2009 Blackjack never used - Good deal?

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mukaiboston
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2009 Blackjack never used - Good deal?

Post by mukaiboston »

So I went over to my local dealer to check out the SYM Symba (which I already decided I don't want for a number of reasons). I mention I'm looking for a new scooter and the guy mentions that he has a 2009 Buddy Blackjack sitting around. It only has 30 miles on it because it was never sold, but it has been primed for a no-show customer.

The thing has been upgraded to a Prima exhaust and may have had some brake and suspension upgrades as well. He said he just wants to get rid of it and could offer me a good deal (possibly in the range of $2700) - MSRP was $3500 in 2009.

Since it has never been sold, the two-year unlimited mileage warranty would be effective from the purchase date however...

The upgrades...I heard that voids the warranty but no clue on what the policy is if the dealer does it before it is sold.

Also, they keep these scooters packed like sardines and have to keep moving them around to get one out for a customer. It looks like someone wasn't careful and either scraped or got white paint on some of the Buddy's black panels. And I noticed the big screw was missing from the front panel.

Any thoughts on this deal? I'm thinking of asking him about the cosmetic damage and I need to check on the warranty for sure.
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craftynerd
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Post by craftynerd »

If I remember right, the Prima exhaust came stock on the Blackjack, but I'm not entirely sure...
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ed85379
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Post by ed85379 »

The prima exhaust and suspension upgrades come stock with the Blackjack, so do not affect the warranty in any way. If they are claiming that they were aftermarket upgrades that they did on top of the base price, they are lying to you.

When I bought my first Blackjack, slightly used from the dealer (had 1000 miles on it) in 2010, they charged $3000.

Then after that one was stolen a year later, I got another Blackjack from the same dealer, brand new, with about 3 miles on it, for $2700.

As I recall, the original MSRP was not quite $3500, but I can't be sure.

So, while $2700 is probably fair for a dealer-kept new Blackjack, if they really "just want to get rid of it", they can certainly go lower than that.

As for the missing screw, it kind of needs that. The white paint though maybe can be washed off, since the panels are just black plastic, not painted. That, plus any other damage, should push the price down even futher, I'd think.

Never be afraid to negotiate. Figure out how much you are willing to pay for it, and offer lower. Granted, the leeway on cost for scooters is not much, but again, if they really want it gone...
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CEZ2011
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Post by CEZ2011 »

The Blackjack came from the factory with a Prima exhaust and upgraded brakes and suspension. I believe NYC parts so unless the dealer made some other modifications it sounds as if it is stock, thus the warranty is not impacted. It never hurts to ask. The dealer should be able buff out the white mark and replace the missing screw. They should do complete pre delivery check before releasing it to the buyer.

In respect to the price the $2700 is not a bad price but since the model year 2015s are out the scooter is already 6 model years old. Scooter sales are slow so the dealer may be wiling to give you some more off the price or you could ask for a free 1st service or discounts on accessories. The BMW dealer in my area is discounting his 2014 C600'and C650 maxi scooter by $400 and years with of free gas. Negotiate.

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Re: 2009 Blackjack never used - Good deal?

Post by skipper20 »

mukaiboston wrote:So I went over to my local dealer to check out the SYM Symba (which I already decided I don't want for a number of reasons). I mention I'm looking for a new scooter and the guy mentions that he has a 2009 Buddy Blackjack sitting around. It only has 30 miles on it because it was never sold, but it has been primed for a no-show customer.

The thing has been upgraded to a Prima exhaust and may have had some brake and suspension upgrades as well. He said he just wants to get rid of it and could offer me a good deal (possibly in the range of $2700) - MSRP was $3500 in 2009.

Since it has never been sold, the two-year unlimited mileage warranty would be effective from the purchase date however...

The upgrades...I heard that voids the warranty but no clue on what the policy is if the dealer does it before it is sold.

Also, they keep these scooters packed like sardines and have to keep moving them around to get one out for a customer. It looks like someone wasn't careful and either scraped or got white paint on some of the Buddy's black panels. And I noticed the big screw was missing from the front panel.

Any thoughts on this deal? I'm thinking of asking him about the cosmetic damage and I need to check on the warranty for sure.
With winter just around the corner, I'm thinking a more reasonable price range is $2,200 - $2,400 especially with the white paint smears and the missing front screw. I say this because I bought my Blackjack this past June, at the height of the riding season, for $2500 + tax & license. It had 616 original miles and was basically in like new condition. I'd offer the dealer $2,200 and see what happens. If he balks, start walking towards the door and then see what happens. Good luck,

Bill in Seattle
'09 150 Blackjack
'12 170i Italia
'08 250ie Aprilia Sport City
mukaiboston
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Post by mukaiboston »

Thanks for the replies.

I guess I'm trying to find a ballpark figure so I know how much to negotiate. $2,200 seems more reasonable and closer to my budget constraints. The scooter is 6 model years old, has some cosmetic damage and winter is approaching.

I'll think about this. He was telling me I could accept financing and walk out with it that day. If I go back and offer him a cash deal, that might get him to budge a little. I'm just trying to get a fair deal for myself and want to know what is reasonably low for me to offer without insulting him.
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Post by skully93 »

There shouldn't be any warranty voiding. I would offer him something low, and if he balks tell him it's older, damaged, and he's been paying taxes on the inventory for ages.
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Post by BuddyRaton »

A new BJ with warranty at that price is a great deal. If they want to get rid of it they may have already given you their best price. If someone came back to me with a $2,200 offer I would probably just say no...go away.

