09 genuine roughhouse help running fine then then die

The spirited black sheep of the Genuine lineup

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marvin peters
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Joined: Thu Nov 07, 2013 8:36 pm
Location: Asheville N.C.

09 genuine roughhouse help running fine then then die

Post by marvin peters »

I am new in scoot world. I bought roughhouse 50 five months ago. It had 3700 miles and the guy supplied paper work showing the engine top end had a fresh piston ring rebuild. I put 2100 miles on her riding every day now it is cold winter and I been riding in freezing temps no problem. It run like hell sounds good plenty power. I put about 30 miles a day on it. I ride 10 to 15 mile trips to school and back every day. I don't keep throttle maxed out except sometimes going up hill I live in nc mtns. Yester day it was cruising like a champ then suddenly lose power and I pull over then it cut off. I started right back up cruise another 100 feet or so with decreased power and pull off road. I call the mechanic and ask him what could be wrong. I run bel ray si 7 2 stroke oil. He asked if I was near a store and I was within a mile from store he said if I could run her easy get to store and dump any 2 stroke oil in gas tank. I made it to store put 4 ounces api 2 stroke oil in gas tank and topped of gas roughly a gallon. I started back up then I let her idle on stand giving little thrust of throttle trying to get the new gas mix in carb then engine. I start seeing little puffs white smoke so at least I know its getting oil. I did this just in case my oil injector was the unknown problem. Then I take off it seems to be running ok then a mile later it loses power really quick then I have to pull over then it quits. I was at another store at this pt. found a guy with a truck and he got me and my roughhouse home. I tried starting and it seems like engine was turning over but not firing. Then it sounded like a time or two it wanted to fire but didn't. THe guy in the truck said he didn't think it was my engine. I read that A SEIZED engine sometimes can still turn over and may fire if it is not a total seize. I wander what it could be. If it is seized what would cause it to run lean? Can oil injector malfunction and get no oil. I was gonna replace plug but have no special spark plug wrench. Can I use a socket if so what size. I am really bummed out this my only transportation. Hopefully it is not and engine problem. Any feedback will be gratefully appreciated. I have very lil mechanical sense. THe shop isn't open on Saturday and today is Saturday. Also the shop seems to do good work but they do sale Chinese scooters. Even the shop owner says I did good buying a tawain made scoot. I wander when the rebuild was done they used cheap piston rings? I am clueless? Does this sound like engine seizure or maybe a less dramatic problem? I humbly ask for any help? Thank you!
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OldGuy
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Post by OldGuy »

It seems odd that it needed a rebuild at 3700 miles. Normally it should have gone for much longer than that for the earlier owner.

It was a good idea of your mechanic's to have you dump extra 2 stroke oil in the tank. Pumps can fail.

I can't say what is wrong, but I worry that piston rings, piston itself, or the cylinder may be damaged. Fortunately replacements aren't too costly.

Is it possible there is a 70cc kit on you scoot?
1971 Hodaka Ace 100
1977 Suzuki GT250 is now sold... Good bike!
1980 Yamaha IT125
Honda: '66 CT90 KO; '83 CT110; '92 CT70; 2001 XR250
and 1 or 2 others... I need to sell some bikes!
marvin peters
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Location: Asheville N.C.

Post by marvin peters »

