How long do your tires last?

thehypercube · Post by **thehypercube** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 5:16 pm

I'm not the best example, because I apparently weren't keeping them properly inflated (I did check them and use the recommended pressures, but I think my bike pump gauge is off at the lower PSIs), but I just blew out my rear Michelin S1. It was my second set of tires and it seems that a set is lasting me about 4000 miles. It's rather expensive to change them out, mainly due to SF labor rates, so just wondering what others get out of their rubber. My new tires are Heidenau K61, not sure if that will make a difference. I know on a car some tires ride nicer but are also softer rubber and wear out sooner.

Post by **ericalm** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 6:24 pm

I never had a rear tire last over 6K, until…

The Heidenau K61s are what I have on my Vespa now and they're amazing. I have over 7K on the rear so far and it's still looking good. Also, just a better all-around tire than any of my previous ones. I love it so much I removed my top case and only use it when needed now to reduce wear on the tire!

Overall, tire life will depend on rider weight, riding style, proper inflation, presence of a top case, heat, cold and other environmental conditions.

Hellvis · Post by **Hellvis** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 6:47 pm

I actually got out of every tire I tried so far about 2k yo 2.5 k out of the rear tire and about 4 k of the front tire. I alway watch the tire pressure but it might be my weight and the top case, which I actually do use every single day since I go to work with it.

I have tried the following tires after the original tires Maxxis Whitewall were worn out.

Prima whitewall - from Scooterworks
Michelin S1
Bridgestone Hoop

I will try next the tire you guys have mentioned here and see what I can get out of those lol

Skootz Kabootz · Post by **Skootz Kabootz** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 7:23 pm

I have a top case and sit right at the back of the seat and average about 3K on the stock Buddy whitewalls.

Hellvis · Post by **Hellvis** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 8:46 pm

Hi Eric,

May I ask where you got your Heidenau's? I found them online Scootershop and S.I.P. around the 60.00 range. Is that where you got them as well?

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:17 pm

not sure about the Blackjack as it has under 500 miles on it and the tires still look good

my Agility has around 1500 miles on it and the tires still look new. surprising to me since so many owners complain about the stock tires on those. i guess the complaints aren't about wear, though. some say after 3500 miles they lose grip like crazy, others say they don't have any grip as it is. i don't mind them so much, myself

is it safe to run scoot tires until they are bald? i always read posts that say "had no tread left, had to get new ones" and "they are completely worn down, have to get new ones soon"

i would never do this for a car, but is it reasonable to run a scooter tire until its pretty much completely worn out?

to save on upfront costs i am going to buy a tire in the next month or two, and then another a month or two after that. this way only mounting will need to be done when i need to swap them. i am going to do this with other serviceable parts, too

Skootz Kabootz · Post by **Skootz Kabootz** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:26 pm

A scooter tire or MC tire is worn out when the tread has reached the wear marks (small ridges of rubber located in the tread cutaways). Once that happens it's time to replace.

thehypercube · Post by **thehypercube** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:52 pm

no top case for me, and rider weight of 160 with gear or 290 2-up. 2-up is maybe 2% of the time. mostly it's a commuter. sf bay area, so not cold but cool. i think the inflation was a big factor but it's nice to hear what others are getting. i thought i was getting less than half what's considered normal.

first were the stock tires... shinko i think? they were awful. fishtailing in the mist.

the s1's were great but out of stock on repair.

the k61 so far are great. eric, did it take you any getting used to them? they feel so much more responsive than i am used to and it almost feels like the bike is trying to stand itself up out of a turn. love the ride so far.

Hellvis · Post by **Hellvis** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:55 pm

and it is not safe to run the tires all bald, in wet weather at least. In dry weather you should be alright but you might risk a blow out because the overall material is thinning and eventually will fail.

So I was checking out these tires

Heidenau K61
Kenda K413
Vredestein

and decided to give the Vredestein Tornante for 30.00 each a whirl and see how they perform and last.

Tocsik · Post by **Tocsik** » Sat Feb 05, 2011 10:00 pm

I get about 4K on my rear tires. Front lasts forever.

