[NBR] SYM-USA Distribution goes to…

Post by **ericalm** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 2:03 am

It should come as no surprise to anyone who's been keeping track of all of the SYM/Carter Bros. drama for the past couple years (culminating with a suspicious fire at Carter's warehouse) that SYM has kicked them to the curb in favor of a new US distributor.

What is kind of surprising is that the new distributor is Lance Powersports. (Well, not too surprising—we've discussed this here before it was official.) The two companies have a checkered history, much of which still smells a little fishy.

But wait, there's more: Lance is handling distribution in the western US. The East goes to Peirspeed.

Some background and details on 2strokebuzz:
http://2strokebuzz.com/2010/12/19/lance ... li-classic
http://2strokebuzz.com/2011/01/04/lance ... -confirmed

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 3:28 am

New for 2012, the completely redesigned Lance City Com 300i

i know nothing about this business, but it seems odd to me because Lance seemed something of a vanity distributor before, importing cheap chinese scooters but wanting to brand them and sell them as something special. like a lot of chinese distributors. but i recall walking into a couple of dealerships late in 2009 and both were like "well THIS is a Lance. THEY make great scooters, the BEST." and so on and so forth

Carter Bros never called the scoots Carter Bros Scooters, but Lance has probably sold more scooters in this country then SYM, and most likely have a better known name among the average consumer. or at least SYM is no better known. does this mean they will be importing SYM and rebadging them Lance, such as the Cali Classic?

also, what will the offerings be? i can't imagine a Lance being sold for above $3000. will they get the entire product line, or will they import just several budget minded models such as the Fiddle, Symply, Mio, and maybe a lower priced HD model or two?

i mean call it what you will, but i wouldn't mind having myself a low(er) cost SYM, even if it says Lance on it

"The Lance RV 250....priced right at $2799"

Post by **ericalm** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 3:59 am

I don't think any of the scoots will be rebadged as Lance.

Despite name recognition, Lance is saddled with a troublesome reputation for poor-quality scooters and poor customer service. They've tried to correct that by dumping most of the Chinese scoots in the line and selling just one model, the Cali Classic, which is built in China by SYM. Rebadging that would actually be un-re-badging it. It's sold as a SYM in other markets. (The big problem with the Cali is that it's indistinguishable from other, lower-quality scoots being sold here.)

SYM, on the other hand, has a reputation for making great scoots that, for whatever reason, don't sell very well.

Outside the low-end Chinese scooter market, it's not all that common for distributors to rebadge scoots. Genuine has a much more active role with its partners than companies like Lance; they're helping develop new models. Selling them in the US as "Genuines" customized for the US market with new model names, unique colors and details, etc. is their basic strategy because they get the US market better than PGO or LML ever could.

SYM—and Kymco—have both suffered from bringing over too many models, the wrong models, and a lack of savvy when it comes to marketing and distributing their product. For SYM, some of this could be blamed on having the wrong distributor. Maybe Lance's slickness and sales acumen will turn that around.

birdmove · Post by **birdmove** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 5:33 pm

I'm here to tell you that, at least the HD200 (and I'm sure the HD125) are great scooters. We have a 2008 HD200 and it's an awesome unit. I've heard good things about the Cali Classic as far as build quality too.

I'm optomistic that Lance Powersports taking over will be a positive step for SYM in the USA.

jon

Kaos · Post by **Kaos** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 9:33 pm

Thats an interesting choice given Lance's history. But honestly, they do seem to market well, which Sym BADLY needs.

Post by **ericalm** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 10:33 pm

Kaos wrote:Thats an interesting choice given Lance's history. But honestly, they do seem to market well, which Sym BADLY needs.

Indeed. I wonder how marketing will be handled with the distribution split.

birdmove · Post by **birdmove** » Wed Jan 05, 2011 10:54 pm

I emailed Mike Hickman back and forth a couple times today. He is the national Sales Manager for Lance Powersports. He said the Lance will have both SYM scooters and parts by late winter or early spring. Also, the existing SYM dealers should be able to sell the Lance cali Classic scooters.

jon

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Thu Jan 06, 2011 12:59 am

so does this mean Lance says what goes with SYM where they distribute SYM? IOW they are in charge of promoting, warranting, and selling them, essentially? providing customer support and making advertising decisions? or does that all come from corporate in Taiwan?

i would think distribution would have more to do then just get stock into showrooms. i mean as our Admin here said, Genuine / Scooterworks are very involved with what they want from PGO, and they get it. does Lance now get to do the same thing with SYM? and will Lance get some SYM's to sell as Lance Scooters in the deal?

i know its an abomination among many scooter enthusiast, but i still kinda like the Cali Classic.

cheesy as it may be. a little cheese never hurt anyone, right?

