Your opinion on the repair....

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Sun Feb 12, 2017 12:50 am

Let me start from the beginning. My 09 Buddy 125 was starting to do the erratic idle nonsense, meaning it was carb overhaul time. Being busy with a Can Am Spyder with a air ride leak I decided to outsource the rebuild/overhaul. to someone else. A friend messed with it prior and buggered the carb settings anyways. So, I drop it off at a reputable dealer to have it fixed. They discover something wrong with the air filter also so they replaced it and reset the carb back to the base settings, but jumped the pilot jet up to a 40. Was a 38 from the factory. I didnt test ride it when I picked it up, just loaded in the truck and blasted back home. So, I go to ride it and it rides like a 50cc! Sluggish off the line and struggles to get past 45/50mph! Could a pilot jet change do all that? Could it somehow ended up with a air filter for a 50cc? Gonna check it over really good on Sunday. Has a 30 day warranty on repairs but Im starting to loose confidence in the shops repair ability. Gonna check it Sunday, but feel free to add your thoughts in the meantime.

iamryan25 · Post by **iamryan25** » Sun Feb 12, 2017 1:14 pm

That sucks getting home and then finding an issue.

If you brought it in for irratic idling they may not have ridden it above 20 at all.

It probably seemed fine on their lift inside the shop so they probably thought it fixed but once you're riding it under a load after the work they did you notice a NEW issue.

The issue you asked to be fixed may have been corrected so they may have thought it to be good to go.

Air filters for a 49 won't fit the 125, 150 or 170 - you can rule that out.

Sounds related to carb based on what you wrote, something still isn't right -- and it's probably not the idle jet bogging you at above 30.

If it has been sitting with old gas in it you might be dealing with an issue with an old part inside the carb failing.

Usually the symptom you described is caused by an issue with the diaphragm not opening correctly.

The condition may have reared its head after everything else was corrected. Or, the carb tuning is incorrect.

That said, mechanics sometimes don't get it right, they're people and mistakes happen.

I know how you feel losing confidence after a bad repair experience, but you'd be doing yourself right by trying to have them correct it.

I'd recommend contacting the shop and giving them a chance to fix it again.

Even though you discovered a NEW symptom (won't go above 30, before it was irratic idle) you need to let them know that there's a new symptom following the service you received.

Be sure to point out you're concerned it is related to the recent repair being done correctly, completely, and competently.

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Sun Feb 12, 2017 3:12 pm

I still need to look it over first and see if its something that may have happened in transit. Worse part about it was this-my friend was with me. We went to pick the Buddy up and he was looking at a Vespa 150. He was really set on it but knew we would have to go back next week to pick it up, since the Buddy was going home and its a small truck. So we when unload the Buddy at my house he ask to take it for a spin, as he forgot his gear for a test ride of the Vespa. He comes back and goes "Wow, 125cc's are SLOOOW!' and Im like "What?". So after I ride the Buddy I say "I think something is wrong with the carb still." He goes "I cant be taking stuff back that far if its not right the first time." and bought a different brand scooter that was local. So yeah, that repair did not look very promising in his eyes. I just may tackle it myself if its carb related anyways. I got drilled at work for days by my co-workers for not rebuilding it, and if it IS carb related STILL, I will never hear the end of it! I work in engineering/emissions with carbs and EFI for a living. I just didnt want to smell gas on the weekend for a change, and the Spyder had the lift blocked. Keep ya posted....

iamryan25 · Post by **iamryan25** » Sun Feb 12, 2017 8:02 pm

That must have been really disappointing.

It would suck to have that be the first impression of the buddy for anyone.

It's already bad enough you're dealing with trouble.

Whether or not you take it back to the shop they need a call to know there was an issue after your service.

