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Burning through Belts with my Blur

 
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kirknkona
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Joined: 17 Jun 2017
Posts: 13
Location: Hawaii
Blur 220

PostPosted: Wed Nov 15, 2017 6:47 am    Post subject: Burning through Belts with my Blur Reply with quote

When I bought my Blur the previous owner let me know he had a problem with a shredded belt at 2k miles. I made it to 3500 miles before I shredded a belt. I noticed some slipping and some fluttering in the days before it broke. In retrospect I think I took some rough sounds to be an issue with the engine but now I feel like it's some imbalance in my roller weights or????. After changing the belt it ran like a new machine for awhile. But after only 200 miles I noticed the first tell tale signs very shortly before it gave out again. I got just over 200 miles out of that $135 belt! I can't tell if a shredded belt was making the variator knock, which is what it sounded like, or if a knocking variator is causing damage to the belt. When I installed this new belt it seemed like everything lined up well but I can''t help but imagine that some misalignment could be at the heart of my problem. I plan to put new roller weights in when I install the new belt. Maybe that will fix it. But please, if anybody has any ideas, please share. I am not a mechanic and I live very far from one in rural hawaii. We have no Genuine dealers so I'm quite on my own. Crying or Very sad
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HanShan
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Joined: 13 Apr 2017
Posts: 92
Location: North Carolina
2103 Genuine Blur 220i

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Do you have a picture of the shredded belt?
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kirknkona
Member


Joined: 17 Jun 2017
Posts: 13
Location: Hawaii
Blur 220

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 9:02 pm    Post subject: Photos Reply with quote

I'm attaching photos of the belt and broken outer secondary slider on the clutch which cracked and broke at the weld. Either the breaking belt dealt a death blow to the clutch part or the broken clutch caused the belt to break. The bike ran for about 10 miles after I first felt it slipping. That may have been the point when the clutch broke. There is a lot of melted rubber residue on the variator and clutch plates. This belt only lasted 200 miles. The belt before it lasted only 1000 miles. I'm starting to think all problems are the result of heat from riding hard up hills.
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kirknkona
Member


Joined: 17 Jun 2017
Posts: 13
Location: Hawaii
Blur 220

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 9:05 pm    Post subject: Broken clutch Reply with quote

Here is the clutch photo
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kirknkona
Member


Joined: 17 Jun 2017
Posts: 13
Location: Hawaii
Blur 220

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 9:18 pm    Post subject: First belt found in many broken pieces Reply with quote

The first belt broke in many small pieces. The second broke in one place. I'm afraid I didn't keep the first broken belt for comparison to compare melting. The second belt was melted on the inside, leaving residue on the inside plates yet it was the outer plate that broke. I suppose the culprit could be heat from the crankshaft
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GregsBuddy
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Joined: 11 Jan 2015
Posts: 326
Location: North SF Bay
Buddy 170i Vespa GTS 250ie Piaggio BV350

PostPosted: Fri Nov 17, 2017 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Both belts broke due to bell issue.
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kirknkona
Member


Joined: 17 Jun 2017
Posts: 13
Location: Hawaii
Blur 220

PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 12:07 am    Post subject: Bell issue? Reply with quote

This is a very interesting proposal. I'm not sure what the bell would have to do with it but I'm not a mechanic or an engineer. I had decided that, rather than replace just the outer sleeve, I'd go with a full clutch assembly (but minus the bell). I figured my bell is fine and why spend another $75 to get that. So I'm curious to hear why you would guess the bell. Is it because they notoriously cause belts to burn? I did notice several drillings that were done, probably by the factory, to balance the bell. Could an out of balance bell cause problems like this?
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HanShan
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Joined: 13 Apr 2017
Posts: 92
Location: North Carolina
2103 Genuine Blur 220i

PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 1:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If the belt is burning on the inside something might be out of alignment.