Post by **ericalm** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 12:07 am

Hellvis wrote:I will try next the tire you guys have mentioned here and see what I can get out of those lol

The Heidenaus are more expensive than most of the others, but my devotion to them borders on religious. They really transformed the handling of my LX. Many people who have them feel similarly about them.

HowHH · Post by **HowHH** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 3:56 am

ericalm wrote:The Heidenaus are more expensive than most of the others, but my devotion to them borders on religious. They really transformed the handling of my LX. Many people who have them feel similarly about them.

I just received a set of K61's for my BlackJack this week. Waiting for some nicer weather so I can get them mounted. I blame...ehem.. excuse me... credit your fervent enthusiasm as a significant factor in my decision to go with those tires. I am looking forward to trying them out!

peabody99 · Post by **peabody99** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 4:02 am

my stock tires made it to 7000. The rear was most in need of changing. I have zippy continentials on now-3400 miles on them, and they are doing well.

thehypercube · Post by **thehypercube** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 4:12 am

somewhat unbelievable, but i had my brand new rear tire go to zero while my wife and I were eating lunch. I pushed 2.5 blocks (downhill then flat, thankfully) to a friends house and got it back up to 35psi with her bike pump and rode it over to to the shop. the mechanic could not find a leak at all. maybe somebody let the air out, but was careful to screw the valve stem cap back on? it's not my week with the scooter, i tell ya.

TVB · Post by **TVB** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 4:27 am

I have 9K on my original tires. The rear one isn't bald yet, but I'm planning to replace them (along with the clutch, which the mechanic told me was getting down to its last thousand miles or two at its last check-up... a couple thousand miles ago) when the weather gets good enough to ride to the scooter shop.

rajron · Post by **rajron** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 4:49 am

I got over 8K on my original tires on the Buddy and the same mileage with my other scooter – not much tread left but they still rolled true.

peabody99 · Post by **peabody99** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 4:57 am

rajron wrote:I got over 8K on my original tires on the Buddy and the same mileage with my other scooter – not much tread left but they still rolled true.

you got 8000 miles on a gts rear tire?? WTH. It must have been dragging in shreds.

rajron · Post by **rajron** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 1:29 pm

peabody99 wrote:
rajron wrote:I got over 8K on my original tires on the Buddy and the same mileage with my other scooter – not much tread left but they still rolled true.
you got 8000 miles on a gts rear tire?? WTH. It must have been dragging in shreds.

I was/am running the Pirelli GTS tires on the 300 (OEM,) they were pretty bald but still very capable on when changed, we are a very dry state, but, I cautioned on the side of safety and installed a new rear – you are not the first person to have commented on how many miles I got on them – never thought of myself as an easy rider on the scooter, I am not heavy, but not light by any stretch of the imagination, about 175lbs.
Very curious why I get greater mileage on the rear than a lot of people; as for the 300 my riding is fifty percent short commute to work, less than seven miles one way, fifty percent on longer trips with over half of that mileage on trips exceeding two hundred miles in a day, WOT most of the time at +75mph indicated.
I favor the front brakes, I sit in the center of the seat, long trips I use a trunk, I don’t very often check the pressures of the tire, but when I do they are always OK, never overinflate.

laxer · Post by **laxer** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 2:14 pm

Wow, I must be running my back tire into the ground. I guess I should probably buy a new one soon.

KRUSTYburger · Post by **KRUSTYburger** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 3:16 pm

Tocsik wrote:I get about 4K on my rear tires. Front lasts forever.

what they said ^

Actually I've had the same front tire on for probably close to 10k miles and it barely looks worn at all... Probably because I wheelie everywhere I go (j/k). I like the Pirelli SL26 the best so far for traction, and also the Michelin M1s are pretty good. I'm about to try the Prima whitewalls on my p200 since the stinkos are LAME and squirrely and unsafe. Especially if you like the twisties.

Hellvis · Post by **Hellvis** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 3:59 pm

ericalm wrote:
Hellvis wrote:I will try next the tire you guys have mentioned here and see what I can get out of those lol
The Heidenaus are more expensive than most of the others, but my devotion to them borders on religious. They really transformed the handling of my LX. Many people who have them feel similarly about them.