It doesn't have a 70 cc kit to my knowledge. I have paperwork from previous rebuild. I also take it to the same mechanic and he never mentioned that it has a big bore. It will hit 50 on odometer no problem and it has a prima pipe. The little cap on the end of the pipe came off and its loud but I kinda like it that way. I grew up riding 2 stroke dirtbikes and I am in love with 2 stroke. I hate four stroke scoots and 4 stroke dirt bikes. Street bikes 4 stroke I like. However I am fond of old scool 2 stroke st. bikes. I am not much of a mechanic but good news. Yester day I went and bought a new spark plug and used 13/16 deep socket wrench cause I don't have the spark plug wrench for the roughhouse. I managed to get plug out and it was like welded crud on tip I tried cranking with plug touching metal and it was barely a spark at all so I replaced and it fired right up. Thank God it was music to my ears. Now I am paranoid about the oil injector failing. My mechanic said if it was his bike he would disconnect the oil injector and just go premix. I am considering this for a piece of mind. If so how rich should my mix be. He say 32:1 like i used to run in 2 stroke dirtbikes. BUt if I do this I won't get as many miles per quart of 2 stroke oil. I average around 70 miles a gallon. THe owners manual online say 100 miles a gallon maybe that is restricted gas mileage. I ride everyday no matter the weather. If I put 4 ounces for every gallon and tank holds roughly a gallon then that puts me getting getting 8 tanks of gas per quart of oil. At 70 miles a tank that is 560 miles a quart that would start adding up since I run bel ray si 7 at $18.00 quart. I am averaging around 750 miles a quart. What is your advice for disconnecting oil and premix? What mix ratio would you recommend? Also what other maintenance you recommend to keep bike tip top. I was told change fuel filter and clean or replace air filter? Can I clean air filter. How about belts and transmission maintenance? I get mixed answers from people I just want to take the correct advice from a scoot guru who ain't trying to sell me something. Also thanks for the response any advice Is much appreciated from this struggling poor boy. Thanks!!
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OldGuy
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Post by OldGuy »

That is very good new about the plug; I am glad it is running for you again.

Regarding running pre-mix or oil injection, I like injection (I used to have dirt bikes too, and one of my bikes still requires pre-mix). If it were mine and I was worried about the injection I would leave the injection hooked up, and use pre-mix, and monitor the injection tank level to see if it is dropping slowly, indicating oil is being used. If it never drops then it isn't working.

a liter or oil lasts me maybe 800 miles. Not sure how to translate that into a ratio. But 32:1 seems like a lot of oil. I'd be tempted to try 40 or 50:1.

My Roughhouse only has 1600 miles, so hasn't had a lot of maintenance issues yet. I'd suggest checking the air filter, but you may not need to replace it. Might also be a good idea to have the belt looked at and replaced if it shows wear. And the transmission oil should be replaced if it's been in there for a while. Lastly, keep the rear brake adjusted and consider replacing the fluid in the front/replace brake pads if needed. That's about it.

If you are hitting 50 indicated on the speedometer that is probably 43 to 45 actual, and that sounds about right.
1971 Hodaka Ace 100
1977 Suzuki GT250 is now sold... Good bike!
1980 Yamaha IT125
Honda: '66 CT90 KO; '83 CT110; '92 CT70; 2001 XR250
and 1 or 2 others... I need to sell some bikes!
gitsum79
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Post by gitsum79 »

I fixed up a SYM DD50 (two-stroke 49cc minarelli) and yanked the oil pump and ran 50:1 premix. Plenty of oil for lubrication, not too much smoke.
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agrogod
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Post by agrogod »

Just to add, you went wayyy to heavy on the extra oil in the tank. That's what lead up to your fouled spark plug.

The '09's seem to be a finicky lot. At 1600 miles I had to do an upper cylinder rebuild due to the piston getting warped. Others have had similar piston problems. So having it re-ringed on a stock engine isn't such a bad idea. Its a cheap fix, and you can get in there and take a look around for any other problems.

Take a step back and hold the horses, the injectors on these beasts is pretty rock solid. I can only think of one that I ever heard of going bad and I believe that was age related. Our 2 stokes are designed to handle a variable oil feed, don't know how it would react to a solid diet of just one mix rate.

And just so all know and for future reference: The RH50 will do 32:1 to 100:1 oil. So far the only thing I have found that comes in that concoction is marine oil. It works but smokes like a .............
"When your mouth is yapping your arms stop flapping, get to work" - a quote from my father R.I.P..
always start with the simple, it may end up costing you little to nothing
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