Pedestrians

lobsterman · Post by **lobsterman** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 2:13 pm

OK, I know from all the literature and the MSF course that we need to watch pedestrians, and I do. Today something happened, not for the first time, that made me want to ask what you folks have experienced.

I commute into downtown Cincinnati. For those who have not graced our fair city, the downtown area is a grid of multi-lane one way streets. I was in the right lane, getting ready to turn right. There is a crosswalk with no light across this section, and there were a few people there waiting to cross.

One woman in particular was watching the oncoming traffic, obviously preparing to cross. She looks at all the cars, then directly at me in the closest lane as I approach, and steps out into the road. She was a good 3 feet into the lane (my lane!) when I reached the crosswalk, and she was still moving. I swerved left a little, she couldn't have been more than a foot away from me when I passed her.

I doubt if she has any clue how dangerous what she did was. Maybe I do not give her enough credit. Perhaps she had properly calculated my speed and course, knew what her exact timing and acceleration should be as she walked so that we could both safely be in that lane at the same time. Of course, she would have to assume I would not react adversely to her proximity. I could easily have changed speed or direction and hit her or the car in the lane next to me.

Does this happen to you all too? I am wondering if we look so non-threatening on our scooters that people disregard our presence on the road, much as they would a skateboard or a bicycle.

weebl · Post by **weebl** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 3:21 pm

just about every time I drive near the college here I just about cream some stupid college student. My drive to work takes me past the freshman dorms, which seem to be giant stupidity magnets because *no one* seems to understand how a crosswalk works.

I want to get really ridiculously loud horn to honk at them (my bikes isn't so good... sounds like a duck call). I mean, the pedestrians are pretty bad when I'm in a car, but they're even worse when I'm on a scooter.

Post by **polianarchy** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 6:23 pm

So far, pedestrians have caused EVERY SINGLE ONE of my "o 5h!t" moments. Jaywalking by jumping out between parked cars, crossing against the light, standing behind me and shouting...UGH!

sunshinen · Post by **sunshinen** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 6:58 pm

yeah, pedestrians too often have the feeling that everyone can and will stop for them, especially in a college area. but i think they miss "seeing" us for the same reasons they do when behind the wheel: they're looking for big four-wheeled vehicles, not two-wheelers. and too often, you don't see what you're not looking for.

lobsterman · Post by **lobsterman** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 6:59 pm

This experience has caused me to once again consider this Stebel horn:
http://www.bikerhiway.com/index.php?mai ... ucts_id=74

Since I am considering painting the front plastic on my scooter anyway, the timing might be convenient to do both.

It's been successfully installed on several Buddys by forum members, and I am thinking it might be money well spent ($35).

Anybody that installed one want to comment on how it is working out long term?

ScooterDave · Post by **ScooterDave** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 8:15 pm

There is a certain segment of the population here in Cincinnati that decides to cross when they feel like it. Red light, green light, it doesnt matter.

What I have found myself doing is aiming for them when they are crossing against the light in front of me and traking their time. I am guessing they are just used to holding up traffic and not having a motorist get tired of it.

ScooterMonkey · Post by **ScooterMonkey** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 8:50 pm

lobsterman wrote:This experience has caused me to once again consider this Stebel horn:
http://www.bikerhiway.com/index.php?mai ... ucts_id=74

Since I am considering painting the front plastic on my scooter anyway, the timing might be convenient to do both.

It's been successfully installed on several Buddys by forum members, and I am thinking it might be money well spent ($35).

Anybody that installed one want to comment on how it is working out long term?

I installed a Stebel & I'm very happy with it. It's a high-pitched dual-tone horn that's loud as hell!

I love honking it!

lobsterman · Post by **lobsterman** » Thu Jan 11, 2007 8:54 pm

ScooterDave wrote:There is a certain segment of the population here in Cincinnati that decides to cross when they feel like it. Red light, green light, it doesnt matter... I am guessing they are just used to holding up traffic and not having a motorist get tired of it.

I am guessing they have never been hit by a passing vehicle as a result of their foolishness.

Yeah OK, I would expect it in NYC where people just do anything they want or places like New Hampshire where pedestrians are given the broadest right of way I've ever seen. It is normal and expected behavior for any pedestrian there to step out into the street any time anywhere regardless of lights or signs or crossing areas. Motorists in NH must then yield to them no matter what. Maybe that's why the state motto is "Live Free or Die".

Here in Cincinnati, I have actually observed people waiting for the light to cross the street, even with no traffic. I can tell you, when I moved here from NJ I was really shocked by that. This makes the behavior of the woman this morning all the more surprising to me.

I am concerned that the Stebel horn might actually be TOO loud. I want to get the pedestrian's (or driver's) attention, I do not want to actually cause a 3 city block panic if I sound the horn downtown.

EBee · Post by **EBee** » Fri Jan 12, 2007 8:20 pm

Yeah I can see it now, Kev, you'll make some 90-year-old bag lady pee her pants in the crosswalk...

he he

I have worked downtown now for going on 7 years, and I have seen very aggressive pedestrians, who look right at you as if to say, "come on, bring it" and on the flip side of that, the crosswalk to my parking place is totally ignored by cagers. I've had cars allow me to cross about 4 times in the entire time I've parked there...

I'm really curious about this new horn. Keep us posted.

ScooterDave · Post by **ScooterDave** » Fri Jan 12, 2007 9:31 pm

EBee wrote:I have worked downtown now for going on 7 years, and I have seen very aggressive pedestrians, who look right at you as if to say, "come on, bring it"

I park in the Garfield Garage on 9th next to The Phoenix. As I was coming down 9th street today, 2 young fellows with droopy pants decided to cross in the middle of the street and when they were in my lane, they stopped and looked at me. I proceded to down shift and accellerate. I chuckled as I knew that was the last thing they expected. They quickly got out of the way.

