ride leading

[skully93]

I have led small group rides before, but in the next few weeks, I'll be leading my first official large, open ride to a couple of cemetery/park locations. It will be 50cc friendly, and I plan to scout the route with another set of eyes as soon as possible.

Though I think I have an OK grasp, and have been asked by club leaders to fill in as a sub on other occasions, I wanted to pose it to MB.

So, for the more experienced among you:

What do you do special when leading rides?

What kind of presence to you maintain during the ride to keep it cohesive?

I'm always down to learn and improve!

[az_slynch]

Things I've observed from HowardR's SIRs rides:

- Pre-ride meeting: Offer a general overview of the route, set an expectation of achieved speeds, review the group riding hand signals, identify new riders, designate sweep rider and road guards if available

- Rideout: position new riders near the front of the group and surround them with experienced riders. Keep the newbies in your mirror so you know how they're holding up.

- Traffic signals: If the group gets split, pull the ride over at the next safe place and allow the lagging riders to catch up. Otherwise, call it a drop ride and pick capable sweep riders to keep it all moving.

Just a few things off the top of my head.

[BuddyRaton]

Plan your route...and don't let people talk you out of it. I get people asking me to lead and then telling me which way to go...nope...I'm leading...follow me.

To the above I would suggest reviewing group riding techniques before the ride. Many new riders don't know how to ride in a group and don't even know what to ask. If you tell everybody...nobody is embarrased.

I always try to keep an experienced rider as a "floater". If someone is cramming, or just not doing a very good job the floater can pull up next to them at a light to give some pointers.

On a recent ride I had someone cramming my rear wheel. At a light I nicley said that if I needed to swerve to miss something we were both going down...she took it well and did great the rest of the ride.


We were all new at some point.

Have fun and give us a ride report!

[jmer1234]

Know your limits. I put forward a month or so ago that I was going for some BBQ, and the next thing I knew I was leading my first long ride. I had everything planned, route mapped, and successfully fought off the in progress alternate routes that BuddyRaton is predicting. What I did not anticipate was getting tired toward the end. While I feel I did not get dangerous in my riding, I did start to lose some concentration and forgot to make sure everybody was together. After a long, fast stretch the group got broken up, and in danger of losing some on the twisty back country roads. Next time, I will try to be more aware of this and pay extra attention to the group as we all start to get tired.

[Stormswift]

Review the rules before you set out: checker formation, keeping diistance from other riders especially on the turns, keeping place in formation, etc. There is always at least one individual in any group who joined because they thought riding a scooter means no need to have any rules during the ride and they can be quite belligerent when they find out it ain't so.

[Skootz Kabootz]

I recommend getting a copy of Proficient Motorcycling by David Hough and reading the chapter on group riding (Actually, I recommend reading the entire book. There is lots of must know info in there).

Beyond that, it goes without saying, be sure you know your route well so you know ahead of time what you will encounter along the way.

[Howardr]

* Spend a LOT of time looking in your rear view mirror. I have been on too many group rides where the leader takes off and never looks behind him. Next you know most of the group is trying to figure out when in the heck we are suppose to be going as we watch the leader ride out of sight.
* When people talk about proper distance from the other bikes, most assume that you mean not to be too close. The biggest problem, for me, is the opposite. I get people drifting 3-4 seconds behind the rider in front of them. This makes cagers think they are welcome to cut into the middle of the formation. It also makes it more difficult to get the group through stop lights.
* Know your stoplights. If a light has been green a while as you're approaching it, you probably won't get everyone through it. If you just slow down on the approach, you can catch the light red and let everyone go through it together.
* Avoid left turns whenever possible. I'll take a group a few miles out of the way to avoid a left turn across a busy street.
* If you have out of town folks, make sure there are some locals nearby to help them out if they get separated from the group.
* If everyone doesn't know the route, at least they know where the destination is. In the event of separation, at least they can meet up at the end. Passing out ride maps helps.

That's a long enough post for now

Howard

[skully93]

great responses gang, much appreciated.

I DO have proficient motorcycling, which I plan to read through again. I also try my best to designate some helpers, and I'll hand out some copies of the map (with my phone) just in case.

Keep 'em coming!

[ericalm]

We require everyone to read our Group Riding Guidelines and Group Policies before joining a ride. They have to acknowledge they've read them when RSVPing, one benefit of using Meetrup to organize these.

Below are some things that you probably already do, some you may not. I just pasted from a list I send ride leaders!

