've at least slowed down. Again, avoiding those turns are always the best, even if it means a series of right turns.

I think it's just an ego thing.

That is very true. In Northern Virginia, we have a unique problem. We don't have an industrial base here, so 95% of the adult population works the Monday-Friday gig and usually are all on the road at the same 4 hour window in the morning and evening. The expressways are extremely over capacity and a lot of schmucks take surface roads to bypass the delays. They try to make up for lost time on streets and take extra chances at yellow signals, rights on red, tailgating, and beating the rush to make a left. And it's no better on Saturday and Sunday. That's the same populations "days off". The roads are less crowded, but still driven very aggressively to the park, church, costco, walmart, whole foods, Tysons Corner mall, you name it.

It was a hearse, one of those wagon-converted ones with the rear as a closed metal pod type of thing.

"WARRIORS, come out to PLAY-AYYYY!"

[illnoise]

Boston's certainly the worst city i've ever driven in, though I've never ridden a scooter there. I've been to Paris but I didn't ride or drive, but there, people are at least used to scooters and there's a rhythm to traffic that everyone seems to understand (even if I don't!). Boston is just free-for-all me-me-me anarchy.

[jrsjr]

I've been to Paris but I didn't ride or drive, but there, people are at least used to scooters and there's a rhythm to traffic that everyone seems to understand (even if I don't!).

So true! That's why I didn't freak out when the guy hit my bike. I just chalked it up to learning the ropes of riding in big league traffic. Besides, he just tweaked my crash bars a little, right? Seriously, though, Bb is right. Even riding in Italy was more "predictable" in the sense that at least you know that everybody drives hard, even the little old ladies in their Fiats.

[killbilly]

I say this everytime someone posts a 'no respect' thread, but a large part of the reason we get little respect is because so few scooterists have respect for the law, and it reflects poorly on all of us.

If you want scooters to get more respect, it's up to you to set a flawless example of what scootering should be. Wear safety gear, license/title/insure your bike properly, follow traffic instructions, don't block the sidewalk when you park, don't illegally lane split, don't pass on the right at stoplights, keep your bike looking respectable, DON'T RIDE IN BIKE LANES, DON'T RIDE DRUNK, etc. Some people will never come around, but a lot of scooterists think it's cool to flaunt the rules and get away with everything they can, and it's up to us to counteract that attitude.

This. This. This. This.

I wanted to strangle the guy on the Vespa in front of me the other day. Flip flops, no helmet, jacking with his iPod at every intersection. Accelerating and riding no-hands, playing with his hair.

I also feel this way about squids doing wheelies up the highway at 90mph in traffic.

[Quo Vadimus]

While I agree that it would be helpful if we all behaved perfectly (and I do do my best to do that), I can't really buy this argument as the reason we get no respect. 70% of cars are speeding, not stopping at stop signs, texting, eating burritos, not using turn signals, failing to give pedestrians the right of way... need I go on? If we based our vehicular prejudices on whether we've seen misbehavior or not, cagers would hate cagers a lot more than they hate bikes and bicycles.

I'm sorry to say I think it's nothing more than 'us versus them.' It's the ugly tendency of humans to be bigoted in whatever ways that still haven't been shamed by society as a whole. We're going to be 'them' no matter how well we behave. At least until everyone realizes the economy is so bad they can't afford more than a scooter anymore.

[gt1000]

You're in Boston, which along with Denver, I'd argue are the two worst cities for respect,

Seriously, Denver? I've never had a whiff of a respect issue in Denver during the years I've been riding here. Maybe it's where I ride or the way I ride but I like to think it's the fact that there are so many scooters on the roads here. Sure, Denver has its share of idiot and aggressive drivers but they seem to be equal opportunity aggressors not really targeting scooters.

Not saying you're wrong, but I hope you are.

[jasondavis48108]

While I agree that it would be helpful if we all behaved perfectly (and I do do my best to do that), I can't really buy this argument as the reason we get no respect. 70% of cars are speeding, not stopping at stop signs, texting, eating burritos, not using turn signals, failing to give pedestrians the right of way... need I go on? If we based our vehicular prejudices on whether we've seen misbehavior or not, cagers would hate cagers a lot more than they hate bikes and bicycles.

I'm sorry to say I think it's nothing more than 'us versus them.' It's the ugly tendency of humans to be bigoted in whatever ways that still haven't been shamed by society as a whole. We're going to be 'them' no matter how well we behave. At least until everyone realizes the economy is so bad they can't afford more than a scooter anymore.

