Buying a used Buddy?

[TobyDanger]

Hello! My name is Toby and I'm a buddyholic. I've fallen hard for the look of the Blackjack, but I think I've decided to "settle" on a used 125 (unless I run across a used Blackjack!) and maybe do some paint and mods on my own and maybe save a bit of money.

So what do I look for in a used Buddy? There are some obvious things like scratches on the bar ends, mirrors, pipe, or sides to indicate that it's been down, I doubt I'd see balling on the tires to know it's been raced so how do I tell if it's been abused. Can you heap much non cosmetic abuse on a Buddy if you follow the maintenance schedule? What questions should I ask the current owners when shopping? Has the Buddy changed much over the years? Would a 2006 with 200 miles be a better/worse buy than a 2009 with 6000?

If I was to "build a Blackjack" from a 125, what would I need?
big bore kit
wave rotor and brake kit
prima performance exhaust
upgraded forks and rear suspension
cosmetics like red rims, whitewall tires, flat black paint
What other differences are there between a Blackjack and a 125?

Thanks for any advice!

-TobyDanger-

[Lil Buddy]

I think I've decided to "settle" on a used 125

Don't settle. Buying used then replacing the parts to build your own BJ will cost you time and money. Use that time to save more money to by the BJ from the get-go.

[BootScootin'FireFighter]

125's are a hell of a good time, so you won't be let down. If you really had your mind set on a Blackjack, then just get a blackjack. You'll spend more money in the long-run doing all the mods and time, and possibly frustration if you're not very mechanically inclined trying to do the mods yourself.

When buying used, ask for any service documentation available. Also, arrange to meet the seller and have your new "urban stallion" given a once over by the local Genuine service center. http://www.seattlescooter.com/

Good luck, and enjoy your new buddy, whichever one it is!

[TobyDanger]

Don't settle. Buying used then replacing the parts to build your own BJ will cost you time and money. Use that time to save more money to by the BJ from the get-go.

Your BlackJack is one of the ones that's got me into this mad situation in the first place, so I appreciate your advice

I put "settle" in quotes because I know a 125 isn't actually settling for me. I think I actually prefer the 125 engine. I just really happen to like the black body and red wheels/whitewalls. I haven't seen a used Blackjack on CL lately, or for anywhere near the prices of the used 125s I've seen. I think at my budget right now the extra $2k for a new Blackjack is just sadly out of my reach at the moment, and I'd rather have one to ride this summer than save up some more. I'm reasonably mechanically inclined, having worked on my own motorcycles for several years, and it's a fun hobby so the time issue isn't really a concern for me.

I also should say I don't actually intend to "build a blackjack" by upgrading all of those parts, but was just curious about what the differences were to focus on areas I might want to improve. I think the 150's also have an oil cooler?

Taking it by the Genuine dealer is a great idea that had slipped my thoughts.

Thanks all!

[gearhead]

i believe the 125 engine is actually the best bang for your buck when looking at speed, mpg, reliability, economy, etc

[Skootz Kabootz]

Getting what you really want, even if it means having to wait, is always the best thing to do IMO.

[ericalm]

As far as the mileage differences, an older scoot with fewer miles is sometimes worse off. One of the worst things you can do to a scooter is let it sit! The carb will probably need cleaning and all the rubber parts and hoses should be checked.

On the other hand, 6K is a lot of miles for a 2009. If it's been well maintained, that may not be much of an issue. But you'll want to make sure that the wearables (rollers, belt, tires) have all been checked or replaced, that the valves have been checked and that it's had regular engine and gear oil changes.

[SK]

There's a Buddy 125 for sale in my area with 1850 miles for $1700.

Is that a bit high for the mileage or am I just being cheap?

I'm upgrading from a 50cc Piaggio Typhoon so my sense of what things should cost and how long they will last may be totally off.

Thanks for any tips! SK

[TobyDanger]

Depends a bit on the year and overall condition I guess, but that is a pretty decent price/mileage range from what I've seen in my area on CL over the last few weeks...

[jijifer]

My 125 was bought as "used" 4months old 1350miles on her. I paid $2k. Put in the 161cc Big Bore Kit, Prima pipe and upgraded the rear shock with the one from the blackjack and sliders in my variator - that was another $1500 or so since I had to pay someone to install everything. To finish making it a blackjack I guess I'd have to do the fancy disc brake and those NYC front shocks. Maybe change the variator and clutch?

As it is, my 125 now has over 15K miles on it, over 10K on the "Kit" and pound for pound (rider) my 125 kitted kicks the sh*t out of a blackjack. Not even close It took a rider 50lbs less on blackjack than the one riding my bike for the blackjack to win. That was they day my kit was put in. I bet NOW that weight wouldn't make a difference I 125 kitted with the big bore kit is SICK. The rear shock make it so much more stable, I imagine the front would do the same. I have no idea how much a difference the brakes and fancy clutch kit make.

[bpatrick5]

If you're buying it for resale, I think keeping the price as low as humanly possible is the key. And yet, if you're purchasing it as a casual ride or a daily rider, value is probably key. Value can be different to each of us. I bought a new one and have done almost nothing to it, mods-wise. My friend bought his and has sunk more into it in mods and updates than he originally paid for it. We're both equally happy with what we have.