Hey Eric, it really looks you are passionate about them, which I highly appreciate overall that you take the time and effort to help out and give you honest opinion on everything.

I have for now purchased the Vredestein but will definilty check out the Heidenaus after I am done with th Vredestein's.

Stormswift · Post by **Stormswift** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 4:23 pm

I am too new at this so I am soaking in all of this information. Since I cannot check tire pressure while the bike is in hibernation for the winter (too much trouble to uncover it, get in there, drag it to where I can inflate it.....So I used a prop to keep the front tire about 2-3 centimeters off the ground and the back tire is also suspended. I do not know if this will help but my hope is that with both tires off the ground I will prevent damage to one spot that connects to the ground . I do not ride a lot, mostly on weekends, country roads with very few traffic lights if any at all. I am no lightweight by any means but I ride alone so not much pressure on the tires. I check pressure every month and keep it at recommended psi's. I do not have a top case. I considered it but with all of the problems I had with installing the rear rack I am not sure I want to put any pressure on that area

MYSCTR · Post by **MYSCTR** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 7:56 pm

We ride international 150's & mine is at 9,996.9 miles. The front looks fine - will get me 13-14K I figure.

The rear was over inflated for the first 1700 miles (based on the tire max pressure) and I ran it to 4,400 miles and had threads showing yet the second rear tire got me to 9K and it was time to replace it.

We did go with the new Prima white wall tire on the rears and will see how that goes as we are also looking for a longer lasting tire all due to the cost of changing them. It has 1,000 miles on it and still looks brand new. We even wanted to rotate them way back to change them as a set each time yet the labor makes that cost prohibitive.

Most of my riding was with a top case and the daily commute rotates from 8 miles each way to what could easily be 60-120 miles in a day with several stops.

We will have to check out the Heidenau K61s when we are ready for the next set which should be about 13.5k or May of this year.

Post by **jmazza** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 8:37 pm

I've only gotten about 3.5k on my rear tires (original Shinko ww and Michelin S1).

I attribute it to the fact that I take off as fast as possible, whenever possible. Isn't that part of the fun of owning a scooter?!

I need to try the Heidenaus if they last that much longer! It's not the expense of the tire but the labor that is the killer.

HowHH · Post by **HowHH** » Sun Feb 06, 2011 8:38 pm

MYSCTR wrote:We did go with the new Prima white wall tire on the rears and will see how that goes as we are also looking for a longer lasting tire all due to the cost of changing them. It has 1,000 miles on it and still looks brand new. We even wanted to rotate them way back to change them as a set each time yet the labor makes that cost prohibitive.

How do you like the Prima white walls? I had seriously considered them when the original rear Maxxis white wall was due for a change (about 3800 miles to the wear bars). I wasn't committed to retaining the look of the whitewalls. I was mainly looking for something fairly sticky with higher than a J rating and the K61's had many good reviews on the Modern Vespa forum so I thought I'd give them a try.

You're right about the prohibitive cost of labor for a tire change. I couldn't believe the price the dealer quoted. Because of that I'll be taking the front and rear wheels off and see if I can change out the tires myself. If I have difficulty getting the tires off or on the wheel, I can just bring the wheels into any scooter or motorcycle shop and avoid the labor cost of removing and replacing the wheels on the scooter itself. I'm thinking that the 10" wheels may actually be more difficult than a motorcycle wheel. The bead of the smaller diameter tire seems more rigid.

MYSCTR · Post by **MYSCTR** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 3:42 am

How do you like the Prima white walls? I had seriously considered them ... I wasn't committed to retaining the look of the whitewalls. I was mainly looking for something fairly sticky with higher than a J rating...

You're right about the prohibitive cost of labor for a tire change. I couldn't believe the price the dealer quoted. Because of that I'll be taking the front and rear wheels off and see if I can change out the tires myself...