Measure your belt width as well. You might have gotten the wrong belt. It should be between 19 and 21 mm I think.
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kirknkona
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Joined: 17 Jun 2017
Posts: 13
Location: Hawaii
Blur 220

PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 1:33 am    Post subject: I may have found an answer.... Reply with quote

Very Happy . I have suspected an alignment issue and I have no idea how to adjust for that. Hopefully that won't be an issue with the new clutch I install. But here is a new interesting twist that may be the reason I have had issues. From the guy that I bought it from... He asked me if I ever coast down hills. And yes I have. In fact I have coasted for miles down steep hills. And he is telling me I probably "coasted and toasted". He explained that I always want the engine and drive train to be engaged and keeping up with the rear wheel. There is no neutral. The way he explained the wear I was creating by not keeping the belt powered makes sense. I did not know this. I had heard that going up hill can be problematic but apparently downhill even more so.
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Dooglas
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Joined: 08 Jul 2007
Posts: 3951
Location: Oregon City, OR
Buddy 125, GTS300, Typhoon 125

PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 5:03 pm    Post subject: Re: Burning through Belts with my Blur Reply with quote

kirknkona wrote:
I am not a mechanic and I live very far from one in rural hawaii. We have no Genuine dealers so I'm quite on my own.

Obviously I don't know anything about the specific area where you live, but I do know that all of the major islands of the state of Hawaii have scooter rental shops. Several of them rent Buddys and all rent scooters of similar design. If this problem is beyond your expertise, why not seek some help? Variator problems have the advantage that their operation can be observed at a work bench. BTW, if you suspect the rollers - look at them. Worn or damaged rollers show obvious signs of wear. Usually flat spots. And where are you getting these belts? Are they OEM Genuine belts or from another source. As HanShan said, it is not uncommon for problems to be caused by belts of the wrong size.
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chickdr
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Joined: 03 Jul 2009
Posts: 261
Location: Atlanta, GA
'11 Blur SS220i , '13 FZ6R

PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 4:49 am    Post subject: Re: Burning through Belts with my Blur Reply with quote

Dooglas wrote:
kirknkona wrote:
I am not a mechanic and I live very far from one in rural hawaii. We have no Genuine dealers so I'm quite on my own.

Obviously I don't know anything about the specific area where you live, but I do know that all of the major islands of the state of Hawaii have scooter rental shops. Several of them rent Buddys and all rent scooters of similar design. If this problem is beyond your expertise, why not seek some help? Variator problems have the advantage that their operation can be observed at a work bench. BTW, if you suspect the rollers - look at them. Worn or damaged rollers show obvious signs of wear. Usually flat spots. And where are you getting these belts? Are they OEM Genuine belts or from another source. As HanShan said, it is not uncommon for problems to be caused by belts of the wrong size.


That makes no sense to me. I coast down hills all the time. My belts last the expected 4k miles(I just put in my second replacement at 7800 miles). There is most certainly something else going on with a 200 mile belt life.
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babblefish
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Joined: 04 Dec 2007
Posts: 2588
Location: San Francisco
2006 Blur 180, 2008 Buddy St. Tropez

PostPosted: Tue Nov 28, 2017 10:15 am    Post subject: Re: Burning through Belts with my Blur Reply with quote

chickdr wrote:
Dooglas wrote:
kirknkona wrote:
I am not a mechanic and I live very far from one in rural hawaii. We have no Genuine dealers so I'm quite on my own.

Obviously I don't know anything about the specific area where you live, but I do know that all of the major islands of the state of Hawaii have scooter rental shops. Several of them rent Buddys and all rent scooters of similar design. If this problem is beyond your expertise, why not seek some help? Variator problems have the advantage that their operation can be observed at a work bench. BTW, if you suspect the rollers - look at them. Worn or damaged rollers show obvious signs of wear. Usually flat spots. And where are you getting these belts? Are they OEM Genuine belts or from another source. As HanShan said, it is not uncommon for problems to be caused by belts of the wrong size.


That makes no sense to me. I coast down hills all the time. My belts last the expected 4k miles(I just put in my second replacement at 7800 miles). There is most certainly something else going on with a 200 mile belt life.


Same with my Blur 150 (actually a 183). My last belt (Bando belt) had about 8K miles on it before I changed it. It had a lot of cracks on it, but it was still working and was certainly not shredded. I replaced it with another Bando belt and expect it last at least as long. I live in San Francisco so riding on hills is a given.

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