I think its a bit of both. I think that scooterists and cyclists are easier to stereotype becasue there are far fewer of us so the bad ones stick out more. Its also easier for car drivers to blame scooterist since they are not in that group and therefore not at fault. We scooterist often do the same to car drivers or as we so affectionatly like to call them "cagers"

[illnoise]

…I can't really buy this argument as the reason we get no respect.

I said it's a "large part," and I think that's true. Whatever proportion of the problem it may be, it's WAY under-discussed.

70% of cars are speeding, not stopping at stop signs, texting, eating burritos, not using turn signals, failing to give pedestrians the right of way... need I go on? If we based our vehicular prejudices on whether we've seen misbehavior or not, cagers would hate cagers a lot more than they hate bikes and bicycles.

People have a magical way of glossing over the problems of whatever group they're in, and looking to blame their problems on others. And I hate cagers every day while I'm driving my cage, and I imagine just about anyone driving a car spends plenty of time complaining about other drivers. But even what you say there shows you have prejudices against drivers, where does your 70% come from? I bet most drivers (and most scooterists) are pretty reasonable, but we focus on the bad ones. If we can mentally group the 'bad ones' into a group (It's "Audi drivers," for me, "soccer moms in Minivans" for others, and "Scooterists" for many drivers) we will, regardless of REAL statistics. As you say yourself, it's nothing but prejudice.

I'm sorry to say I think it's nothing more than 'us versus them.' It's the ugly tendency of humans to be bigoted in whatever ways that still haven't been shamed by society as a whole. We're going to be 'them' no matter how well we behave. At least until everyone realizes the economy is so bad they can't afford more than a scooter anymore.

I agree with that to some degree, but while a minority may have a fair argument in blaming some of their problems on their 'oppressors' (in our case, automobile drivers) and consider them an "enemy," the battle for respect is hard to fight when a significant share of your minority is playing into the "enemy's" stereotypes, right? Shouldn't a minority be trying to prove the stereotypes wrong every chance we get? Not by "fitting in," or changing our ways, but by proving our way of life is an acceptable and positive alternative.

That reasoning obviously has applications outside of scootering, too, ha. And there are extremists within each group that will never accept other people's opinions, but that doesn't mean most of us shouldn't try.

[illnoise]

To further support my point, my wife has, on many occasions, complained to me about people driving while talking on their cell phone, while SHE was driving and talking on her cell phone. It's always someone else's fault!

I've futzed with my ipod while riding and never stop messing with Pandora while I'm driving, I've ridden drunk (rarely and long ago, but it's happened) we all do these things we complain about (especially when we're in cages ourself) but we're quick to complain when someone else does it.

Bb.

[BootScootin'FireFighter]

At least until everyone realizes the economy is so bad they can't afford more than a scooter anymore.

No complaints from me

[Wheelz]

I use this example every time this comes up as well...

I am an avid cyclist and scooter pilot.
I was also a bicycle messanger in Chicago, for four years, when I hadta take a little break, from the kitchen grind.
This argument came up alot in that particuliar group of people-"We get no respect, no body can see us or pays any attention..."
Alot of times we were all grouped into the riding on the sidewalk, blowing lights, zipping through pedestrians at a cross walk, kicking fender, cursing, hipster wannabe's.
You can do everything different, and nobody sees that. All they see is what they think they know.
my favorite saying is this:

If you don't like the fire of stereotype,then don't feed it....

I think it applies to every group of whatevers, that gets mad when they are all compared to the bad ones. Then they go out and do everything they sare not supposed to

Don't wanna be called a pothead? get a job..
Don't wanna be called an asshat on a scooter? don't be an asshat

I'm ranting hope it helps, ride safe!

[TVB]

If we based our vehicular prejudices on whether we've seen misbehavior or not, cagers would hate cagers a lot more than they hate bikes and bicycles.

Well, I do. Always have.

I'm sorry to say I think it's nothing more than 'us versus them.' It's the ugly tendency of humans to be bigoted in whatever ways that still haven't been shamed by society as a whole. We're going to be 'them' no matter how well we behave.

This is true. Yes, there people who hate two-wheelers because a bicyclist ran a red light on the sidewalk in front of them, or they got stuck behind a moped on the interstate, or a bandana-wearing loud-pipes fetishist lives in their neighborhood. But most people come by their prejudices more easily: complete and utter ignorance about "them".

