New Honda Elite-108ccs

pcbikedude · Post by **pcbikedude** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 5:18 pm

Once in awhile I get bored and poke around in the CARB website to see who is bringing what into Calif.

I thought it was interesting that Honda certified an Elite with 110ccs. New Elites are 80ccs. Are they trying to hold off the SYMba?

http://www.arb.ca.gov/msprog/onroad/cer ... _1d0_h.pdf

pcbikedude · Post by **pcbikedude** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 5:22 pm

I was right.
http://powersports.honda.com/press/5005 ... elite.aspx

Too bad you can't get through their broken-down website to see what it looks like

.

jasondavis48108 · Post by **jasondavis48108** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 5:52 pm

sounds interesting. I like the idea of it being a 110cc since insurance will be cheaper than with the 125 and up scoots. I couldn't beleive the hike from 50cc to 125cc. Unfortunatly there are no specs for the scoot. I'll have to poke around and see what it does top speed mpg msrp ect. I have been seriously considering the zuma 125, I like the way it looks and cost wise its close to the buddy 125 but I think I'd fit better on the zuma with a passanger. This could be another alternative, especially if its less expensive than the zuma 125

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 6:54 pm

2 stroke buzz says it is basically the scoot that is sold in Europe as the Honda Lead 110 (that would be "lead" as in go first, not "lead" as in weighs too much)

http://ww1.honda.co.uk/motorcycles/

beeporama · Post by **beeporama** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 7:18 pm

viewtopic.php?t=10872

pcbikedude · Post by **pcbikedude** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 7:30 pm

beeporama wrote:viewtopic.php?t=10872

Things get to CA late because of our CARB. It just means that Honda can start selling the Elite in CA.

I saw on the SYM website that the SYMba and Fiddle II aren't expected out of certification until September and October respectively.

Most recent news from CARB about the Fiddle II 125 and SYMBA
June 5th, 2009
(please don’t shoot the messenger)

SYMBA - September
Fiddle II 125 - October

No reasons for the delays; no other info.

I saw the Honda SH150 this weekend. It is an attractive scooter. Pricey though.

beeporama · Post by **beeporama** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:09 pm

pcbikedude wrote:
beeporama wrote:viewtopic.php?t=10872
Things get to CA late because of our CARB. It just means that Honda can start selling the Elite in CA.

...

I saw the Honda SH150 this weekend. It is an attractive scooter. Pricey though.

Ah, I see what you mean.

As I said over in the other thread, I'm not sure what the market is for the SH150. A Buddy International is a better value; a Vespa is an established brand with better name recognition.

jasondavis48108 · Post by **jasondavis48108** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:18 pm

I think that Honda is depending on folks like myself who own their cars and other two wheelers. I absolutly love the look of the Vespa, but for reliability I have found nothing that beats a Honda. The things just don't die. If Honda's 50cc scoots weren't so darn timid I would have probably bought one and then I would have never met my She-Beast

I do think that their scoots tend to be over-priced, but its always tempting to go with what you know. I think that's what Hondas banking on.

pcbikedude · Post by **pcbikedude** » Wed Jun 17, 2009 8:47 pm

beeporama wrote:
pcbikedude wrote:
beeporama wrote:viewtopic.php?t=10872
Things get to CA late because of our CARB. It just means that Honda can start selling the Elite in CA.

...

I saw the Honda SH150 this weekend. It is an attractive scooter. Pricey though.
Ah, I see what you mean.

As I said over in the other thread, I'm not sure what the market is for the SH150. A Buddy International is a better value; a Vespa is an established brand with better name recognition.

The Vespa LX150 and S150 are cheaper but are not fuel injected like the Honda. I would get the Vespa over the Honda.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 1:19 am

Both Vespas and the new SH150 Honda are pricy compared to scoots like the Buddy which represent a better value. On the other hand, there are very few PTWs that have better name recognition or reputation for reliability than Honda. I would not argue that Vespas have any edge over Buddys in reliability. The question is how quickly Honda can rebuild its US market share for scooters after virtually ignoring the market for the past few years. The top end prices will make it harder for them to get traction - at least at first. After that, nobody should bet against Honda. (Remember who ran Vespa out of the US the last time they abandoned the US market?)

jasondavis48108 · Post by **jasondavis48108** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 2:13 am

I bought my wife a Ruckus with no reservations, but that sh150, as awesome as it is, is priced a bit too steeply for me. I don't understand why it's more expensive than the Rebel, and way more expensive than an elininator (both motorbikes I have considered in lue of a bigger scoot) I'm hoping that this new elite 110 isn't as overpriced.

Post by **ericalm** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 8:03 am

The pricing on the SH150 is just ridiculous.

Honda Powersports and Honda Automotive are, for all practical purposes in the USA, totally different companies. While they share certain qualities stemming from the parent company's standards of quality and reliability, they're quite different in terms of how well they understand and appeal to their respective markets. I've ranted about their nonsensical, rather half-assed approach to selling scooters in the US before, so won't really get into that again. I just really have the sense that they aren't bringing over the types of scooters American buyers want at the prices they want…

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 5:42 pm

ericalm wrote: I've ranted about their nonsensical, rather half-assed approach to selling scooters in the US before, so won't really get into that again. I just really have the sense that they aren't bringing over the types of scooters American buyers want at the prices they want…

I don't think anyone disagrees that Honda Powersports has not given much attention to the American scooter market in recent years. Having said that, you can't overlook the position of Honda in the American motorcycle market or the dominant role they played in the American scooter market a decade ago - or Honda outboards, or gensets, or mower engines, or, or, or. If they decide the American scooter market is worth their attention, they will be a force to be reconned with. New models, price adjustments, whatever it takes. And, oh yeh, parts and service available virtually everywhere. What a concept!

