Is This Why Some Diss Big Scoots?

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Sat Apr 06, 2013 4:58 am

neotrotsky · Post by **neotrotsky** » Sat Apr 06, 2013 5:09 am

It's been one of the reasons that I just don't like larger-displacement scooters: All of the disadvantages with none of the advantages.

Small scooters are quick off the line, maneuverable, small and affordable. It's what made the original Vespas, Lambrettas and the like popular. Now, a maxi-scooter can climb up into nearly the ten grand range, are heavier than their 250-300cc motorcycle counterparts, slower and frankly uglier. Sure, some bikes like the Vespa GTS300 break that mold, but then the price comes back and shows that not everything is the perfect balance.

Then again, there is an obvious market for those who want a slow, sluggish barcalounger on wheels that doesn't get *too* crazy on the road and doesn't require the tasking act of shifting. There are people who also like touring long distances on a scooter, which these bikes are more comfortable for. But, as was mentioned before, a touring scooter can cost almost as much as a more capable touring motorcycle.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Sat Apr 06, 2013 12:46 pm

WHY RED IS RED!

Ride what you like...like what you ride!

skipper20 · Post by **skipper20** » Sat Apr 06, 2013 4:13 pm

neotrotsky wrote:It's been one of the reasons that I just don't like larger-displacement scooters: All of the disadvantages with none of the advantages.

Then again, there is an obvious market for those who want a slow, sluggish barcalounger on wheels that doesn't get *too* crazy on the road and doesn't require the tasking act of shifting. There are people who also like touring long distances on a scooter, which these bikes are more comfortable for. But, as was mentioned before, a touring scooter can cost almost as much as a more capable touring motorcycle.

Hey, be careful now. My '87 Honda Helix 250 barcalounger on 2 wheels can move down the Interstate at 72 mph! And, with its Utopia backrest, I can just keep on riding and riding and riding........

Bill in Seattle

'12 170i Italia "The Olive Pit"
'87 Honda Helix 250 "Big Red"

viney266 · Post by **viney266** » Sat Apr 06, 2013 6:17 pm

As an avid motorcyclist and scooter rider. I really have no interest in big scoots. I have nothing against them, but I would just take one of my motorcycles instead. That being said I did over 3,000 miles on Stella last year and a fair amount on a friends buddy125. I do enjoy the scoots, just the big ones feel like I'm on a couch.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Sat Apr 06, 2013 9:28 pm

viney266 wrote:....the big ones feel like I'm on a couch.

Time to try a BV 350

.

Tazio · Post by **Tazio** » Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:19 pm

Yeah, you want big power, buy a Ural.

Berner · Post by **Berner** » Sat Apr 06, 2013 10:42 pm

> "city bike shootout"
> comparing for "urban supremacy"
> testing the bikes up in the mountains

I understand that filming the daily stop-and-start grind of true city driving isn't nearly as cool as filming the twisties, but I hardly think that carrying a pizza really says much about riding in the city.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Sat Apr 06, 2013 11:11 pm

JHScoot wrote:And with Honda doing a lot with their DCT auto these days, can the maxi's survive?

Isn't the Honda Integra a maxiscoot? In other words, perhaps the DCT is the future of maxiscoots.

charlie55 · Post by **charlie55** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 12:23 am

skipper20 wrote:Hey, be careful now. My '87 Honda Helix 250 barcalounger on 2 wheels can move down the Interstate at 72 mph! And, with its Utopia backrest, I can just keep on riding and riding and riding........

Bill in Seattle
'12 170i Italia "The Olive Pit"
'87 Honda Helix 250 "Big Red"

Dammit Bill, now everyone's gonna want one.

jprestonian · Post by **jprestonian** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 1:02 am

charlie55 wrote:
Dammit Bill, now everyone's gonna want one. :wink:

They don't last long on craigslist in Nashville, I can tell ya.
.

dakotamouse · Post by **dakotamouse** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 3:18 am

I thought it was a fun video. They ride more aggressively that I do but to each their own.

zuki · Post by **zuki** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 5:11 am

