Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

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Scootergoddess
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Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by Scootergoddess »

Anyone get up into the 10,000 plus mileage range on their Buddy 50? I’ve been”warned” by my dealer that they generally only last about 5,000-8,000 miles tops. I think he might be trying to ensure I trade it in after a couple of years…
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ericalm
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by ericalm »

10,000 miles is not at all unreasonable. It all depends on keeping up with maintenance, as well as when and how you ride it.

Timely and fluid changes are important. But don’t skip the “big service” items like transmission service, valve checks and adjustments, brake service.

The best thing you can do is ride it and keep up with service. It’s not good for a scooter to sit unridden for too long. If you love somewhere there’s heavy winters, look into proper off-season storage.

Like any machine, it will develop age-related issues such as hoses wearing out, but that’s many years away.

Because the 50s are cheaper and slower, people are more likely to neglect them and treat them poorly. It’s also harder to rack up high miles over a short time span, but it has been done.
Eric // LA Scooter Meetup Group // Stella 4T // Vespa LX // Vespa LXS // Honda Helix // some, uh, projects…
sc00ter
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by sc00ter »

If you manage to wear a quality 2-stroke out you can usually just hone the cylinder and replace the piston rings easily if you want to keep it, or replace the whole top end for cheap. I've seen well over 10,000 miles on Buddy and Yamaha Zuma 2-strokes and they still run great. It's when one gets cheap and lazy that a 2-stroke will suffer. My favorite example? Someone runs 2-stroke oil for pre-mix in their injector fed scooter because their to lazy to ride to a dealership and get the correct oil! The viscosity of pre-mix only 2-stroke oil doesn't work correctly in injection systems. I know someone doing it right now. Curious to see whats going to fail first. This brand of 2-stroke specifically says "Not compatible with injection systems."
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eggsalad
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by eggsalad »

I'm sorry, and I don't mean to be rude, but at the current prices for Genuine Scooters, that seems like a really lousy value proposition. Three grand and all you get is 10K miles? That's 33 cents a mile. Oof.
sc00ter
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by sc00ter »

Honestly, outside of one 2 stroke Zuma that had well over 30,000 miles, and a Buddy 50cc that had 40,000 that both still ran great, most people upgrade to a 125cc or larger after a year or so. So figure the average 50cc would get around 5000 miles a year put on it then you see why 10,000 is considered high. I sold a Hyosung Sense 50cc with almost 20,000 trouble free miles on it. Ran perfect when I sold it.
Scootergoddess
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by Scootergoddess »

Thanks for the feedback. I’ve put over 500 miles on it in 3 months, because I commute to work on it. Already took it in for first service, of course. And I only use proper two-stroke oil, period. I was hoping with good care and regular maintenance, she would last more than a couple years. (At rate I am going, I will put close to 2000 miles a year on her).
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tenders
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by tenders »

Buddy 50s don’t have valves, so they don’t need to have that adjustment. The 10k mile “big service” that *might* be necessary is a head/ring/piston replacement, which is a relatively big deal in a valved four-stroke engine, but not on a two-stroke.

No math that I can do makes cost savings per mile very compelling for a scooter, unless it actually replaces a car or you ride many, many thousands of miles a year. Safety gear, tools, and maintenance parts eat up a whole lot of savings on gas - more, if you’re paying for somebody else’s labor to do the work.
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by sc00ter »

I just did my major service for my Liberty 150 at 24,000 miles myself. Oil/filter. Air filter. Reduction box oil. Valve check (intakes tight). Brake fluid. It took me 3 hours because it was muggy that day and I forgot a gasket and had to remove the valve cover a second time. I wish I had a air conditioned garage. Not hard to service my own scooter and I know its done right.
Neil82
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by Neil82 »

I'm kind of surprised dealer would suggest only 10k miles for lifespan. They are probably just giving conservative estimate. After all, they probably see all the worst-case scenarios involving poorly maintained/treated scooters.
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by Scootergoddess »