Here are some general instructions we use for our pre-ride announcement:

• Introduce yourself as ride leader. Point out your sweeper and other helpers. Note which scooter your sweeper's on.
• Indicate which direction you're leaving from.
• Give a brief overview of the route, stops and any potential hazards or issues along the way (construction, road conditions, etc.)
• Basic formation: Staggered in traffic, single file in curves. Explain that staggering is to allow room for riders to move to sides if there are obstacles.
• Emphasize the importance of staying in formation, even if you have to make a U-turn or something like that.
• If gaps in the formation occur, fill them by moving forward into the space rather then from one side to the other.
• Let them know that the group will stop and make sure everyone's accounted for before making any turns.
• All riders should keep an eye on the scooters in front of them. If they all do this, they won't have to worry about who's behind them.
• Obey traffic laws. Do not rush to get through a yellow light. No one gets left behind. If necessary, group will pull over to the side of the road. Riders should be extra careful when pulling to the side of the road and merging with traffic.
• Stay in one lane behind the ride leader.
• Remind everyone they should ride within their capabilities and comfort level.
• Remind everyone that they are responsible for themselves and their own safety.
• If for whatever reason, a member needs to pull over, leave the group or can't continue, they should communicate why to the ride leader or sweeper.

A few tips for the ride leader:

• Take a headcount. Try to make note of the scooters in the group.
• Look for your sweeper at every light and before making turns.
• Avoid left turns. Plan the route for intersections with arrows if possible.
• If you must make a left on a light without an arrow, try to wait until it's clear enough for the whole group. Look ahead for a good place to pull over after the turn, too.
• Watch the crosswalk signals and countdowns to try to gauge when lights will turn yellow. Slow the group if necessary. Better to stop for a red then split the group on a yellow.
• Go faster when lights turn green to provide space behind you, then slow down.
• Do not turn right on red unless you know the entire group can make it. Otherwise, wait for green.
• Minimize lane changes. If there's a lot of traffic turning into and out of right lanes and backing up at intersections and driveways, the left lane is fine.
• If you need to pull the group over, make sure it's somewhere with plenty of room behind you. Pulling the group over can be one of the most dangerous things we do with a group. When pulling back into traffic, make sure everyone has room and time to do so.

[Scooterboi]

Nicely done, Eric.

[Howardr]

I learned very early on: Do NOT pull off the side of the road where it is not paved.

Whenever possible, ride the route by yourself or with a friend before the ride. This will tell you if there is new construction, if there is a particularly tricky corner (we have one called "scooter killer curve" due to a couple of unfortunate accidents) and help you know which lanes to ride in to make the necessary turns.

I've never heeded this advice but I have been told that if you have more than 10 bikes, you should consider dividing the ride into smaller groups. This, though, requires having multiple ride leaders and sweepers. We don't generally have that.

Wow! We sure are full of advice, aren't we?

Howard

[az_slynch]

I've never heeded this advice but I have been told that if you have more than 10 bikes, you should consider dividing the ride into smaller groups. This, though, requires having multiple ride leaders and sweepers. We don't generally have that.

The last El Scoot worked with 33 bikes. It was cohesive for almost the entire ride. We only had trouble when people didn't gas up before the ride and didn't gas up at the last stop.

Heck, dirt pulloffs are less of an issue than making sure that participant riders know which brake lever works which brake and how to use them in a given situation.

[charlie55]

A lot of this also hinges upon the environment in which the group is riding. For example, fragmentation isn't much of an issue if you're on a nice long stretch of rural backroads. Dense urban areas, with tons of traffic control are a whole other thing.

Another thing I've noticed in my experiences is that the formation tends to deteriorate in direct proportion to the scenic value of the route. The prettier or more interesting the venue, the more the tendency to start eyeballing the "attractions".

When I ride with a group, I tend to take the sweep position simply because I find that the responsibility of keeping the "herd" intact interferes with concentrating on what's ahead of me. Multitasking is not one of my strong suits. Also, I don't have to worry about a newbie or distracted rider climbing up my tail when we come to a stop (happened to me twice). Just a personal preference on my part.

[iMoses]

Eric, I'm gonna "borrow" your guidelines

We have a few new members that joined over the winter. So they've not had a chance to participate in group riding.


Thank you!

We require everyone to read our Group Riding Guidelines and Group Policies before joining a ride. They have to acknowledge they've read them when RSVPing, one benefit of using Meetrup to organize these.

Below are some things that you probably already do, some you may not. I just pasted from a list I send ride leaders!