I have own several small scooters and I had a Yamaha majesty 400cc scooter. I loved the majesty it was a fairly light bike, it has room under the seat for 2 full face helmets,the seat is big and comfortable.The scooter would do at least 106 mph indicted on the speedometer, still had some to go just stop at that.The only reason I sold it was a buddy of mine bugged me so much to sell it to him I decided to buy a Harley sportster 1200. The sportster is a fun bike but I have no where near the storage that I did on the scooter. The 1200 definitely has more power and is cooler looking I dont get as good of MPG on the sportster and in town the sportster can be a pain shifting. After a month of riding the harley back and forth to work I went and bought a used Buddy 125 for the better MPG and just easier to commute in town keep the sportster for the weekends. My dad had a silverwing and it is a really heavy bike and he wasn't as happy with it as he is with his majesty he has over 14xxx mile and still going. Only thing I didnt like about the majesty was its a little to light on the highway where there are semi trucks when one passed me it would really blow the bike around.

charlie55 · Post by **charlie55** » Tue Apr 09, 2013 1:02 am

BTW:

Just got my barcalounger today:

That topcase is gonna be the first thing to go: it's a Helix, not a Helipad.

gr8dog · Post by **gr8dog** » Tue Apr 09, 2013 3:10 am

Aye, aye,aye.... what can I say. I have two scoots and love them both. The Buddy is quick, maneuverable , gets great mileage and can turn around in a phone booth. The Tmax is wayyyyy quicker than the Buddy, can take corners faster (much better lean angle), is 10 times more comfortable, more stable and gets 50mpg. Buddy can carry 2 bundles of firewood for camping along with my daughter on the back seat and a case of beer in the top box. Tmax can carry, well, no bundles of wood but a case of beer under the seat and another in the top box, both without removing cans form the box. Buddy can run on a 55mph highway as long as it's not uphill or against a stiff wind. Tmax can pass an 18 wheeler going 55mph in about 6 seconds.

The point is different scooters have different uses. Motorcycles are not as user friendly but use more of your skills to ride.

As for the video, the drag race was just silly. I don't know about you but I spend most of my riding time enjoying negotiating curves, not accelerating in a straight line for a few seconds and judging the bike on what place it finished. I'm happy to ride big or small, scooter or motorcycle. They're all fun.

skully93 · Post by **skully93** » Tue Apr 09, 2013 3:35 am

charlie55 wrote: That topcase is gonna be the first thing to go: it's a Helix, not a Helipad.

Oh come on, it matches perfectly!

Post by **ericalm** » Tue Apr 09, 2013 4:03 am

I'm not a fan of most maxis for a lot of the reasons above, but was impressed by the BMW C600. I spent months riding one. Yeah, it has its drawbacks, as in it's a really big scooter. No way around that. No point in criticizing something for being what it is if it does an excellent job of being what it is.

It's FUN AS HELL to ride. It handles better than many motorcycles and you can put a load of groceries in it. And it has heated grips, heated seats, a trip computer and all kinds of stuff those bikes don't.

ALL (quality) scooters cost more for the displacement/performance than analogous motorcycles. Again, a pointless comparison/criticism. It is what it is.

Compare it to a Burgman Exec or a SRV850 is you have to.

Scooterboi · Post by **Scooterboi** » Tue Apr 09, 2013 2:31 pm

Up front in the review they talked about looking for the best "Urban Assault Vehicle." And then they take it up a twisty canyon road.

That's all they are going to test!??! What about a crosstown run? How does it handle in traffic? How is it in a daily commute scenario? Eric, you are right and IMO they did not evaluate it for what it was designed for. They focused in on the "Sport" aspect and totally ignored the "Scooter" strengths. From that perspective the whole review is fundamentally flawed.

az_slynch · Post by **az_slynch** » Tue Apr 09, 2013 6:26 pm

The urban challenge was rather lame. I found the reference to the NC with DCT as a "bi-curious" motorcycle to be rather ignorant. Honda's put gas tanks under the seat for a while now (Goldwing) and didn't BMW do this layout on the F650ST? While I'd prefer a 6-speed version, the DCT transmission is pretty damn cool. It has clutches in lieu of a torque converter and can probably shift faster than they imagine that they can. It's a far cry from the CB750A Hondamatics (which was more like a VW Auto-Stick than a true slushbox). Technical details aside, the term they used implies that true scooters are clearly not the purvey of manly men.