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Sun Feb 12, 2017 10:59 pm

I sent them a email today. Looked it over and didnt find anything damaged during transport. Throttle pulls smooth and complete. No brakes sticking. Everything good in the transmission. Put new gas in it and took it on a 5 mile loop with cars on my butt while I had the throttle pegged. Will not go over 40mph. Wife says I paid them to restrict it to stock 50cc 4 stroke specs. Have a few more small things to check yet. Spark plug for tightness and gap. Any pinched fuel hoses (seen it happen before) and check the stator out put just in case. Oh, and no vapor lock, checked that already. Keep ya posted....

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Mon Feb 13, 2017 2:59 am

Plug tight-check. Replaced just in case-check. Swapped coil out with new in bag-check. Rode with no seat tray/seat to verify no pinched hoses-check. Checked stator output-check. Checked all grounds and battery terminals for tightness-check. Rode with no gas cap to verify vapor lock-check. The ball is in their court now. I need this scooter running so I can take the Burgman 200 down for transmission work. Oh, and I bought a highly tuned beast mode Yamaha Zuma 2t (bug eye) that has been sitting for a few years. I can be stupid sometimes!

dasscooter · Post by **dasscooter** » Tue Feb 14, 2017 11:10 pm

The CV boot may not be in there correctly. Remove the top cap, remove the CV boot and dab a little grease around the edge where the CV boot seals to the body of the carb. This helps you get the lid on without the boot jumping out of place - sometimes they shrink.

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Wed Feb 15, 2017 3:59 am

The boot/diaphragm/rudder thingy is likely the culprit, and I dont care to mess with it. Still hate messing with carbs because I do that all day at work. They said bring it back and they will make it right. Mistakes happen so I will give them the chance to make it right. This is also a test as I have been thinking of getting a MP3 against my better judgement (hear mixed reviews about them) and they will be doing most of the service work on it. But thanks to everyone who replied. Will let you all know the outcome of my visit when it gets corrected.

cummingsjc · Post by **cummingsjc** » Wed Feb 15, 2017 3:31 pm

sc00ter wrote:The boot/diaphragm/rudder thingy is likely the culprit, and I dont care to mess with it. Still hate messing with carbs because I do that all day at work. They said bring it back and they will make it right. Mistakes happen so I will give them the chance to make it right. This is also a test as I have been thinking of getting a MP3 against my better judgement (hear mixed reviews about them) and they will be doing most of the service work on it. But thanks to everyone who replied. Will let you all know the outcome of my visit when it gets corrected.

Most folks that have MP3s seem to like them a lot. I would include myself in that number having purchased a total of five of them (a 500 killed by a cager then it's replacement, a 250 for my wife which we upgraded to a 400, and a 500 for my father-in-law) over the last 6 years or so. They are generally a smooth and easy ride that garners lots of looks and stares. They do require a bit of extra maintenance in the front end and are a bit heavy overall for the engine displacement however. Overall, if my current 2009 MP3-500 died I would definitely consider replacing it with the newest model MP3.

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Wed Feb 15, 2017 3:43 pm

Thanks cummingsjc for the opinion. I found that Im starting to loose some nerve in the turns. Its a weird feeling that Ive never had before. Wet roads are the worst, and its raining today! I may try a race school also, as I can ride a bike good enough and have done some training/track days way back when I did ride bikes. The biggest hurdle is seeing if the wife likes the passenger area and if she can reach the floorboards on a MP3. That is a deal killer right there if she doesnt fit.

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Sat Feb 18, 2017 1:38 pm

As I was loading the Buddy 125 into the truck for the return trip to the shop that did the poor quality repair I noticed it was also back to pissing gas from the carb overflow still. My wife happened to be up and was also pissed, but not in the gas from carb kind! So we came to the conclusion to just rebuild it ourselves and cut ties with the shop that did the "professional rebuild" on the carb. Shame, as I liked them and they offered to make the repair right, but it should have been right the first time and I cannot keep going back and forth for a carb rebuild in a ratty old pick-up truck. We ride our Buddy's, not haul them to and from a shop for poor quality repairs. So I ordered the parts from Scooter Lounge along with some other needed parts. Gas smell on my day off...... At least it will be done right. Oh, and this also means no considering a MP3. Long story short-Unhappy wife, unhappy life. This time Im with her 100%. Let you all know what I find when the parts come in and I rebuild it.