Post by **ericalm** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 7:52 pm

Dooglas wrote:
ericalm wrote: I've ranted about their nonsensical, rather half-assed approach to selling scooters in the US before, so won't really get into that again. I just really have the sense that they aren't bringing over the types of scooters American buyers want at the prices they want…
I don't think anyone disagrees that Honda Powersports has not given much attention to the American scooter market in recent years. Having said that, you can't overlook the position of Honda in the American motorcycle market or the dominant role they played in the American scooter market a decade ago - or Honda outboards, or gensets, or mower engines, or, or, or. If they decide the American scooter market is worth their attention, they will be a force to be reconned with. New models, price adjustments, whatever it takes. And, oh yeh, parts and service available virtually everywhere. What a concept!

Oh, crud… here comes my Honda rant again… resist… resist… can't… resist…

viewtopic.php?t=10173#127844

My current beef with Honda is that with all their experience and all the qualities you mention, I'd like to see them invest more in the natural, long-term growth of the US scooter market. Not just selling scooters, but creating scooterists out of customers. Fact is, I think Honda is in a better position to win US consumers over to scootering than any other company. They have the name recognition, the reputation, the marketing muscle. Their business is better suited to long term sustainability than Vespa and most of the other companies out there (with the exception of Genuine, which "gets it").

But Honda just doesn't seem interested, despite the biggest scooter sales year ever last year and the current push for alternative and greener transportation. Maybe some bean counter decided it wouldn't be worth the investment.

Skootz Kabootz · Post by **Skootz Kabootz** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 9:20 pm

ericalm wrote:...But Honda just doesn't seem interested, despite the biggest scooter sales year ever last year and the current push for alternative and greener transportation. Maybe some bean counter decided it wouldn't be worth the investment.

Totally agree with you. I figure it must be that after import costs there are bigger profit margins selling motorcycles and cars in the US. So Honda just sticks with that. Or maybe they think scooter sales will cannibalize motorcycle sales? Who knows. But it's a shame because my friend in Spain tells me that Honda's are about the best scooters available over there. Models that we never see over here.

But one thing I do know for sure, after working on the Honda automobile account for 6 years, is that everything Honda does (or doesn't do) is researched, calculated, and done for a reason. I just wish I knew what that reason was when it comes to scooters. Maybe as gasoline prices continue to climb and scooter sales begin to make more economic sense, Honda will begin to take the US market more seriously and their plans will change. Here's hoping...

jasondavis48108 · Post by **jasondavis48108** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 9:29 pm

My main issue with Honda is price. I couldn't believe the price hike on the Rebel over the past few years. The darn thing goes for $4500 msrp now which is a bit rediculous really. We love our Honda Fit (as much as we can love a cage) and my wife loves her Ruckus. I just wish they would produce some 110cc-150cc scoots that don't kill the pocket book. I think thats why Genuine rocks so hard, they make solid scoots at a decent price. I don't think Honda prices are going anywhere but up. It's like they want thier scooters to not sell so they can justify not selling them here.

Tenchi · Post by **Tenchi** » Thu Jun 18, 2009 11:24 pm

I'm old enough to remember the Honda Passport commercials (I'm sorry, you cannot park here without a PASSPORT), and their slogan "You meet the nicest people on a Honda." Why not--they got the bucks to afford an overpriced scooter....

fiddlefan · Post by **fiddlefan** » Sat Jun 20, 2009 10:49 pm

I have taken a pretty good look at the Honda SH150i, mainly just for curiosity sake. Based on my fairly thorough research and analysis, I think the scooter is about 500.00 on the high side. However, that being said, a sales guy down at the local Honda store in my hometown told me they aren't moving too well and they would likely take 500.00 off them just to get them out the door and get them out on the streets. If I was in the market for a scoot in that style (more motorcycle-like) and in that cc's class, I would strongly consider getting one if I could get it for a sales price of $4,000.00. I would definitely not pay list for one of these scooters based on their popularity right now. Any body else on MB heard how the SH150i's are selling?

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Sat Jun 20, 2009 11:38 pm

Tenchi wrote:I'm old enough to remember the Honda Passport commercials

Heck, I'm old enough to have owned one (and I did)!

Tenchi wrote:Why not--they got the bucks to afford an overpriced scooter....

Now, are you making fun of the Vespa guys again?

irishtim · Post by **irishtim** » Sat Jun 20, 2009 11:44 pm

Man, no kidding, that sh150 is overpriced! A Kymco People 150 is $2799 and has a two yr warranty. Honda definitely has made a name for itself reliability-wise but so has Kymco. It also seems like the Honda borrowed heavily from the styling of the Kymco. If they were the same price I'd still be looking hard at the Kymco. With saving $1700 it's a no brainer.

Tenchi · Post by **Tenchi** » Sat Jun 20, 2009 11:56 pm

nah, I'm not making fun of Vespa owners....just a bit of jealousy--since their club is located here in Los Gatos, a prime set of real estate.....Roman Holiday's are not for me...have to stick with San Jose days.....

Post by **ericalm** » Sun Jun 21, 2009 1:49 am

Tenchi wrote:nah, I'm not making fun of Vespa owners....just a bit of jealousy--since their club is located here in Los Gatos, a prime set of real estate.....Roman Holiday's are not for me...have to stick with San Jose days.....

Well, there will be a lot of riders of all types of scoots up there in about 2 weeks! Will you be coming out?