That and trying to talk me into a bigger, more expensive scooter, I think. So I ride pretty conservatively (my commute doesn’t require me to go above 40mph, so almost never at full throttle), and i keep up with all recommended maintenance, religiously. Only use proper two stroke oil, 93 octane unleaded… but i will put about 2,000 miles a year on her at the rate i am going. I just want to believe she will last me more than three years!
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by Therealslimshaggy »

Expected life is about 30,000 miles with two top end rebuilds. I have the RH 50 basically same thing. Piston will shatter around 10,000 miles. Mine did at 11,000 miles. A guys on YouTube around 12,000 miles. The top end kit is 179.00 and will get you another 10,000 miles. It can be installed with the engine in the scoot plastics off. I recently did it. The reason I say 30,000 miles is because after two top end rebuilds your bottom end is going to start to wear out. At that point you can just buy a newer slightly used engine for around 300-500 and then do a few top end rebuilds on it to get to 60,000 miles. If you get one of these 50cc two strokes you need to become a mechanic. A top end rebuild at a shop could run a thousand bucks. They might milk it up in costs and unesisary additional parts. I’m at about 15,000 miles on my RH 50 and my first new top end. I’ll ride it until the piston shatters again push it home and do one more top end rebuild. After that I might keep it and swap in a newer engine.
Yamaha Aerox 155, Genuine Roughhouse 50, Genuine buddy 170i, Yamaha Cygnus 125, Honda grom 125, Suzuki address 110 (uk110), Yamaha cuxi 115, Yamaha BWS 100 2t, Yamaha R6, Honda CR125, Kawasaki KX 500
Scootergoddess
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by Scootergoddess »

Good to know. I am at 850 miles and she keeps getting faster. I doubt I’d still have her past 10k miles. I am buying a Buddy Kick 125 in 2023 (already ordered one but won't get it til march) and will turn my Buddy 50 over to my son as a learner bike in 2024. He will undoubtedly sell it after getting his MC endorsement and buy a bigger scooter. So if she can get us two more good years I will be happy. That would put her right around 9-10k miles, I bet. She is so awesome. I got her up to 43 mph the other day!
Neil82
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by Neil82 »

@Therealslimshaggy- that is good info. I didn't know what to expect for longevity from a small 2 stroke engine. It makes sense though. I'm pushing 2.5k miles on 2021 Buddy 50 and I feel like it's running better than ever. Kind of makes me want to see how many miles I can go. I already have the itch to upgrade, so probably won't happen.
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Therealslimshaggy
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by Therealslimshaggy »

Neil82 wrote: Fri Oct 07, 2022 2:29 am @Therealslimshaggy- that is good info. I didn't know what to expect for longevity from a small 2 stroke engine. It makes sense though. I'm pushing 2.5k miles on 2021 Buddy 50 and I feel like it's running better than ever. Kind of makes me want to see how many miles I can go. I already have the itch to upgrade, so probably won't happen.
I highly suggest running it to the end point of piston shatter which is a good thing and here’s why. The liitle 2t engine runs amazing up until the last second. In fact the day the piston shattered it ran great and I made about 200 bucks that day completing 27 deliveries. 10k miles is not high miles on a 2t if the engine has been rebuilt after 10k. People will see it as high mileage possibly and so there comes a decision to make. Part with it for cheap 500-1000 buck range or take on a fun diy project.

Even if you plan to upgrade to something bigger 50 2t engines are still fun if you have the parking to keep at home as an extra ride.

The rebuild process- 2t are as simple as they come. 179 bucks to go another 10k reliably is worth it. If anything it’s worth it just for the simple fact of learning how to rebuild and engine if you never done it before since this engine is as simple as it gets and the best platform for learning. The longest process is taking off the plastics and floorboards. Lots of Phillips screws with potential to strip the head if rusted in. Not such a big deal. You can get away with reassembling with not all the screws or sum you can cut the plastic around if they’re locked and simple get the other ones unscrewed on one side. But yeah the toughest part of the engine rebuild has nothing to do with the engine. It’s simply getting the plastics off.

