Interesting new factory bobber MC from Yamaha

Post by **jrsjr** » Sat Mar 09, 2013 10:15 pm

$7990 basic. $8290 as shown with remote reservoir shocks and matte-gray paint. Info here. Wonder who did the design work on that? They got the look just about exactly right. That's the first metric v-twin that ever really spoke to me. Wonder if it's comfy?

Tocsik · Post by **Tocsik** » Sat Mar 09, 2013 10:38 pm

I agree, looks good.
This seems odd, though: "Despite the cast wheels, both tires require tubes. "

Post by **jrsjr** » Sat Mar 09, 2013 10:42 pm

Tocsik wrote:This seems odd, though: "Despite the cast wheels, both tires require tubes. "

Dunno. I'm clueless.

Maybe those wheels are cast in pieces to hold costs down?

neotrotsky · Post by **neotrotsky** » Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:47 am

Meh. I mean, you can never go wrong with Yamaha but the big,e is kind of uninspiring, especially for the price. Now, if they brought a UJM in the 350-600 CC range, THEN that would stand out. To me this is kind of like that factory Honda "chopper" a feel years ago. Not bad but kind of "me too" and a bit overpriced

ohiotj · Post by **ohiotj** » Mon Mar 11, 2013 5:17 pm

I kind of like it, especailly the foot position, but the seat might be a bit low for me. Of course, thats easy to change.

Kind of funny seeing the some of the comments below that article about it vs a Sportster. One thing not mentioned so far is it weighs about a 100 pounds less than the Harley. When I looked at Sportsters for myself a ways back, that was one of the problems I had. Of course, I was looking at an XR1200, which had a higher center of gravity than other models.

Post by **jrsjr** » Mon Mar 11, 2013 7:09 pm

ohiotj wrote:I kind of like it, especailly the foot position, but the seat might be a bit low for me. Of course, thats easy to change.

Kind of funny seeing the some of the comments below that article about it vs a Sportster. One thing not mentioned so far is it weighs about a 100 pounds less than the Harley. When I looked at Sportsters for myself a ways back, that was one of the problems I had. Of course, I was looking at an XR1200, which had a higher center of gravity than other models.

Yeah, I had a 2008 1200R Sportster and I feel very sure this bike would kick the Sportster's derriere. There's a lot to like about this bike. Did you notice the remote reservoir rear shocks on the +$300 version? There's a shiny paint job version available, but I like the understated matte paint job. We're just talking here, right? Nobody get all upset. I just think that this bike shows that Yamaha is listening to the US market. For US motorcyclists and scooterists* this is a good thing.

*As he deftly drops in a scooter reference to give this thread a modicum of scooter site cred.

P.S. I try to avoid reading the comments in articles about new motorcycles. When did motorcyclists become a bunch of whiny complainers, anyway?

ohiotj · Post by **ohiotj** » Tue Mar 12, 2013 6:28 pm

jrsjr wrote: P.S. I try to avoid reading the comments in articles about new motorcycles. When did motorcyclists become a bunch of whiny complainers, anyway?

Probably as soon as the were at least two different companies making motorcycles

For $300, the upgrades seem worth it. I'm more of a shiny paint person, but I'd just shell out the extra cash, and see if I could trade the tank/fenders with someone else. Then again, its all hypothetical for me right now. Two scoots and a race car are taking all my spare money as it is

rsrider · Post by **rsrider** » Tue Mar 12, 2013 7:49 pm

neotrotsky wrote:Meh. I mean, you can never go wrong with Yamaha but the big,e is kind of uninspiring, especially for the price. Now, if they brought a UJM in the 350-600 CC range, THEN that would stand out. To me this is kind of like that factory Honda "chopper" a feel years ago. Not bad but kind of "me too" and a bit overpriced

You can get the real thing, H-D Sportster 1200, for about the same price. And, Hardleys don't have the reliability issues that people keep bringing up because of their AFM days and prior. The block head engine is pretty bullet proof. I had Sporty when the block head was first introduced to them...I think it was an '86, and that ran fine.

But I too would drop the extra $300 for the R-Spec, then I would set it on fire and chuck it off a cliff.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Tue Mar 12, 2013 9:19 pm

To me. it looks better with different paint.

Post by **jrsjr** » Tue Mar 12, 2013 9:53 pm

rsrider wrote:But I too would drop the extra $300 for the R-Spec, then I would set it on fire and chuck it off a cliff.

Don't hold back, rsrider. Tell us how you really feel!

Seriously, have you looked at the 2013 Sportster lineup? Is there a bike in 2013 Sportster lineup that you would pick over the Bolt? I don't like the fat-front-tire look on the 2013 "1200 Custom" and the "48" model Sportsters. In profile, it makes both those Sportsters look like a Pep Boys big-wheel minibike. I really hate the look. And the "72" has that huge skinny front hoop combined with the peanut tank that gives it an odd spindly look which strikes me as being completely off the mark. That leaves... the "Low" and the "Iron 883" which are both 883s that aren't in the same performance category as the Bolt, so I'd pass on those and that would leave... nothing! You see what I mean?

Also, as you know, HD stuffs it to you on extra costs on the delivery and setup of a new bike, to the tune of what? $1500? In the case of the Sportster, it amounts to a very significant percentage of the price of the bike. I haven't bought a new Yamaha recently, so I don't know how bad they are, but it can't be as unreasonable as on the HD.

By the time you pay shipping and dealer prep, swap the exhaust, the air filter, and the shocks on a Sportster to get it to perform anything like the Bolt R and swap the seat to make it look as good as the one on the Bolt R, that $10,499 Sportster 1200 Custom has easily become a $17,000 Sportster. I feel pretty sure that is where Yamaha has sensed an opening for the Bolt R, for which they charge a whole $8290 including the performance shocks and premium seat. It's less than half the real price of what it actually costs to purchase and modify a new Sportster. That's huge!