[sunshinen]

To further support my point, my wife has, on many occasions, complained to me about people driving while talking on their cell phone, while SHE was driving and talking on her cell phone. It's always someone else's fault!

+1

While, yes, there are people who are scooter bigots based on stereotyping or ignorance and people whose egos just can't handle being behind what they think is a "moped" (despite all evidence to the contrary) -- I think sometimes we take it all too personally.

The lack of steel cage, seat belts, and airbags makes us more exposed. We are more vulnerable, and because of that we often respond more emotionally to behaviors that might not be so upsetting if we were in a car. By tailgating me on my scooter, you're not risking a fender bender, you're putting my life and limbs at risk. I'm painfully aware of this -- but the driver behind me probably isn't.

Sometimes, that guy tailgating you is just in a really big hurry, that girl that cut you off and then gave YOU the finger is just having a really bad day, or that jerk throwing cans/yelling/whistling at you ... is just a really big asswipe, or road troll, someone who gets their kicks out of getting under someone's/anyone's skin. They're just temporarily (or permanently) jerks, it really has little to do with who you are or what you drive or ride, and you're often forgotten (or they may even feel badly) minutes later. Letting it get to you just puts you in more danger because you're worked up thinking about them rather than concentrating on riding.

Ride safe, ride responsibly, expedite getting the assholes (for whatever reason they are being one) out of your riding vicinity, and ride happy.

[JHScoot]

chiming in for the second time here...

as a new rider i really don't see any reason to get pissed off at people on the road, but i do think them stupid and careless sometimes. and selfish. i can't think of any reason why a car would obviously turn left in front of me as they do and risk getting hit by me expect if they think "who cares if he hits me nothing will happen to ME." and i know they see me because they are looking right at me and go speeding through the intersection forcing me to brake quickly and sometimes dangerously. that is just inconsiderate and i don't want to have to think every time it happens 'well maybe they are just having a bad day.' or maybe they are just as rude and inconsiderate in their cars as they are outside of them

i tend to have a 'Me 'Vs Them' attitude when riding sometimes. and its my own business how i ride, what i wear or don't wear, and how i may appear to others so long as i am following the law and showing proper consideration. and i expect nothing less or more from people in 5000 pound SUV's. they don't have to think about us scooterist, but we have to think about them constantly. so the least they can do is show some consideration (respect) for our safety when they see us coming, or we pull out in front of them from a stoplight

[Lostmycage]

I'm confused. When did we start riding scooters to get respect?

Pretend no one can see you, stay out of blind spots, let people pass you if they're hell bent on going faster (it's a lot better than an ass on your.. erm... ass). People are jerks these days. I notice it more when I'm in my truck than when I'm on a bike.

Don't sweat it, it's not personal... they hate everyone else too and it's probably because their friends don't like them. Be the better person and move on (or slow down). There's always a reason to pull off and stop (coffee, photo-op, leg stretch, breather, potty, warm up or you just see something shiny).

[jasondavis48108]

I'm confused. When did we start riding scooters to get respect?

I thought thats why all the super macho guys bought a scooter. To earn respect and get the chicks

[JHScoot]

I'm confused. When did we start riding scooters to get respect?

not to get respect, but the desire for people to have some for the safety of two wheeled riders on the rode, whether it be scooter or motorcycle, isn't such a bad thing

i don't know maybe its because i am a new rider that i notice things more and get angered a bit by it. or maybe because i have always appreciated the risks motorcyclist and scooters take when out on the road even before i started riding. or maybe its because i am a big guy and when driving my cage someone has flipped me off, dangerously cut me off, or spilled their road rage my way, i have always thought "wow people sure are brave in their cars. i bet they wouldn't act that way face to face with me." but i get miffed out there sometimes. i don't stay miffed, but i am a good driver, a considerate driver, a respectful motorist. even on my bad days. and i expect the same from others, as i consider it common courtesy. otherwise, stay off MY road

lol

but seriously i have no doubt that one day i am going to hop off my scooter at a light somewhere and give someone a piece of my mind. like that guy who posted a thread not long ago about doing just that when some buffoon ran him off the road and spun gravel in his face while dangerously passing on the right. its just sort of my....personality

or i will at least use the Stebal to maximum effect

i would like to "pretend" i am invisible ALL the time, but its sort of hard to when the guy who just pulled a double u-turn in front of me and without warning obviously saw me and almost laid me on the street not once, but twice within the span of 5 seconds