With only 1,000 miles on the Prima – can’t really say other then it has performed great so far. Probably somewhat better then the Maxxis did. We really wanted to go for 4 tires on 2 scooters, yet as I did not hit 10K and my front still looks so great, that idea didn’t work. We wanted to keep the WW as the fronts were still the Maxxis WW tires yet I was willing to go to a black wall if we switched all 4 at one time. I agree on the rating - kind of wished the K61's were rated a bit higher yet they are better than the Mich S-1 tire rating which is why we did not go with them.

We too are looking to figure out the tire changing deal as we have three scooters total. Really, with about 30 bikes in the stable that we tech, how hard can a scooter tire be? Just got to get the right equipment I am sure. Nothing a little soap and water couldn't help I am sure.

I am looking forward to bringing in 4 new K-61’s and running them. It looks like we need to verify if we can run a 120 on the front and the 130 on the rear. The wider tire also has a heavier weight rating which should help the life of the rear tire. Come on spring - it is time to ride!

jmkjr72 · Post by **jmkjr72** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 3:47 am

well i guess that would be directly proprtional to how many burn outs i do

honestly the first 2 rear tires on my stella with no burn outs only lasted about 1500 miles each

my zuma on the other hand the oem was still good till around 6000

and it still went even more miles and i had a heck of a time blowing it out doing a burn out

MYSCTR · Post by **MYSCTR** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 4:11 am

jmazza wrote:I've only gotten about 3.5k on my rear tires (original Shinko ww and Michelin S1).

I attribute it to the fact that I take off as fast as possible, whenever possible. Isn't that part of the fun of owning a scooter?!

I do the same - heading south into Dallas i run the service road and can play the lights pretty good yet when I stop I try to get an open lane to get on the line to take off quick and get away from the traffic (of course checking for cross traffic first). I would not want to ride if my tires only lasted 3,500 miles! I thought 4,500 was bad and want better. Heck, I even gave up on the 2500 mile racing tires for the road bikes and switched everyone to 3,500 - 4,000 mile tires since they cost about the same as our scooter tires! Of course it just takes a little longer to hit that many miles on a bike.

HowHH · Post by **HowHH** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 3:12 pm

MYSCTR wrote:I agree on the rating - kind of wished the K61's were rated a bit higher

The K61'a have a speed rating of "M", 81 mph, in the 100/90-10 Buddy size. More than enough of a speed cushion for me. The Buddy will hit 65mph GPS, but feels twitchy at that speed. I'm looking forward to trying out the K61's to see if they improve stability. At this point I'm not sure if that's due to the bike's geometry, 10" wheels, or stock tires (or some combo). The front tire has very little wear at 3800 miles, so does not need to be changed out for that reason. Changing it mainly to see if it makes a difference in handling.

It looks like we need to verify if we can run a 120 on the front and the 130 on the rear.

You thinking of upsizing? I wonder if the wider tire would have enough clearance from the various components? I would also be interested in how the Buddy would handle with a wider tire. Very nimble with the stock tire size.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 4:15 pm

Heidenaus just freaking rock!

Post by **ericalm** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 6:18 pm

HowHH wrote:
MYSCTR wrote:I agree on the rating - kind of wished the K61's were rated a bit higher
The K61'a have a speed rating of "M", 81 mph, in the 100/90-10 Buddy size. More than enough of a speed cushion for me. The Buddy will hit 65mph GPS, but feels twitchy at that speed. I'm looking forward to trying out the K61's to see if they improve stability. At this point I'm not sure if that's due to the bike's geometry, 10" wheels, or stock tires (or some combo). The front tire has very little wear at 3800 miles, so does not need to be changed out for that reason. Changing it mainly to see if it makes a difference in handling.

High speed stability and handling is really what sold me on the Heidenaus in the end. We did 2 days of WOT freeway riding coming back from San Jose last year and the difference between riding this way with other tires was just profound. Changing lanes had been scary at 70mph before; now I was confident swerving, zipping around cars, etc.

Of course, there's only so much you can do when riding a lightweight scoot doing 65+ on 10" tires!