Their review of the Ural is better. Especially the part about going off to retrieve an '82 MB5 by fixing it and riding it back. The off-roading bit looked like a blast too.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Tue Apr 09, 2013 6:38 pm

ericalm wrote:Compare it to a Burgman Exec or a SRV850 is you have to.

Better than an Ex in most ways, have never ridden an SRV
Would have considered an integra if available but looks like it lacks storage.

And yes..I am an urban....suburban commuter that on occasion has to do over 300 miles in a day for work, in 4 days it will be about 1,700 miles in one month on a C650GT

Anyone that thinks it a laggard, is slow or slugish doesn't have a clue what they are talking about.

Saying they are for people that can't be bothered with the tasking art of shifting...I rode CBR 2012 Vintage...yeah...I have pretty well mastered the tasking art and can outride almost anyone in the twisties on a vintage that I have taken the motor apart and modded. Bring you Buddy, Gt 300... whatever...and bring cash

It's all about the right ride for the right need.

OK...so now it must be time to get on 50cc riders, Harley riders, Sport riders, Vintage riders, chinese scooter riders...or what ever else is considered fun to bash by people that have never ridden them but have watched a video and are now experts on a particular model.
.

People seem to enjoy ragging and bitching about things when its obvious they don't have a fuc*ing clue what they're talking about.

TMax hates Burgman hates BMW hates Harley hates Vespas hates anything not Vespa hates 50cc hates maxi hates vintage hates tng hates etc etc.

Kudos to eric. I know he is not a maxi guy but he gave a good honest review from his perspective...after riding the machine...not watching a video.

It's been getting worse and worse on all the forums

I belong to alot of forums and try to help a lot of people out with 2T 4T Maxi 50cc TNG, but it's threads like this that make me think of just saying screw it...you got a problem...deal with it yourself and good luck.

In my opinion...people "dis" maxi scooters because they are uninformed dicks...just like the people that "dis" small displacement scooters like a Buddy

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Tue Apr 09, 2013 9:20 pm

Scooterboi wrote:Up front in the review they talked about looking for the best "Urban Assault Vehicle." And then they take it up a twisty canyon road.

That's all they are going to test!??! What about a crosstown run? How does it handle in traffic? How is it in a daily commute scenario? Eric, you are right and IMO they did not evaluate it for what it was designed for. They focused in on the "Sport" aspect and totally ignored the "Scooter" strengths. From that perspective the whole review is fundamentally flawed.

i agree on the canyons. i have never road the canyons. i have rode local hills that must be like the canyons, so i have an idea of what it must be like, but never the canyons

and i do not understand that aspect of riding? riding is not sport imo. it can be. but its not for me. so i will speak for myself. i suppose if you live near some canyons and must ride 'em you can like riding canyons fine. but riding 'em on purpose? not for me

maybe i just need a bigger bike? i have no idea of the sensation of speed and acceleration? is it "addictive?" will i want to push the machine just because i can? maybe my first trip to "the canyons" won't be my last? well whatever the case, it won't be on a supersport

but yeah, why take the bikes up there to test urban assault qualities? the MC riders just acted bored in the city? this i may never understand. this never happens with me. i don't get it? is it because i live in california and can ride freely on the streets? i cannot imagine how riding a straight line or taking a curve can make for more exciting riding then downtown L.A at rush hour? which i can assure you is never boring. if you're bored out there, be prepared to not ride for long

best urban assault bike? why, a GENUINE BUDDY 125/150/170, of course. but that goes without saying. prove me wrong, somebody! ah, but you can't

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Tue Apr 09, 2013 10:10 pm

JHScoot wrote:best urban assault bike? why, a GENUINE BUDDY 125/150/170, of course. but that goes without saying. prove me wrong, somebody! ah, but you can't

I fully agree. In my opinion a Buddy 125 is STILL the best bang for your buck you can get in a small displacement scooter and is perfect for "urban" riding. My commute is 70 miles per day at 70-80 mph..as good as they are a Buddy just can't do what I need it to do for commuting.