[BootScootin'FireFighter]

the desire for people to have some *respect* for the safety of two wheeled riders on the rode, whether it be scooter or motorcycle, isn't such a bad thing

that's kind of a pipe dream. I'd like to see that too, from everyone. I can't safely manage a motor vehicle accident scene with all my emergency lights on, my bright shiny reflective vest, flares, handlight, the whole nine... without me or my crew nearly being taken out all too often. Everyone continues to take split second chances, waits to the last second to merge, passes dangerously close, and most people don't exercise common courtesy anymore. So until emergency personnel can get the respect that the law delegates they get, then we can forget about scooterists getting what we wish for. And I only see it on a small scale version, talk to a state trooper, they'll have some incredible stories.

but seriously i have no doubt that one day i am going to hop off my scooter at a light somewhere and give someone a piece of my mind.

however you handle it, just be cool dude. I don't want to read about you on here from another MB member in LA. There are some mean heartless bastards out there and you never know how unstable they may be at the time. Ride safe, we like ya!

[Keys]

There are some mean heartless bastards out there and you never know how unstable they may be at the time...!

So unfortunately true. I am a detention officer at the only jail (600+inmates) in Yavapai County and there are SOOOoooo many people out there who would just as soon stomp your head into a splotch on the pavement as look at you. Then they would just walk away with absolutely no remorse. There are a great number of them in my jail and you can figure that the incarcerated ones are probably only about 10% of those who exist. The majority are still out on the street.

--Keys

[charlie55]

.....there are SOOOoooo many people out there who would just as soon stomp your head into a splotch on the pavement as look at you. Then they would just walk away with absolutely no remorse.

"People" don't act like that. Subhumans and genetic errors do.

I don't envy you your job, but I'm grateful there are folks like you to help keep the lid on.

[trackpete]

however you handle it, just be cool dude.

That should be the entire thread, IMO.

People don't try to share lanes or pass you in the lane because they are arrogant or disrespectful, they do it because you are barely taking up any bit of the lane. They pass you on the double yellow because unlike passing a car they do not need a significant amount of time to go around you and can see oncoming traffic better. They always seem to drive faster than you because there is always one person on a road who is passing everyone.

All of this behaviour generally happens to some degree or another with cars, you are simply considerably more sensitive to it when riding a scooter because you are considerably more exposed (or so I posit).

Personally, I take the opposite attitude from you - I watch closely and deliberately leave people space to pass me on the double yellow (often looping quickly onto the shoulder), I will slow and wait for traffic behind me to pass before turning left (if it's significantly faster than I am), and any time I am somewhere with a 45MPH or above speed limit I will always pay careful attention to who is coming up behind me so that I can offer them whatever courtesy is available to ensure we are both safe.

The simple fact is that I, as an experienced motorcycle (and now scooter, if I may say) rider have considerably more experience with moto/auto interaction than the vast vast majority of automobile drivers, therefore (as anywhere in life where that dynamic exists), I feel it's my responsibility to ensure the smoothest interaction.

Anyway, I'd say just remember that - most people don't understand why you would be upset about them driving like that around you because they've never experienced your fear.

Side note: Man, when I was on the Al-Can it was REALLY bad, with RV's ripping past me from two feet away doing 30MPH more than me, almost sucking me into their back tires as I pondered a mountain or a tree putting along at 40MPH. I kept wishing for South America or Asia, where it's considered polite to honk as you are about to pass a vehicle - guarantees that you know someone is coming up on you![/b]

[illnoise]

However you handle it, just be cool dude.

+1

I had a .45 waved at me once, and was chased for a couple miles and then literally run off the road on purpose once, both were after casually flipping off drivers that almost killed me. A friend of mine was stabbed in the shoulder by a cabbie because at the next light he (fairly) politely asked him to be more careful. There are total whack jobs out there, and it's almost always just best to let it go, pull over, catch your breath and get your head straight, and just be on your way.

[TVB]

I, as an experienced motorcycle (and now scooter, if I may say) rider

You may say. Really.

have considerably more experience with moto/auto interaction than the vast vast majority of automobile drivers, therefore (as anywhere in life where that dynamic exists), I feel it's my responsibility to ensure the smoothest interaction.
Anyway, I'd say just remember that - most people don't understand why you would be upset about them driving like that around you because they've never experienced your fear.