Dave

Elm Creek Smith · Post by **Elm Creek Smith** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 1:39 am

lobsterman wrote:I am concerned that the Stebel horn might actually be TOO loud. I want to get the pedestrian's (or driver's) attention, I do not want to actually cause a 3 city block panic if I sound the horn downtown.

No such thing as TOO loud. I want to make them wet their pants and look around for the invisible dump truck. If the city panics, it's just a bonus.

ECS

Keys · Post by **Keys** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 3:38 am

ECS, your signature really tickles me. Last night I rode into work (about 10:30). It was in the low thirties and so I was wearing my two sweatshirts, Genuine Scooters jacket and over them I was wearing a 30 year old wool mexican poncho. Cuts the wind like you wouldn't believe, thereby allowing the sweatshirts and jacket to keep me warm. Since I don't want the back half of the poncho flapping in the breeze, I bungee-cord the back half around me. I pulled up to my Kenworth and the shop foreman was at the adjacent truck working on it. He turned and looked at me as I dismounted my scooter and asked; "Don't you EVER get embarrassed?"

I immediately thought of your signature...

--Keys

lobsterman · Post by **lobsterman** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 4:28 am

I get called Scooter Boy by my coworkers. One has even shortened it to just Scooter.

I don't mind. They all complains about their commutes.

ebcspace · Post by **ebcspace** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 5:32 am

it's scary to think of how bad of drivers the bad pedestrians will be !

reminds me of a bumper sticker at a distributor warehouse, about common sense...

"ignorance is common"

and one of my favorite made-up songs, "how stupid can you get?(la la la la la)" second verse, same as the first !

Elm Creek Smith · Post by **Elm Creek Smith** » Sat Jan 13, 2007 6:07 am

My brother often quotes a great man (our late father), "Common sense isn't."

I had a moron on a Victory pass me at speed on the right while I was in the right lane the other day. The thing that kept me from thinking about digging my 9mm out from under the Tour Master was that he did it in a school zone in front of two police officers on motorcycles. They pulled out in front of me and pulled him over in a half mile. When I went by, I blipped the horn and one of the motor officers smiled and waved. The other one had the guy sitting on the curb while he continued writing the ticket.

I gotta get me one of those airhorns.

ECS

kmetta · Post by **kmetta** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 6:14 am

lobsterman wrote:ah OK, I would expect it in NYC where people just do anything they want or places like New Hampshire where pedestrians are given the broadest right of way I've ever seen. It is normal and expected behavior for any pedestrian there to step out into the street any time anywhere regardless of lights or signs or crossing areas. Motorists in NH must then yield to them no matter what. Maybe that's why the state motto is "Live Free or Die".

i honestly thought this was the way of the world.
something to keep in mind when i travel.

louie · Post by **louie** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:23 pm

edit because after rehashing i got it backwards...it should be...

i speciffically remember the correct answer to a question on the CA driver's license test 20 years ago going something like "drivers always have the right-of-way to jay walkers but it is "recommended " that you stop for pedistrians to give the them the right of way.

"Don't you EVER get embarrassed?" Good one.

bunny · Post by **bunny** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 5:41 pm

ScooterDave wrote:I park in the Garfield Garage on 9th next to The Phoenix.

I stayed at the Garfield last summer for a weekend. Nice hotel.

GFridrich3 · Post by **GFridrich3** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 6:26 pm

For those of you that want a better horn to scare the living piss out of a stupid pedestrian, i HIGHLY suggest getting a pair of Hella Supertone 118dB disc horns. I have a pair on my car, and have blared them at oncoming cars that have to run the stale yellow left turn arrow, or just blow thru as the light turns green, and watched them hit their head on the headliner of their vehicle from it. Just do not, no matter what, accidentally honk your supertones inside a closed garage. Ask me why I know this....

Post by **illnoise** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 6:28 pm

Remember, if the crosswalk isn't regulated with lights, (usually the ones that cross in the middle of the block) the pedestrians always have the right of way. Chicago's been cracking down on that bigtime, they busted hundreds of cars over a couple hours last week at ONE crosswalk, even after they publicized the crackdown (and the location) on the front page of the Tribune.

And when I'm a pedestrian, I always get mad at cars and bicycles, too. Put yourself in their shoes, and think about what you do when you're a pedestrian. We all do the same stuff.

Most importantly, it doesn't matter how legal you are, if you strike a pedestrian and injure or kill them (or yourself), you can justify your actions as much as you like, legally and morally, but it's not going to help them, or you. Ride defensively and always expect the unexpected.

louie · Post by **louie** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 6:58 pm

louie wrote:edit because after rehashing i got it backwards...it should be...

i speciffically remember the correct answer to a question on the CA driver's license test 20 years ago going something like "drivers always have the right-of-way to jay walkers but it is "recommended " that you stop for pedistrians to give the them the right of way and not hit them.

"Don't you EVER get embarrassed?" Good one.

ferfdom · Post by **ferfdom** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 8:15 pm

If that person was at a crosswalk with no light, then SHE has the right of way.

If there is a light then she has to go with traffic.

Liz C · Post by **Liz C** » Sat Jun 21, 2008 9:44 pm

Louie and Ill, I'm with you guys on this. Yielding to pedestrians is good for you and the universe in many ways.

MikieTaps · Post by **MikieTaps** » Sun Jun 22, 2008 3:17 am

I make sure to accelerate really really quickly towards them, making sure my scooter engine is nice and loud... when they see how fast I am moving and hear my scary motor... they back the F up...