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Sat Feb 18, 2017 5:28 pm

So initially this is what I have discovered. For 1 and a half hour labor rate overhauling/rebuilding the carb does NOT include:
1) Ultrasonic cleaning of anything. Body or internal parts. Still dirty on outside.
2) Replacing the rubber diaphragm. Seems brittle to me and does not lay in upper part very well.
3) Have yet to measure the float height but the float is very yellowed. Replaced? Not so sure.
4) Float valve stop looks replaced though.
Moral of story, If you want it done right, do it yourself. I really dont like smelling gas on my days off.
Side note. When I disconnected the fuel line the fuel stopped flowing. I replaced the fuel cock under tank not long ago because the old one was constantly leaking from old age. So now waiting on parts. Keep everyone posted.

cummingsjc · Post by **cummingsjc** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 2:29 pm

sc00ter wrote:So initially this is what I have discovered. For 1 and a half hour labor rate overhauling/rebuilding the carb does NOT include:
1) Ultrasonic cleaning of anything. Body or internal parts. Still dirty on outside.
2) Replacing the rubber diaphragm. Seems brittle to me and does not lay in upper part very well.
3) Have yet to measure the float height but the float is very yellowed. Replaced? Not so sure.
4) Float valve stop looks replaced though.
Moral of story, If you want it done right, do it yourself. I really dont like smelling gas on my days off.
Side note. When I disconnected the fuel line the fuel stopped flowing. I replaced the fuel cock under tank not long ago because the old one was constantly leaking from old age. So now waiting on parts. Keep everyone posted.

For the cost of the "carb cleaning and/or repair", it would have almost been cheaper to buy a brand new OEM carburetor and install it yourself. I am sorry for your experience.

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 4:10 pm

Yes, it would have been cheaper BUT I learned something. If this place cannot get a carb overhaul correct I would not want to trust them with a MP3! So it was a lesson learned the disappointing way. I guess money was involved to. I still might just replace the carb with a new one anyways. Just seems wasteful as all Im gonna do is toss the old carb in the recycle bin. To many hands have been in it at this point. The plus side is this is the only thing major that has gone wrong on the Buddy 125 in 11,000 miles. I do keep a spare stator on hand just in case. Still thinking of replacing it with something that has EFI or a simple 2 stroke. Time for a change.

cummingsjc · Post by **cummingsjc** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 5:14 pm

sc00ter wrote:Yes, it would have been cheaper BUT I learned something. If this place cannot get a carb overhaul correct I would not want to trust them with a MP3! So it was a lesson learned the disappointing way. I guess money was involved to. I still might just replace the carb with a new one anyways. Just seems wasteful as all Im gonna do is toss the old carb in the recycle bin. To many hands have been in it at this point. The plus side is this is the only thing major that has gone wrong on the Buddy 125 in 11,000 miles. I do keep a spare stator on hand just in case. Still thinking of replacing it with something that has EFI or a simple 2 stroke. Time for a change.

As you said, at least you learned something valuable about the dealership.

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Mon Feb 20, 2017 3:45 pm

I just got a whole new carb from Scooter Works. Factory replacement with adjustable air screw. I should have done this first instead of...... Anyways if someone wants the old carb it may be up for grabs. Free, just pay shipping. Need to ask a local friend if he wants it first but let me know in the meantime. Will put pressure on him as he takes forever to make up his mind!

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Wed Feb 22, 2017 3:07 pm

New carb is on its way and my friend does not want the old carb so-free used OEM carb for from a 09 Buddy 125, just pay shipping. Was professionally overhauled by a reputable shop! Works crappy now! Could use a overhaul by a monkey or a human who knows what they are doing. Im to lazy to do it. Will toss in whatever little spares I have for the intended rebuild. If no takers than into the recycle bin it will go, so it will get reclaimed either way.