Obviously I've never verified this, but I'm sure I could tell you with high accuracy which motorists have ridden a bicycle in traffic and which ones haven't based on how they handle passing me. The ones who don't slow down and merely nudge their vehicles to the left six inches, or the ones who stay behind me for a quarter mile waiting until they can do a complete lane change like they were passing a vehicle going almost as fast as them... simply don't know what they're doing to me. On one hand, I am more than six inches wide and a high-speed shock wave throws me off balance. But I'm pedaling on the right side of the lane so you can pass me, because I'd rather share the lane with a car going 5-10mph faster than me for a few seconds than have it riding my ass for a couple minutes. They just don't know.

I kept wishing for South America or Asia, where it's considered polite to honk as you are about to pass a vehicle - guarantees that you know someone is coming up on you![/b]

OK, but please don't do that with bicyclists. We're quiet; we can hear cars coming. Honking like that is just a good way to startle the shit out of us.

[JHScoot]

well i have taken in this thread a couple more times and have decided to try to maintain a cooler head while out riding. seems the more experienced riders here have words of wisdom to share i have yet to learn for myself

i really don't care about most things on the road, just people blatantly cutting me off. but i guess its to be expected, and for my own sake i must learn to live with it and just enjoy the ride

sure would like to punch some of them sometimes, though. but i guess i'll just keep that to myself

[ericalm]

I confess: I get a little burned at drivers sometimes and really need to check myself.

Aside from the danger from drivers reacting in who-knows-what way if you yell or whatever, I also find that when I get steamed, I start riding like a reckless idiot.

[illnoise]

I confess: I get a little burned at drivers sometimes and really need to check myself.

Aside from the danger from drivers reacting in who-knows-what way if you yell or whatever, I also find that when I get steamed, I start riding like a reckless idiot.

Exactly, we all get mad, it's human nature. It's important to not confront/provoke the other driver, but it's even more important to get your head back to normal before riding again. When you get shaken up in a near-accident or a confrontation, your body and mind flip out and it's not really safe to be riding in that condition. If you're shivering-mad and thinking about what just happened, you're not thinking about what could happen in the present.

[jasondavis48108]

I confess: I get a little burned at drivers sometimes and really need to check myself.

Aside from the danger from drivers reacting in who-knows-what way if you yell or whatever, I also find that when I get steamed, I start riding like a reckless idiot.

+1

[KABarash]

I confess: I get a little burned at drivers sometimes and really need to check myself.

Aside from the danger from drivers reacting in who-knows-what way if you yell or whatever, I also find that when I get steamed, I start riding like a reckless idiot.

Same here..... I started riding the tail of some moron a few weeks ago that passed me on the right, in the right turn lane, to get in front of me at the traffic light I was coasting to. I followed hin about 2 1/2 miles with my high beam shining in his eyes from his side view mirror......

ANOTHER thing that 'burns my bottom' is the jerks who decide the milk crate I have on the rear is for THEIR trash!! This happened to me AGAIN yesterday at the grocery store.

[charlie55]

I don't know if it's my age, or the fact that I'm now finishing up my third riding season, but I'm finding it easier and easier to let this kind of stuff roll off my back. Identifying potential jerks and problem areas has become more intuitive, making avoidance and/or compensation somewhat simpler. Given the traffic situation here in NJ, I've come to the conclusion that I can either enjoy the ride or spend 90% of it being aggravated and then carrying that aggravation around with me for the rest of the day. I've had to consciously work on this since I have a pretty hot temper, but I find that it makes my (riding) life a whole lot more pleasant. As long as I don't get hit or hit anyone else, it's a good day.

[Stormswift]

I definitely should reconsider attaching that broomstick to the back of the scooter for Halloween. Next thing I know I'll come out from shopping and will have a mob greet me with bonfire going.If the morons don't like the milk crate imagine when they see the broomstick

[Cheshire]

I confess: I get a little burned at drivers sometimes and really need to check myself.

Aside from the danger from drivers reacting in who-knows-what way if you yell or whatever, I also find that when I get steamed, I start riding like a reckless idiot.

Same here..... I started riding the tail of some moron a few weeks ago that passed me on the right, in the right turn lane, to get in front of me at the traffic light I was coasting to. I followed hin about 2 1/2 miles with my high beam shining in his eyes from his side view mirror......

ANOTHER thing that 'burns my bottom' is the jerks who decide the milk crate I have on the rear is for THEIR trash!! This happened to me AGAIN yesterday at the grocery store.

That's not just scooter disrespect, though. I had that constantly happen to me the two times I drove a pickup truck. One a Ranger, the other an F-150. Inconsideration is fueled by laziness.