Here are some general instructions we use for our pre-ride announcement:

• Introduce yourself as ride leader. Point out your sweeper and other helpers. Note which scooter your sweeper's on.
• Indicate which direction you're leaving from.
• Give a brief overview of the route, stops and any potential hazards or issues along the way (construction, road conditions, etc.)
• Basic formation: Staggered in traffic, single file in curves. Explain that staggering is to allow room for riders to move to sides if there are obstacles.
• Emphasize the importance of staying in formation, even if you have to make a U-turn or something like that.
• If gaps in the formation occur, fill them by moving forward into the space rather then from one side to the other.
• Let them know that the group will stop and make sure everyone's accounted for before making any turns.
• All riders should keep an eye on the scooters in front of them. If they all do this, they won't have to worry about who's behind them.
• Obey traffic laws. Do not rush to get through a yellow light. No one gets left behind. If necessary, group will pull over to the side of the road. Riders should be extra careful when pulling to the side of the road and merging with traffic.
• Stay in one lane behind the ride leader.
• Remind everyone they should ride within their capabilities and comfort level.
• Remind everyone that they are responsible for themselves and their own safety.
• If for whatever reason, a member needs to pull over, leave the group or can't continue, they should communicate why to the ride leader or sweeper.

A few tips for the ride leader:

• Take a headcount. Try to make note of the scooters in the group.
• Look for your sweeper at every light and before making turns.
• Avoid left turns. Plan the route for intersections with arrows if possible.
• If you must make a left on a light without an arrow, try to wait until it's clear enough for the whole group. Look ahead for a good place to pull over after the turn, too.
• Watch the crosswalk signals and countdowns to try to gauge when lights will turn yellow. Slow the group if necessary. Better to stop for a red then split the group on a yellow.
• Go faster when lights turn green to provide space behind you, then slow down.
• Do not turn right on red unless you know the entire group can make it. Otherwise, wait for green.
• Minimize lane changes. If there's a lot of traffic turning into and out of right lanes and backing up at intersections and driveways, the left lane is fine.
• If you need to pull the group over, make sure it's somewhere with plenty of room behind you. Pulling the group over can be one of the most dangerous things we do with a group. When pulling back into traffic, make sure everyone has room and time to do so.

[ericalm]

I've never heeded this advice but I have been told that if you have more than 10 bikes, you should consider dividing the ride into smaller groups. This, though, requires having multiple ride leaders and sweepers. We don't generally have that.

In general, for in-city rides we run with a leader and sweeper for up to 12 scooters, then add 1-2 helpers for every additional 12 or so, depending on the route. At 40 scooters, we split into two groups. That's a leader, a sweeper and at least one helper for each group.

The helper has a few functions. If we're blocking, they'll assist with that. We try to avoid blocking when possible. If the group gets split up due to a traffic light, etc., that helper will take charge of the split-off group until we're reunited.

Longer, out of the city rides where we're less likely to encounter, we'll have a leader, sweeper and maybe one helper for every 24 or so people. We'll also usually use our comm units on these — I have one and the sweeper has one — especially since we can't always see or know where the tail of the group is. These have proven invaluable in many rides, saving a lot of time and confusion. They've also helped in the unfortunate instances when there have been crashes.

Unfortunately, the larger and more successful your group becomes, the more time and effort has to go into planning. The founder of our group handed it over to me after planning one ride. We had 15 members then. We now have close to 1,000, with over 200 actually active and coming out for rides fairly frequently. That means that EVERYTHING takes more time and we have to put a lot more into planning and creating routes.

We're doing a second pre-ride of for those helping to run our next ride at their request because the route is so convoluted. And that's after I've tweaked the map numerous times based on the first two times we did this with smaller groups.

[BootScootin'FireFighter]

I personally am a bit of a worry wart and don't like leading more than 10. That's a fairly large group to lead alone. More than that, as others have mentioned, requires deputizing some other group members who are competent and experienced. Publish and distribute the route to the group in advance, and try not to deviate if possible. Plan rest stops about every 30 miles for the overactive bladders. Pick spots that have adequate fuel and restroom capabilities for the size of the group. Avoid densly populated areas if possible, and if need be, plan for regrouping locations after those busy segments. Hand signals and proper spacing are big factors to remind everyone of. And finally, post your cellphone number on the route incase someone has to bail or gets split up.

[JHScoot]

forget leading rides i will be bringing up the rear as i am told it is a hassle free position to be. as in avoiding hassles with other riders

my last group ride i was middle of the pack and a rider barked at me to "leave more room" even though he could have easily done the same. he couldn't even hold a line on his scoot, either. or at least was not trying :/

some dude was riding in front of me without a brake light but hey i didn't complain!!