Of course, keep your budget in mind. If you only have the budget for the purchase and maybe a routine service, you'd probably want to stay away from something with a lot of miles for the age or a project. If budget isn't so much an issue, wait for a BlackJack.

This is how I rationalize, anyway.

[gt1000]

Strange, I don't remember any sort of sustained complaints about Buddy fork seals and the link doesn't really prove your point. Wrong link maybe?

Just like with any two wheeler, you'll save a relative fortune buying used compared to new and you won't pay set-up charges either. Like Eric said, I'd beware of scooters that haven't been ridden and I'd ask for service records. Doesn't hurt to check oil and tire pressures too, if the current owner is ignoring the basics it's usually not a good sign.

If you were serious about re-creating a Blackjack I'd recommend holding off for a used BJ or just suck it up and buy a new one. Just like with Ducati's "S" models, the cost for an individual to purchase and install the upgraded "S" parts or "BJ" parts far exceeds what Ducati or Genuine pay for them when they buy parts direct. On the other hand, if it's only cosmetics you're changing, you'll save money buying used and customizing yourself.

[SK]

Thanks for the advice above ... I went ahead and bought the Buddy 125 and my 50cc Piaggio Typhoon is now sold and out on the roads with a wild, wild guy.

Going from 50 to 125 is fab and I am already in love with my Buddy. Now I just need to get this learner's permit / registration / title / inspection business over before I get pulled over for having no plates.

One thing -- the speedometer is broken. Common problem?

Estimated cost to fix?

Glad to join the forum as an official member!

[jijifer]

how's the speedo broken? if it's just a loose cable that's a cheap fix.

[michelle_7728]

I bought my '08 Buddy in July of '09. It had been sitting a while, but luckily everything was fine. I changed the engine oil and gear oil right away anyhow (prefering to know for a fact when they had been done) and had my scooter mechanic look it over to make sure everything was A-OK as soon as I was able to get it in to them.

1,800 miles and the speedometer is broken? Makes you wonder how many miles are really on it and if they tried to roll them back. I had to disconnect, then reconnect my speedometer (on my 2009 Buddy) when I replaced the top plastic piece that goes around the gauge cluster after I had an accident (had to replace my handlebars too, but that's probably irrelevent here).

Hopefully neither of these scenarios is the case and it is something innocent....like maybe it had never been tightened correctly when initially installed. Definitely not the norm (thankfully) for Buddy's as they are usually so well made, but there's a first time for everything.

It would be a good idea to take it in for a check up and oil change and have the technician take a look at it for you, IMO.

On the positive side, many Buddys on this site have been documented with HUGE amounts of mileage on them. Bone Girl had over 40K on hers, and it was still plugging dependably right along when it got retired and she got a Blackjack.

So short story is that the vast majority of the time, as long as you take care of your Buddy with regular maintenance, it will provide you with many miles / years of fun/reliable transportation.

Welcome to the site and happy scooting!

BTW--I was curious what a Piaggio Typhoon looked like, so for anyone else who is also curious: http://www.varsitycycle.com/used/typhoo ... 105s.shtml
Cute scooter, with some neat features. I like the fold down seat pegs, cable locking place and being able to kick start it (like the Buddy).

[Tee Jay]

The other day I was riding my 4 stroke Bajaj. I saw 2 people riding Buddy 125's about a quarter a mile ahead. I wanted to say Hello. We stopped at a Stop sign. I thought I got a 150 with gears! I got my "doors blown off" by the Buddys. I could catch them even though I wound out every gear.

The 125's are quick and good lookin.
Now I just added a Buddy Pamplona to my stable. Now I can catch up!

[SK]

Good to know that it's not a common problem. I mean, I think that's good or .... it could be Really Bad.

We have a new buddy shop in Boston, so once I get my plates (tomorrow) I'll be able to ride over there and ask for a once-over.

The *odometer* is fine -- I just can't tell how fast I'm going.

On the other hand, if you're going 40mph in Boston you're about to be stopped by a bicyclist, a student walking into the street, a cab driver, someone making a left turn from the right lane, someone swooping into the rotary, an ambulance, a police car, a fire truck ... if we had possums here, they would wander out as soon as you hit 38 mph. Boston is not about speed.

The Typhoon was replaced by the Piaggio Fly 50 which is a four-stroke. I didn't even realize it was no longer being made. I was a bit out of the riding loop with the whole get pregnant have a baby thing.

I liked the Typhoon but it was kind of like dating someone because they're available and you want the experience.

I have a much more romantic relationship with this Buddy already ... <sigh>

[michelle_7728]

Ah. I would have thought that if the speedometer was broken the odometer would be as well...shows how much I know! Don't quit my day job, right?

Anyway, I know you are going to just love your Buddy. Have fun and be safe!

[SK]

No, you can quit your day job b/c guess what? The odometer is broken as well. Why didn't I notice this? Because I'm an idiot, obviously.

Perhaps it was the bill of sale that the previous owner signed saying that the odometer was accurate that made me oblivious.

Well, it's off to the shop as soon as possible to see what I really bought. And then perhaps to small claims court if necessary, but so far so good, even if the seller was not as honest as I would like.

[michelle_7728]

What did you find out about your Buddy? Was it an easy / inexpensive fix?