Rob · Post by **Rob** » Thu Apr 11, 2013 12:39 am

BuddyRaton wrote: It's all about the right ride for the right need.

OK...so now it must be time to get on 50cc riders, Harley riders, Sport riders, Vintage riders, chinese scooter riders...or what ever else is considered fun to bash by people that have never ridden them but have watched a video and are now experts on a particular model.

People seem to enjoy ragging and bitching about things when its obvious they don't have a fuc*ing clue what they're talking about.

In my opinion...people "dis" maxi scooters because they are uninformed dicks...just like the people that "dis" small displacement scooters like a Buddy

I don't get the need of some to bash other rides either. I ride the scoot, a midsized Honda MC and a large Kawasaki MC. Each has their own moments and their own disadvantages.

I can say that whether or other forums on with our riding friends. we receive some good natured kidding about the scoot and non-Harley bikes (the majority of our riding friends are Harley folks), but it's never serious.

Rob

ScooterMASS · Post by **ScooterMASS** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 12:13 am

BuddyRaton wrote:
JHScoot wrote:best urban assault bike? why, a GENUINE BUDDY 125/150/170, of course. but that goes without saying. prove me wrong, somebody! ah, but you can't
I fully agree. In my opinion a Buddy 125 is STILL the best bang for your buck you can get in a small displacement scooter and is perfect for "urban" riding. My commute is 70 miles per day at 70-80 mph..as good as they are a Buddy just can't do what I need it to do for commuting.

I disagree...The Buddy 125 is one solid scooter, but it frame is simply too small! At $2799.00 it's great if you're a smaller guy or a normal sized woman IMHO. The SYM HD200 @ $3499.00 puts the Buddy 125 to shame. 15.3HP that's water-cooled with front & rear disc brakes. Plus...I think the "look" of the HD200 is hard too beat. The $700.00 difference is worth it in every way. 10" wheels vs. 16" rims under speed? No comparison. Steel rims vs. Alloy? The Buddy 125 has it's place....bit it is "NOT" the best "Bang for the Buck"

http://alliancepowersports.com/models/HD_photos.html

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 1:55 am

ScooterMASS wrote:
BuddyRaton wrote:
JHScoot wrote:best urban assault bike? why, a GENUINE BUDDY 125/150/170, of course. but that goes without saying. prove me wrong, somebody! ah, but you can't
I fully agree. In my opinion a Buddy 125 is STILL the best bang for your buck you can get in a small displacement scooter and is perfect for "urban" riding. My commute is 70 miles per day at 70-80 mph..as good as they are a Buddy just can't do what I need it to do for commuting.
I disagree...The Buddy 125 is one solid scooter, but it frame is simply too small! At $2799.00 it's great if you're a smaller guy or a normal sized woman IMHO. The SYM HD200 @ $3499.00 puts the Buddy 125 to shame. 15.3HP that's water-cooled with front & rear disc brakes. Plus...I think the "look" of the HD200 is hard too beat. The $700.00 difference is worth it in every way. 10" wheels vs. 16" rims under speed? No comparison. Steel rims vs. Alloy? The Buddy 125 has it's place....bit it is "NOT" the best "Bang for the Buck"

http://alliancepowersports.com/models/HD_photos.html

i ride a Buddy 150 at 6'3, 230. nothing wrong with it, wouldn't trade it for anything when urban commuting and traffic doesn't rise above the upper 50mph range. same goes for my Agility 125 and i can give a thousand reasons why, but i won't

cost or "bang for the buck?" well, scooters are traditionally small, with small wheels. for many of us that is the appeal. and the light weight, too. i am sure you understand this? some pay more for the Buddy for what it is, not for what it isn't. in scooting i find sometimes less is more, and bigger is just bigger. the HD200 is not necessarily better or more comfortable or more stable or anything better, really. just different

its like many users here feel, yes you ride what you ride. but within the world of scooters you have many choices. and small for many of us is the best and sometimes only choice in a scooter. because we like small, nimble lightweight bikes for obvious reasons and would never consider a SYM HD200 a scooter that could put a Buddy 125/150/170 to "shame." i mean, seriously?