Post by **ericalm** » Thu Jan 06, 2011 1:35 am

JHScoot wrote:so does this mean Lance says what goes with SYM where they distribute SYM? IOW they are in charge of promoting, warranting, and selling them, essentially? providing customer support and making advertising decisions? or does that all come from corporate in Taiwan?

Yes, Lance would be responsible for all of those things or at least sharing those responsibilities with the other distributor, Peirspeed.

JHScoot wrote:i know its an abomination among many scooter enthusiast, but i still kinda like the Cali Classic.

cheesy as it may be. a little cheese never hurt anyone, right?

.....

yeah i know...just another Joker clone. but its a SYM Joker clone and i like the sound with that pipe!

I'm not sure "abomination" is quite right… The problem most (rational) people have with it is that the design has been cloned SO MANY times and that the product was always low-quality. But despite the abundance of Honda Metropolitan and Yamaha Vino clones, those scoots still have decent reputations. It's really just a matter of putting out something that's good quality, backing your warranty and providing adequate support to owners and dealers.

The Cali Classic-style scoot that I like the most is the Aprilia Mojito/Habana. Very Joker-y, but metal bodied and much put better fit & finish than any clone I've seen. The later ones came with Piaggio LEADER 150 engines, so lots of performance mods available. The kitted 50s haul ass. This was supposed to be my first scoot, but the deal sort of fell through.

birdmove · Post by **birdmove** » Thu Jan 06, 2011 1:52 am

The Mojito was probably a step up from the SYM/Lance cali Classic, but I bet the Cali Classic is a step up from the other similiar looking scooters. Maybe the Fly Il Bello is close to the SYM??The Cali is a 125cc. It's supposed to be the SYM Fiddle II 125 with digerent bodywork.

At first, I didn't care for the looks of this whole design, but it's been growing on me.Especially after I watched and listened to some youtube videos.

jon

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Thu Jan 06, 2011 3:22 am

^ judging from its specs and where it came from, i would say the Mojito is probably a good several steps up from the Cali Classic, at least. other then styling nothing else is very similar, it would seem. an all metal body, Leader 150 engine....for all intent and purposes it sounds like a Vespa quality machine. the Cali Classic is still considered by some to be a somewhat underachieving SYM in design and execution. in the right color and with that pipe i think i wouldn't mind having one, however. i just am on the fence about the motorcycle like handle bars and all that chrome. something about it says cool but i'm of the mind scooters are already cool without all that crap. they don't have to try to be cool or look cool because they already are

and while i don't like to disparage scooters or what people own and ride, the Fly IL on the other hand is most likely not close to the SYM Cali in quality. its a Znen made scoot, the same as the BMS Heritage, Lance Retro, TNG Lowboy, and Vento Hot Rod. before i got my Agility i looked at some of those and thought because of price and size and styling i might get one. but all that cheap chrome (as opposed to well done chrome) made me cringe, and the flimsy feel of the scoots just continued the impression of a poorly built scooter. i haven't seen or sat atop a Cali Classic, but i doubt SYM builds anything like it that is Znen quality. even in a budget scoot like the Cali.

iMoses · Post by **iMoses** » Thu Jan 06, 2011 6:09 pm

As long as my dealer can get parts when needed... I don't care if it's Lance Powersports or Lance Armstrong.

Post by **illnoise** » Fri Jan 07, 2011 2:53 am

Eric, Lance already sells a SYM badged as a Lance. And Cobra/Peirspeed has a history of rebadging everything they sell (Sachs, TGB, and Chineseage) as Peirspeed. So I see that as getting confusing as hell, hopefully they both decide to NOT rebrand.

I wrote a long comment on my own post today listing my thoughts why it's a bad idea to split between two distributors, if anyone cares, ha.

http://2strokebuzz.com/2011/01/04/lance ... -confirmed

Again, I love SYM bikes and I'm glad to see Carter Bros. out of the picture.

But SYM's branding/marketing is nothing special (Carter Bros. were just starting to get the hang of graphic design), and Peirspeed's branding/marketing looks like it's targeted at dirtbike riders from the late 80s. Like Eric said, Lance is pretty solid with marketing, but hasn't had good product in the past, and I think using their name for the SYMs would undermind SYMs good reputation. We'll see, I guess.