I would shoot for $2500 see if they will split the difference if not go for some accessories, if not it's still a steal at $2700. It's a brand new BJ with warranty, the dealer probably has more into it than that already.
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Post by Whimscootie »

I'd offer $2500 out the door price. Cash would clinch it, I would think. :wink:
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Post by mukaiboston »

It's kind of a lot of money for me at the moment otherwise I'd go for it, but I definitely don't want to be cheap about getting a good, reliable scooter.

Around the area I live, you see two kinds of scooters. The cheap, Chinese ones that have tape and graffiti on them that people use to just get a cheap ride and the recognizable high-quality Genuines and Vespas. (Some SYMs too but it seems controversial as to how good they are).

I definitely need something that is going to last several years. My Buddy 50 needs repairs but it still runs smooth with nearly 16,000 miles on it. I would fix it up but I just need something more powerful. If anyone lives in DC...I want to be able to tackle all the steep hills plus ride up Rockville Pike in Maryland and Route 50 in Virginia. The Buddy 50 just can't handle those roads.
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Post by Whimscootie »

Wait til closer to Christmas. Someone needing Christmas money might part with a Genuine scooter of some type for a very low price.

Happens around here...
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Post by Dooglas »

One more thing to think about as far as value. The bike is going on 6 years old which means most rubber parts including tires are approaching the end of their useful lives. By and large, just sitting around is not good for a scooter.
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Post by mukaiboston »

Buying a used scooter (which is what I planned to do initially has its own risks as far as maintenance). The unlimited mileage warranty for two years is almost worth $1000 to me.

I know that the scooter was sitting around for a long time before it was primed. Now that it has been primed, the mechanics have been taking it out for a spin every once in a while.

But if anything should happen to be old and fail...two year unlimited mileage warranty, right?
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Post by ed85379 »

Make sure, and ask the dealer if the original warranty still holds. The dealer has to send paperwork to Genuine for it. It isn't automatic.
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Post by mukaiboston »

He said it would and is trying to us that as a selling point. The scooter was never sold; he only primed it because a customer was supposed to pick it up and was then a no show.
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Post by Dooglas »

mukaiboston wrote:But if anything should happen to be old and fail...two year unlimited mileage warranty, right?
Yes, and that is certainly a good thing. However a warranty does not apply to wear items, such as brakes, cables, and tires - that is why I mentioned taking things like tire replacement into account.
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Post by ravenlore »

The screw MUST be replaced if that dealer has any honor. Selling a bike as NEW means NEW-not missing parts.


Beyond that, as mentioned above tires and whatnot are aged and will need replaced sooner rather than later. Replacement cost of those things should be a negotiation point.
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Post by TVB »

mukaiboston wrote:The unlimited mileage warranty for two years is almost worth $1000 to me.
I wouldn't place that much value on it. The reason Genuine offers a two-year warranty is that they don't often need to honor it. Problems are uncommon, and when they happen they don't usually cost a lot to fix.

With almost any manufactured product, the most common times for it to fail are a) within the first few months of use, and b) after the planned useful life of the product. So, assuming it's been maintained and treated properly, a scooter with two years of riding on it is (statistically) less likely to have problems than a new one.

Of course statistics are only probabilities, not guarantees, so the warranty certainly has value as a kind of insurance. Buying new also eliminates the unknown variable of how the previous owner treated it. But all else (except mileage) being equal, I wouldn't spend an extra $1000 for new Genuine scooter compared to a used one.
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Post by mukaiboston »

This is all insight to me. I noticed that for the same price, a used Buddy 170i has appeared on Craigslist for my area. Less than a year old and only a few hundred miles.

If this owner took really good care of it, I probably would not need the warranty anyway. Plus, the engine is already broken. I'll have to decide what I should do.
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Post by BeefSupreme »

Maybe of some help, in 2012 my GF purchased a 2009 125 brand new from a power sports dealer for $2,000. Being as it sat on the floor for 3 years I think the front tire developed a flat spot. We did make sure they changed the brake fluid (which only has a life span of 2 years) and engine oil. She still got her warranty but never needed it. I'd low ball the hell out of that price. Odds are they're more interested in getting rid of it than making money. Oh.. and have them replace that bolt on the front and explain the "white mark".
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Post by mukaiboston »

Okay, I decided to pass on this.

I got a better deal on a 2013 Buddy 170i. A guy sold it to me for $2500 with all his accessories except a helmet. Near perfect condition with all the maintenance records (only a years worth, too).

I started that thing up wondering if I would regret my purchase but, I have to say, going from a Buddy 50 to a Buddy 170i is a crazy experience. I can't believe how responsive a quick this thing is. It goes from like a dead stop to 35 mph in one second.

I'm definitely not taking this thing on the interstate...well, I might just once to test how fast it will go. The people who sold it to me didn't recommend highway riding mainly because no one sees you.
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Post by skully93 »

Nice score!

having fuel injection is amazing. Just run a little cleaner through once in a while and you'll never have to deal with a gummed up carb.
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Post by KrispyKreme »

Hell of a score for a 170i. Take good care of that scoot and it will run forever.

When the tires wear out slap on some Heidenaus. Long lasting, good grip in all weather, but pricey.

Other that that, learn to change both oils. Money saver for sure. Ask the forum for help.
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Post by ankdworak »

skully93 wrote:Nice score!

having fuel injection is amazing. Just run a little cleaner through once in a while and you'll never have to deal with a gummed up carb.
The 170 doesn't have a carb. It is fuel injected.
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Post by mukaiboston »

KrispyKreme wrote: Other that that, learn to change both oils. Money saver for sure. Ask the forum for help.
Just changed the motor oil over the weekend. Unbelievably strong spring inside that drain hole. It took both me and my dad to screw the plug back on.
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