some of us could argue it might be quite the opposite concerning performance and handling characteristics in urban traffic, but i won't be the one. not worth $2800 over the more expensive, BIGGER competition? that is nonsense if the Buddy suits your needs for sustained MPH and it fits you. and you don't need to be a small frame person to be comfortable riding one. as said 6'3, 230 here

meh...whats the use

ScooterMASS · Post by **ScooterMASS** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 12:50 pm

JH: I appreciate that you like your Buddy so much. I was simply saying that I don't think the Buddy is the best bang for the buck. You're correct that some people like a smaller scooter with smaller ties. I myself do not. I find that 10" tires get a tad "squirrely" over 45MPH, plus I don't care of the look of 10" rims. Too cute looking for me. For the $700.00 price difference you get water-cooled vs. A/C. 15.3Hp vs. 9.52HP (huge difference) rear disc brake vs. drum. Alloy rims vs. steel (steel rusts bigtime where I live on the seacoast) There is a 1" seat height difference on the HD200 (31" vs. 30") In my book the SYM HD200 is a much, much better value overall. Both are solid scooters, no question, but in the end I would much rather pay a few more dollars & get all of the above.

dakotamouse · Post by **dakotamouse** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 1:26 pm

ScooterMASS wrote:JH: I appreciate that you like your Buddy so much. I was simply saying that I don't think the Buddy is the best bang for the buck. You're correct that some people like a smaller scooter with smaller ties. I myself do not. I find that 10" tires get a tad "squirrely" over 45MPH, plus I don't care of the look of 10" rims. Too cute looking for me. For the $700.00 price difference you get water-cooled vs. A/C. 15.3Hp vs. 9.52HP (huge difference) rear disc brake vs. drum. Alloy rims vs. steel (steel rusts bigtime where I live on the seacoast) There is a 1" seat height difference on the HD200 (31" vs. 30") In my book the SYM HD200 is a much, much better value overall. Both are solid scooters, no question, but in the end I would much rather pay a few more dollars & get all of the above.

Sooooooooooo your reason for joining Modern Buddy was not because you own or want a Buddy but to sell Kymcos?

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 2:29 pm

The SYM 200 and 250 were the most popular scooters I saw in Israel...by a long shot. They are great scooters but I'm not sure how the US supply structure for scooters or parts is following the Carter Bros fiasco.

And yes it is "only" $700 more...or about 20-30% higher than a B125...that is a significant difference...and don't forget about the additional sales tax.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:03 pm

dakotamouse wrote:Sooooooooooo your reason for joining Modern Buddy was not because you own or want a Buddy but to sell Kymcos?

Good observation!

ScooterMASS · Post by **ScooterMASS** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 3:09 pm

Dakota: I don't sell Kymco or any scooters for that matter. I'm "just" a scooter person! I own 2 Kymco's & LOVE them both. I'm on the Vespa, SYM, Kymco & ScootDawg forums. Please don't be "defensive" about your PGO's! They are excellent scooters with an awesome dealer network. I was simply stating my feelings. Not allowed here in Modern Buddy? I'm not being rude @ all....just think the HD200 is a better scooter for the money. The only problem I could see in the HD200 is @ 297 lbs. might scare some of the female buyers away.

BuddyRaton: Interesting that SYM is so popular in Israel. I really want to take a trip there @ some point in my life. It's on my "bucket-list" Alliance Power Sports is going about bringing SYM back into the US correctly. Give them a couple more years & they'll be back on track again. Carter Brothers really screwed SYM bigtime! As for the price difference...you're getting a lot more for your money! My bet is there is more margin in a Buddy 125 sale then there is for an HD200. Steel rims costs a lot less then making Alloy, plus water-cooling? The HD is a more complex scooter & more expensive to make. The B125 is really a modified GY6 engine. Inexpensive to manufacture. The HP alone is worth the extra money. I won't touch the tax scenario as it will only add a few bucks to the purchase price.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 4:34 pm

Don't get me wrong...the HD200 and 250 are great...but I would not want to wait a couple of years for parts availability to get sorted out.