HowHH · Post by **HowHH** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 8:26 pm

ericalm wrote:We did 2 days of WOT freeway riding coming back from San Jose last year and the difference between riding this way with other tires was just profound. Changing lanes had been scary at 70mph before; now I was confident swerving, zipping around cars, etc.

Which bike were you riding? You must have had a few WTF looks from the cars you were passing. I think that myself sometimes if I happen to look down and see 70+ BPMH

.

superseagulls · Post by **superseagulls** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 8:56 pm

Do they make the Heidenau K61 with a whitewall? May be interested if they do!
Edit, I saw these online, may be the way to go, anyone seen them in the USA, or used them?
Edit (again), Sitting down and thinking about it, they probably aren't a particularly good idea to have on a scooter, if one comes off you're toast,
So the best whitewall tire (10") is...........? Suggestions please!

jmkjr72 · Post by **jmkjr72** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 9:57 pm

ive got a friend that has them on his ruck
you can get them thru scooterworks and a few tire places online

Post by **ericalm** » Mon Feb 07, 2011 10:52 pm

superseagulls wrote:Do they make the Heidenau K61 with a whitewall?

Nope. It's really much more of a road/race type tread than you'd find on any whitewalls; it'd look a bit weird. They do make some (K38) with a more "classic" tread, but I don't know anyone riding on them. Maybe when I replace the S1s on the Stella…

K61 (M rated for up to 81mph):

K38 (J rated for up to 62mph):

Worth noting that not all of their tires get rave reviews. The K58s, in particular, are pretty hard and rough to ride on. Some are great for winter and wet weather but the composition isn't right for touring and warm weather.

Unfortunately, the high-performance options for whitewalls are pretty scant. Most are J-rated and have a tread designed for cruising. The good ones (Maxxis, Conti, etc.) still perform pretty well under most conditions and riding. I'd have gone with the Maxxis on my Stella (these come stock on Buddy Internationals) if they'd been in stock at the time.

You can also paint your tires (there are some tutorials online) if you really want whitewalls!

iMoses · Post by **iMoses** » Tue Feb 08, 2011 6:58 pm

I have a 2007 Buddy 125 with 7,488 miles... and the original tires... yes front and back!

sunshinen · Post by **sunshinen** » Wed Feb 16, 2011 8:08 pm

I have 12k on the front tire, and the back has just been replaced for the 2nd time (so avg of 6k)

Hellvis · Post by **Hellvis** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 2:17 am

...and I got a gojilliionmillion miles on my original tires......

Stop already we got it, you guys got somehow higher mileage, flywheight or so....lol

I must be an extraordinary heavy duty rider lol...anyways I got the Vredestein's now and I'll keep you guys posted how well these tires hold up.

sunshinen · Post by **sunshinen** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 8:56 pm

It's obviously not a scientific study, but still, I think the more people who chime in on these types of questions, the better perspective we have -- both in terms of average wear and tear and in terms of realizing the reality of "your mileage may vary".

Hellvis · Post by **Hellvis** » Thu Feb 17, 2011 10:19 pm

Very true, I was just kidding around. I thought it was just so funny that all these guys got so much more mileage than me.

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 10:35 pm

hi guys

what say you about cheap-o tires? i found these and reviews for other tires for this brand are decent, but idk?

i am just doing some shopping and am stocking up on a few things for future use. thought i'd go ahead and get a tire or two for when the time comes:

http://www.amazon.com/Kenda-K413-Front- ... sbs_auto_1

about $70 for a pair, shipped to my door

i could wait, I suppose. but i read the Agility tires start to lose grip somewhat early on. some say to change them out sooner then later. more investigation is needed, perhaps?

but does lower price always mean lower quality?

Post by **ericalm** » Fri Feb 18, 2011 11:55 pm

JHScoot wrote:but does lower price always mean lower quality?

Not any more than higher price always means higher quality. As with helmets and many other things, it boils down to: Sometimes, yes, but as a rule, not always.

Many of those recommended here are pretty moderately priced. Kendas have a pretty good reputation but I don't know anyone who's used them. Average (full retail) prices for most good tires run from about $35-$50 each.