Again, we're just talking here. Don't anybody blow a fuse, especially since we've invoked the HD brand name. Also, please, be advised, I bought a new 2008 XL1200R Sportster, so I'm pretty familiar with the performance of the 1200 FI Sportsters and the exorbitant prices that HD dealers charge for delivery and setup and the unbelievable prices they charge for parts and labor on modifications. In the new normal economy, I can't see folks lining up to pay those prices any more.

Post by **Lostmycage** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 4:10 am

I like that Yamaha. I don't love it, but if I had the garage space and money, I could see myself making room for it.

rsrider · Post by **rsrider** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 7:40 am

That rear disk is a monster........how did I miss that? Are they encouraging people to form bad braking habits? I've seen a lot of attempts to take a bite out of the Hardley pie, and they just don't seem to work. I do agree that this bike will be better in almost all performance, reliability, and serviceability aspects than the H-D because the Japanese do not just copy, they improve. So we will see..... I can't be a motorcycle snob anymore, because I haven't ridden my MC's for months with any frequency. I take them out "when needed" and that about it.

The "set it fire and chuck it off a cliff" line is such an obscure Brit motorcycle blurb that I really didn't expect anyone to get it..............

Syd · Post by **Syd** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 6:28 pm

The "set it fire and chuck it off a cliff" line is such an obscure Brit motorcycle blurb that I really didn't expect anyone to get it..............

Obscure indeed! It's so obscure it's almost recursive. Search Google for that quote (in quotes) and the one result is this thread. Like, woh.

Post by **jrsjr** » Wed Mar 13, 2013 8:43 pm

Again, I'm just really pleased that one of the big motorcycle makers is paying some attention to the US market. Have you heard about all this stuff that's happening with American Suzuki? Apparently, their bankruptcy plan was approved and American Suzuki officially ceased to exist yesterday. Of course, there will be a new entity with a new name, Suzuki Motor of America, Inc. However, the new entity is a wholly-owned subsidiary of corporate Suzuki which, again, is not going to make them more responsive to the US market.

To make matters worse, have you all been following the story about Suzuki being slapped with a $3M fine for violating CARB regs? I don't like the idea that CARB is punishing Suzuki for making it too easy to modify motorcycles. That sets a precedent which will have an impact on all manufacturers who sell their products in the state of California, the largest motorbike market in the United States. So, the anti-motorcycle folks picked a weakened company in the largest market and prosecuted a case that sets a precedent for the whole industry in their largest market? Wow! What a coincidence, eh?

That case will have an impact on scooter makers*, too, because California is, by far and away, their largest US market. It always takes a while for the impact of such cases to be clarified, but it's not something for enthusiasts to be happy about.

*Please note deft insertion of second reference to scooters in this thread.

rsrider · Post by **rsrider** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 1:20 am

I can't be a motorcycle snob anymore, because I haven't ridden my MC's for months with any frequency. I take them out "when needed" and that about it.

Damn, I cursed myself. It was a really nice day today and decided to run a few errands on the Buddy, and when I started it up I fouled the plug because I hadn't ridden it for so long. No time to clean it, so I jumped in the Solstice. Returned home, pulled the plug, cleaned it up, and then rampaged, yes Mickey rampaged, around the outskirts of the berg. It ran fine. Note to self: ride your motorcycles/scooter.

Milt · Post by **Milt** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 4:22 am

Interesting, but it's still a fake Harley.

The Yamaha thing is still a bit ugly, but not as bad as their earlier attempts. I agree with the earlier comment about the current Sportster line-up, for the most part. The older Sportster 1200s were the 'Universal American Motorcycle', but the new ones are becoming too niche oriented.

The wet weight of the new Yamaha is given at 540 pounds, about halfway between the old rigid-mount (engine) versions and the current rubber-mount bikes. The power output is given at 50 hp, a bit less than the 61-65 hp you get from a typical 1200 Sportster. I saw no mention of fuel economy, but I rather doubt that it will do much better or worse than the 55-60 mpg that Sportsters seem to get (only four actual samples for me - your mileage, as they say, may vary...).

Overall, I'll stick to pre-2007 (I can work on carburetors, but not fuel injection) Sportsters for general MC use...

Someone mentioned 'bad braking habits' being encouraged by the large rear disc brake on the new Yamaha - actually, because of the wheelbase and weight distribution on this type of bike, the rear brake can do considerably more work than it can on a typical modern sport bike.

Regarding serviceability and reliability, the past two decades of Harley Davidson bikes seem to be in the same ballpark as a good Japanese bike. I would not have switched over to the dark side were that not the case. Also, not needing to lube the chain or adjust the valves kind of grows on you after a while...

"Now, if they brought a UJM in the 350-600 CC range, THEN that would stand out" Agreed; just keep it under 400 pounds wet and give it a decent fuel tank.

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 5:08 am

if this is a "fake Harley" what is a Harley a fake of?

Milt · Post by **Milt** » Thu Mar 14, 2013 5:45 am

I cannot recall Harley copying anything - they have produced their share of bad ideas and sold some genuinely weird bikes produced for them by (if I recall correctly) Aermacchi. The AMF period was especially bad, but now the bikes actually work rather well.

If I want a U.J.M., I'll buy the new Honda CB1100; If I want a Harley, I'll buy a Harley. They (Harley Davidson) have been building bikes for over a century and the Sportster has been its 'own thing' since 1957...