I'm not saying that the extra money spent isn't worth it but for someone on a tight budget that needs basic transportation an additional $750 could be a deal breaker.

Honestly...most scooter chicks I know don't scare easily...and 297 lbs ain't gonna do it!

Yep..a Buddy is a modified GY6...that is pretty much bullet proof.

ScooterMASS · Post by **ScooterMASS** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 7:39 pm

Buddy: You're making it out that SYM doesn't have a parts network. Sure they do. It's just as not as good Kymco, Genuine etc. @ this point. They are getting better no question. I understand that an additional $700.00 kill a purchase of a new scooter, but if you spend $2800.00....why not go the extra mile & spill the extra coin?

I find these boards to be excellent, but many people "defend" their purchase as if their is nothing better. Sorry...folks (i.e. Dooglas & Dakota) you're incorrect in your replies. Funny....Dakota "claims" I'm a Kymco salesman...yet I'm in favor of the SYM HD200? How does that make any sense? Geez...Some people in here are worse then the snotty
Vespa owners!

anthony · Post by **anthony** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 7:56 pm

ScooterMASS wrote:I find these boards to be excellent, but many people "defend" their purchase as if their is nothing better.

As JHScoot pointed out, "better" is entirely subjective. There are some specs that are without question comparable (comparable as in compare-able where it can be determined that one is just better, i.e. HP or price), but some are more dependent on one's own preference, i.e. larger wheels or looks.

Those latter two are part of the reason I decided against a Sym HD125/200 when I bought my scooter. I don't ride on the highway, and I love how fun cornering is on the Buddy, so 16" tires just aren't as fun or practical for me. I also think the Sym is just plain ugly, but I've never been into the "sporty" scooter look (I find the Fiddle II much more appealing aesthetically). And of course, the 170i I have is fuel-injected, but I know none of the other Buddys are. As far as air-cooled vs. liquid-cooled, I was led to believe that practically-speaking, the benefit of that is in stop-and-go traffic on hot days, there's less chance of the engine overheating since it's not reliant on (the lack of) airflow to cool it. Anecdotal evidence from people I know who own modern, air-cooled scooters tells me that such a thing rarely actually happens.

Anyway, those are just some of the reasons I made the decision I made. Everyone will have their own criteria that's more or less important to them. I think the main point is that arguing that one is just all-around "better" than another is silly.

ScooterMASS · Post by **ScooterMASS** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 8:20 pm

Anthony: In the end...you're are correct sir. Everyone has their own likes & dislikes. I'm just thinking about "what you get" for the money spent! Do you understand why the B125 has just 9.53HP? One of the major reasons is because it's air-cooled my friend! 171cc engine vs. 125cc engine isn't a big leap. It's based on the carb. & if it's W/C. 15.3HP vs. 9.53 is over 50% in power! I like HP...how about you? The B125 is a modified GY6 engine & that's it. You can't make it better then it already is.

As I said...The Buddy 125 has it's place....but it's "not" the best bang of the buck! If anything it's in the middle of the pack if you ask me. Hell....I bought a 2013 Kymco Super 150cc for $2200.00 that I leave @ my parents home in Florida that I use 4-5 times a year. That's $600.00 less then a B125! Same engine when you break it down. The Super 8 is just as good as the B125 in my opinion & it's built in China as well.

DCUNITED4LIFE · Post by **DCUNITED4LIFE** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 8:23 pm

ScooterMASS wrote:Some people in here are worse then the snotty
Vespa owners!

Classic not plastic....lol, just kidding.

DCUNITED4LIFE · Post by **DCUNITED4LIFE** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 8:29 pm

I was led to believe that practically-speaking, the benefit of that is in stop-and-go traffic on hot days, there's less chance of the engine overheating since it's not reliant on (the lack of) airflow to cool it. Anecdotal evidence from people I know who own modern, air-cooled scooters tells me that such a thing rarely actually happens.

yep, I have never had an issue with my Blur in stop and go traffic and it's air cooled. In fact my problem is at speed, like 70mph+ indicated. I'm so wound out that the ECU kicks in and boggs the motor down so I don't fry it on hot days....honestly it sucks but a 220cc scooter probably wasn't designed to do indicated 75mph for hours in 90+ degree weather.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 8:52 pm

DCUNITED4LIFE wrote:
ScooterMASS wrote:Some people in here are worse then the snotty
Vespa owners!
Classic not plastic....lol, just kidding.