When you get to the engine- pretty simple with a few parts over stressed that you don’t need to worry about. The head gasket will be ok. Don’t use rtv or other silicon sealants on the gasket. Don’t use anything on the head gasket other than the oem head gasket. I say this because there is so much emphasis on getting a high psi seal on the head of a 2t engine it makes you worry and stress when after you remove the head you can clearly see that where the two lower cases of the engine align they aren’t level. So it seems like a leak point for sure. It’s not. My engine sealed. No leakage. High psi compression. No rtv silicon sealant used. But you do need to scrape off as much of the old gasket material as possible.

So at this point if you’re rebuilding the engine it’s most likely due to a piston shattering. You’ll need to take one of those magnetic antenna tools and get any Lose material out of the bottom end. You’ll need to shake your exhaust upside down. A few tiny chunks of metal might come out.

Torque specs- forget about this. I didn’t use a torque wrench to reassemble the head. Just do the criss cross x pattern and go as tight as you can little by little and use good judgement not to do too much and break a bolt or thread.

The most important part- c clips and piston rings. This is the part you read 3 times and re read. No failure made here. When you put in the c clips pry them out to make them bigger and less of an oval and more circular after they are in. Like using needle nose in reverse. No play or wiggle in the c clips. You can install one side first before putting on the head. The piston rings you’ll need put on around the notch on piston with the half moon in the middle of the ring play area spot on both rings. Then lube up with 2t oil and slide into the cylinder with correct exhaust side arrow pointing down. Before you bolt the head on you will have piston in cylinder slighting sticking out ready to attach connecting rod and wrist pin bearing and final c clip. After that it’s ready to be bolted down with the head.

Sounds complex but it’s not. Consider it a 700 dollar lesson. The way this lesson works is if you fail your out a scooter worth 500 bucks and another 179 in parts. If you don’t fail the lesson you have a scooter ready to go another 10k miles or ready to be sold for 1000 bucks if the buyer can see your parts bill and trusts in your crasftmanship.
Yamaha Aerox 155, Genuine Roughhouse 50, Genuine buddy 170i, Yamaha Cygnus 125, Honda grom 125, Suzuki address 110 (uk110), Yamaha cuxi 115, Yamaha BWS 100 2t, Yamaha R6, Honda CR125, Kawasaki KX 500
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by sc00ter »

I don't know anyone personally with a high mileage Buddy 50cc or a RH50 anymore. I've also never been inside the engine on one, like crank swap level. I still might get a RH50 one day but won't go over a Stage 1 tune. Exhaust, jetting to match exhaust, carbon fiber reeds and transmission tune. I know on my beloved Zuma bug-eye that a simple entry level expansion chamber exhaust will break the reed pedals. If you get lucky its just a top end rebuild. If unlucky it's a whole motor rebuild! Swap the reeds right away as cheap insurance on a bug-eye Zuma!
The one thing I've heard is the Buddy 50 and RH50 have a adjustable oil pump? The Zuma has a fixed 50:1 pump that works off of engine RPMs. This "adjustable" pump was responsible for certain Buddy 50 and RH50 early deaths for not supplying the proper oil supply. I've yet to confirm this.
Yeahbuddy!
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by Yeahbuddy! »

I just hit 16k on my Buddy 50. Runs like a champ
Scootergoddess
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by Scootergoddess »

Now that makes me super happy!!!!
I am at 1,100 and I swear she is getting faster every day. She is the most awesome little ride!
My Buddy Kick 125 is being delivered this weekend but I am not giving up the 50.
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Re: Expected lifespan Buddy 50?

Post by az_slynch »

Recently picked up a 2007 Buddy 50. It had 12K on the clock but didn't want to start.

The good news it that it took little care and feeding to get it running again. I cleaned the fuel system, replaced the pilot jet in the carburetor and replaced the crankshaft seal on the transmission side.

I'm working on hotrodding it now for a friend, but it is delightful stock and pretty spunky with an NCY transmission kit and a MLM side bleed exhaust.
At what point does a hobby become an addiction? I'm uncertain, but after the twelfth scooter, it sorta feels like the latter...

Seriously...I've lost count...

Seven mopeds ...that's still manageable...
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