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Thu Feb 23, 2017 3:47 am

Got a taker on the carb. Sent a reply (you know who you are) but its in my Outbox, not the Sentbox. Soooooo, I need a shipping address. Thanks!

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Sat Feb 25, 2017 2:40 am

Findings in case anyone wants to know. Turns out the accelerator pump spring was unhooked from the carb. Funny thing is, I reconnected it and the plunger plate still does not press the plunger down all the way. So that explains the restricted 50cc riding. Now, got the new, fresh out of box carb installed and I think the idle needs set. I need to get it up to temp first (only went around the block) before trying to set and take it and a nice looong run to get the fresh gas thru it. No matter how hard you try you cant get all the fuel out of the tank. Oh, the gas from the Buddy ran fine in the Burgman 200. Wonder if the Buddy will still gonna piss gas out the airbox. Will find out when I take it out tomorrow. Fuel hose was drip free the whole time the scoot was down, and the scoot got moved around to. Now to get the old carb out to its new owner. Still need a mailing address.

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Mon Feb 27, 2017 12:41 am

Wife and I discussed it and it has been decided, we are sending the Buddy off to a new home. I dont care to try and sell it so we may go the donation route. Going to contact WHRO and find out how that works. Im going to put the beast Zuma that I purchased back to Stage 1/reliable and keep it for a back-up and loaner. Buddy has served us well and was my wifes gateway drug to Can Am Spyders but it does not get ridden much and has been in the way(fighting for space with the Spyder and lost). Wonder if I will ever see it again? Maybe the next owner will end up on this site. We'll see soon!

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Mon Feb 27, 2017 7:43 pm

sc00ter wrote:I have been thinking of getting a MP3 against my better judgement (hear mixed reviews about them) and they will be doing most of the service work on it.

sc00ter wrote:Oh, and this also means no considering a MP3.

Well, you are certainly correct that you would not want to own an MP3 unless you had a local dealer who was very familiar with that specific bike, or you had substantial experience yourself. The MP3 is mechanically and electronically complex, and requires specialized maintenance including specialty tools for servicing. I owned one for several years and it is a fun ride, but I found that I could match the performance and simplify my life by owning a BV350.

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Mon Mar 06, 2017 3:17 am

Well, the balls in WHRO's court and the 08 Buddy 125 will be gone soon. May stop in now and then and see whats going on, but I dont see me buying another Genuine product anytime soon. Great products, just time for something different. So to everyone here- Keep the shiny side up and ride 'em like you stole 'em!

babblefish · Post by **babblefish** » Mon Mar 06, 2017 3:23 am

sc00ter wrote:Well, the balls in WHRO's court and the 08 Buddy 125 will be gone soon. May stop in now and then and see whats going on, but I dont see me buying another Genuine product anytime soon. Great products, just time for something different. So to everyone here- Keep the shiny side up and ride 'em like you stole 'em!

Happy trails to you, and be sure to stop by once in a while to say hello.

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Sun Mar 12, 2017 12:59 am

Alright, here is what happened. If you donate a scooter to WHRO it is considered a specialty vehicle, so you have to send photos for review. I was originally going to drop it off (ride it) to their intake center, but the scooter has become hard to start again. So I called back and told them to come and get it. They then wanted me to deliver it, but my truck needs brakes and I have it off the road at the moment. And besides, Im not a transport service. So they ended up not taking it. Now, here's were this gets weird. The guy who bought my old black Buddy 125 ended up getting the powder blue one off me. I cut him a buddy deal on the Buddy for $500, he can figure out the carb settings at that price. All I ever wanted was to have it riding great before passing it on, and in return I got to learn all sorts of neat things and it still rides kinda crappy.