Vintage Scooter Chicks Rock!

Christophers · Post by **Christophers** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 10:37 pm

ScooterMASS wrote:
BuddyRaton wrote:
JHScoot wrote:best urban assault bike? why, a GENUINE BUDDY 125/150/170, of course. but that goes without saying. prove me wrong, somebody! ah, but you can't
I fully agree. In my opinion a Buddy 125 is STILL the best bang for your buck you can get in a small displacement scooter and is perfect for "urban" riding. My commute is 70 miles per day at 70-80 mph..as good as they are a Buddy just can't do what I need it to do for commuting.
I disagree...The Buddy 125 is one solid scooter, but it frame is simply too small! .... The SYM HD200... 15.3HP...water-cooled ... rear disc brakes...the "look"

So, in the words of Ali G, do we all "agree to degree"?

IMHO the HD200 sounds like a great value. OTOH I just don't see another scoot out there that does what a Buddy does for me quite as well as a Buddy.

I appreciate the small frame of the Buddy for exactly that. In an urban environment like L.A. there are a lot of really tight traffic situations where the small frame and wheels of the Buddy are significantly more comfortable and versatile negotiating traffic jams than larger frame scoots.

Of course I like more power - but not enough to pay more weight and scooter size. Which brings up one more thing. The Buddy has an incredible amount of storage and cargo capacity - straight out of the box. Bigger wheels tend to come at the cost of reduced cargo space in every scoot that I've looked at. For my money bigger wheels and less cargo capacity for more horsepower and a slightly smoother ride only serve to reduce the overall utility of larger scoots like the SYM HD200 and the large frame Vespas. The Buddy has hit a sweet spot.

Christophers · Post by **Christophers** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 10:39 pm

ScooterMASS wrote: .... The SYM HD200... 15.3HP...water-cooled ... rear disc brakes...the "look"

I forgot to say that I'm not that much into the "look" of the HD 200.

... just thought I'd throw that in there. :-)

az_slynch · Post by **az_slynch** » Fri Apr 12, 2013 11:18 pm

As a Kymco owner, I'd like this opportunity to endorse the Genuine Buddy lineup. Well-built machines that can rack up the miles with plenty of smiles and little hassle. The color schemes, special models and warranty are just more sprinkes on an awesome sundae.

Of course, take my opinion with a grain of salt. I have a love affair with rusty, rattly old tin scooters and strangely pointy, not-quite-cool plastic ones.

Finally, from one Kymco owner to another, slow your (t)roll, homes. To each their own. Besides, if you knew the shenanigans behind Alliance's SYM parts pricing, you might not hold the flag as high. I'd still buy an RV200 someday; but I'd make a point of importing my own dang parts.

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:10 am

Have more fun on a Buddy

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Sat Apr 13, 2013 2:30 am

ScooterMASS wrote:Geez...Some people in here are worse then the snotty Vespa owners!

Needless to say, you aren't making any points with me here. A little advice. Information about any model is always appreciated. Dissing someone elses scooter, be it Buddy, Vespa, or whatever - not so much.

Skootz Kabootz · Post by **Skootz Kabootz** » Sat Apr 13, 2013 3:10 am

JHScoot wrote:

Have more fun on a Buddy

Hey I recognize that handsome St. Tropez! In fact, I just came back from riding it!

I won't wade into the whole brand vs brand discussion but it is interesting to me, now that I own two scooters for the first time — my rock solid "small" Buddy (just turned over to 26,000 miles the other day) and now also my "big" GTS300 (a mere 5500 miles on that) — for the first time ever I have to (get to) choose which scooter to ride.