Tire preference is as subjective as tire longevity. There are tires from Michelin and Pirelli that I thought were "just okay." I've disliked any Savas I've ridden on, but even they have some fans.

peabody99 · Post by **peabody99** » Sat Jun 18, 2011 2:24 am

peabody99 wrote:my stock tires made it to 7000. The rear was most in need of changing. I have zippy continentials on now-3400 miles on them, and they are doing well.

as people may know my zippy on the buddy opinion changed given the rear is now bald at 4400 miles. I like Zippy on the vespa-in fact got another rear because it lasted longer than pirelli or michellin (sp), but I am ticked off with them on the bud. I am getting a Kenda rear tire installed. Motorsport said to give it a whirl when I asked for a durability- moderate economy combo. I will report back...

Lotrat · Post by **Lotrat** » Sat Jun 18, 2011 1:44 pm

You're right about the prohibitive cost of labor for a tire change. I couldn't believe the price the dealer quoted. Because of that I'll be taking the front and rear wheels off and see if I can change out the tires myself...

MYSCTR wrote:...We too are looking to figure out the tire changing deal as we have three scooters total. Really, with about 30 bikes in the stable that we tech, how hard can a scooter tire be? Just got to get the right equipment I am sure. Nothing a little soap and water couldn't help I am sure.

I got a flat with only 100 miles on my new scooter. I pulled it off myself. It wasn't that big of a deal. You can pop the bead by standing on the tire. I pulled the tire off the rim by hand and only needed some gentle persuasion to get it back on with a tire spoon... Ok I used a screw driver, but I'm good at cheating.

superseagulls wrote:...Edit, I saw these online, may be the way to go, anyone seen them in the USA, or used them?Edit (again), Sitting down and thinking about it, they probably aren't a particularly good idea to have on a scooter, if one comes off you're toast, So the best whitewall tire (10") is...........? Suggestions please!

They are called Portawalls. They've been around along time. If they are installed properly then they "shouldn't" fall out on you. I still don't think I would ever run them. I also grew up hating whitewalls just because you had to clean them all the time. SOS pads are cheap, but the job sucks.

zilla86 · Post by **zilla86** » Sat Jun 18, 2011 3:29 pm

I only have 800 miles on my Blackjack but I will run nothing but Continental Zippy 1 tires in the future.

My Blackjack came with these tires and I have been so impressed with the handling in both wet and dry conditions that I will make this my standard tire for all seasons.

They are a real bargain costing less then $40.00 bucks a tire.

http://www.motorcycle-superstore.com/5/ ... -Tire.aspx

robby · Post by **robby** » Sat Jun 18, 2011 5:29 pm

Eric (or others), would you recommend the Heidenau K61 as a replacement tire for a Roughhouse that is used year-round in New England? I'd love to get something that would last longer than stock, but not sure how those treads would do in wet weather.

Post by **ericalm** » Sat Jun 18, 2011 9:27 pm

robby wrote:Eric (or others), would you recommend the Heidenau K61 as a replacement tire for a Roughhouse that is used year-round in New England? I'd love to get something that would last longer than stock, but not sure how those treads would do in wet weather.

They do well in wet weather, but we certainly don't get as much of it as you will. From what I hear the K58s are great for winter and wet but not so good for dry riding in warmer months.

robby · Post by **robby** » Sun Jun 19, 2011 1:50 pm

ericalm wrote:
robby wrote:Eric (or others), would you recommend the Heidenau K61 as a replacement tire for a Roughhouse that is used year-round in New England? I'd love to get something that would last longer than stock, but not sure how those treads would do in wet weather.
They do well in wet weather, but we certainly don't get as much of it as you will. From what I hear the K58s are great for winter and wet but not so good for dry riding in warmer months.

Thanks, will probably go for the K61s then unless I feel like doing seasonal changes. Any recs on where to find them?

sotied · Post by **sotied** » Sun Jun 19, 2011 10:25 pm

I got about 6000+ on my original tires. Always properly inflated, I weigh 190 and ride pretty conservatively. Got a set of Zippys on there now and I'm up to 9000 miles with no appreciable wear on the new set.

Hope they're good until 12000 or more.