Definitely for city riding my Buddy gets the call. It is more practical/cheaper to repair/better in many ways for urban assault. While the GTS gets the call for my more ambitious adventure riding. But today I was just going for a fun little local ride along Mulholland Drive for kicks. So which scooter to take when practicality is no consideration?

Well, today it was hands down the Buddy just for its pure lighthearted fun factor. I have to say I have such an appreciation for the fun ride it provides. Not that I haven't always appreciated it, but now that I have the GTS to compare it to, I see it has its own special flavor of Buddy fun. Certainly on other days my GTS will get the call as (make no mistake it is a 100% spectacular ride and one I never want to be without) it too has its own special flavor of perfect fun.

I can only imagine that when at long last I finally get my Bonneville I will feel the same way about it too.

So TLDR; comparing scooters and asking which is "better" is like comparing chocolate ice cream to vanilla or any other flavor. They are all awesome. It just depends on which flavor you happen to be in the mood for on any given day. Just be glad you have a scooter and a day to ride it.

olhogrider · Post by **olhogrider** » Sat Apr 13, 2013 4:29 am

I had a Buddy St Tropez and a GTS to choose from too! I liked them both but ultimately I found the Buddy to be much more reliable. Now I have a Stella and a Scrambler to chose from.

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Sat Apr 13, 2013 8:52 am

woo-hoo!

i found a vid where a big scoot SMASHES a MC. gotta skip to 3:15, though

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/Lej-KopK1tc" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

ScooterMASS · Post by **ScooterMASS** » Sat Apr 13, 2013 12:31 pm

az_slynch wrote:As a Kymco owner, I'd like this opportunity to endorse the Genuine Buddy lineup. Well-built machines that can rack up the miles with plenty of smiles and little hassle. The color schemes, special models and warranty are just more sprinkes on an awesome sundae.

Of course, take my opinion with a grain of salt. I have a love affair with rusty, rattly old tin scooters and strangely pointy, not-quite-cool plastic ones.

Finally, from one Kymco owner to another, slow your (t)roll, homes. To each their own. Besides, if you knew the shenanigans behind Alliance's SYM parts pricing, you might not hold the flag as high. I'd still buy an RV200 someday; but I'd make a point of importing my own dang parts.

Az: I spoke my peace. I didn't "dis" the Buddy 125 @ all. I have heard of a few parts horror stories in regards to SYM. The upside is that they usually don't have many issues. Really not trying to be a troll @ all...Just sticking to my guns. I mentioned high praise for the Buddy line-up in my previous comments within this thread.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Sat Apr 13, 2013 3:35 pm

ScooterMASS wrote:Az: I spoke my peace. I didn't "dis" the Buddy 125 @ all.

Ah, that would be "piece". You certainly did not speak peace.

dakotamouse · Post by **dakotamouse** » Sat Apr 13, 2013 11:20 pm

ScooterMASS wrote:Buddy: You're making it out that SYM doesn't have a parts network. Sure they do. It's just as not as good Kymco, Genuine etc. @ this point. They are getting better no question. I understand that an additional $700.00 kill a purchase of a new scooter, but if you spend $2800.00....why not go the extra mile & spill the extra coin?

I find these boards to be excellent, but many people "defend" their purchase as if their is nothing better. Sorry...folks (i.e. Dooglas & Dakota) you're incorrect in your replies. Funny....Dakota "claims" I'm a Kymco salesman...yet I'm in favor of the SYM HD200? How does that make any sense? Geez...Some people in here are worse then the snotty
Vespa owners!

Not claiming anything. And everyone is welcome here. But your profile had you listed as a dealer...now I see it says sales rep. Got my scoots confused when I wondered if you were selling Kymcos but you were talking Syms. Just seemed strange to me.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Sun Apr 14, 2013 1:39 am

Just another has never ridden one but knows what is better for everyone else.

Don't feed the troll

http://scootdawg.proboards.com/index.cg ... read=53241

Wolfhound · Post by **Wolfhound** » Sun Apr 14, 2013 10:54 am

Interesting, BuddyRaton. Is it just me or does the writer on Scootdawg
and the writer on this forum seem to have a different writing style?
Almost like two different people. So I agree with your last comment.