Buddy beginner break-in blues

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crcfailed
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Buddy beginner break-in blues

Post by crcfailed »

Hey there! New Buddy owner here concerned about a possible engine break-in faux pas. Sorry if I am a little long-winded... you can probably skip over most of it unless, for your amusement, you would like to gawk at my display of hopeless ineptitude. :D

Just picked up my Buddy today, and managed to ride it home from the dealership without dying. I guess the only reason "without dying" is an interesting detail is because I've never actually ridden a scooter or driven a car before today in my life due to extreme nearsightedness and other vision handicaps. Normally I take the bus or ride a bicycle, but due to failing health and failing bus service I felt forced to make a quick lifestyle change to keep functioning in society.

The dealer did not let me test drive one of these things before buying one, so needless to say I found myself in the difficult position of having to drive my new Buddy home as a complete newbie. Although I have read quite a bit, I really had no practical feel for it whatsoever. So I played around with it a little in the dealer's parking lot before taking it out on the road. Having ridden bicycles all my life, it was actually pretty easy to get the hang of it, and I felt comfortable enough to leave after a few good laps around the lot.

The ride home (about 7-8 miles) took me past the mall down a state road, through downtown, through the local university's summer construction maze, and up a river valley. Had to start and stop a few times to get my bearings, because I am so accustomed to thinking about the city in terms of bus routes that I started second-guessing where I was going. During that ride what I find I have the most trouble with is actually nothing to do with the scooter itself, but more with interpreting and processing complex traffic situations, making sure I am in the correct lane at intersections, etc. But I digress.

As soon as I got home, I started going over the owner's manual. On page 32, I found the "***VERY IMPORTANT***" engine break-in schedule. Somehow in all my prior reading, and also because I am hopelessly stupid concerning engine-having things, I'd managed to remain in the dark about such a thing as "engine break-in."

The first line, 0-95 miles: Avoid applying more than 1/2 throttle. Avoid cruising at constant speed.

Oops.

Yeah, I totally cruised down that state road at full throttle, pushing nearly 40mph for a good few green lights at least. And, come to think of it, I was actually pretty hard on the throttle after stops, too, because I was afraid of holding up traffic.

So how worried should I be? Did I get off on the wrong foot with my Buddy? Did I... did I destroy my Buddy???? :( :( :(

If it matters, my odometer now reads 20.6. And yes, I do intend to take it in for the recommended 1st maintenance at 200mi, and every scheduled maintenance thereafter.

The remaining 75 miles of phase 1 would be a familiar 1.2 miles to work, in which I cross one highway and cruise through 2 roundabouts through the research park, and then to church on Sunday about 1-2 miles through sleepy neighborhood streets, avoiding main roads.
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DeeDee
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Post by DeeDee »

I'd be more worried about getting some safety training than hurting your buddy. Look into a MSF beginner riding course. It very well could save your life.
JJScoot
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Post by JJScoot »

It will be fine. Two strokes are pretty hardy machines. Don’t sweat it. Just use this break in time to take it easy and cruise the backroads to get used to it and put some nice easy miles under your belt.
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Post by jrsjr »

And Welcome to Modern Buddy! :D

I second the MSF course suggestion. They can help you sort out what's what so you won't have so many different challenges vying for your attention while you are learning how to navigate around town as a driver/rider instead of a passenger. In the meantime please do be safe and don't fail any more cyclical redundancy checks. :wink:
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Stanza
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Post by Stanza »

Wait a second....the dealership didn't give you any guidance, or even a crash course in riding the thing? Even after you'd paid for it?
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crcfailed
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Post by crcfailed »

Stanza wrote:Wait a second....the dealership didn't give you any guidance, or even a crash course in riding the thing? Even after you'd paid for it?
I'd pre-paid for it in full. They gave me a 5 minute tour of the controls and how to start it, but didn't offer much more than that despite my obvious ignorance. I had to go back in once and ask for help with getting it off the center stand, because I couldn't figure it out. They were very polite, but also seemed really busy and I didn't want to be a bother, so I just figured it was my problem to figure the thing out beyond that.

Now I have a new problem... I'm scared to death I might have put the wrong type of oil in it! I had read in the manual about adding engine oil, but it didn't specify anything specific other than "2 stroke" (that's what "2T" also means I'm guessing...) and didn't offer many hints about when to add it or how much. There were several warnings about how using anything other than the "recommended" type would void the warranty. According to what I heard on the interwebs you're supposed to add oil every time you fuel up. Incidentally I had to fuel up today because they gave me the bike on a nearly empty tank. I called the dealership this afternoon to get more info on how to actually fuel the thing. I asked if I can just put whatever 2 cycle oil in it, and the guy was like "yeah sure." So I ended up buying this Penzoil 2 cycle outboard "TC-W3" oil which said it was good for boats, lawnmowers, chainsaws, motorcycles, etc. It was literally the only 2 cycle oil they had at the gas station, so I figured it was the right thing. I filled the oil thing up until I could see it in the tube, which didn't take a lot. Maybe 40-50ml tops.

Of course then I got home and had another look at the manual because I was second guessing myself. I finally found the oil specifications on one of the last pages, and I was supposed to use something called "SAE 140." I may have noticed the page before, but failed to connect the dots. Why they did not include that information (or at least a reference or footnote or something) in any of the other places the manual mentions oil, is beyond me. This manual is seriously garbage, I swear.

Although the relative silence about my break-in screwup is really killing me inside, I do appreciate the comments about safety. As a bicyclist I definitely understand its importance and also recognize my own vulnerability. I have done some reading on that topic too, but I will enthusiastically look into taking a course...IF I somehow don't destroy my scooter first, because clearly my attempted research in the area of basic care has failed to prepare me for ownership. :(

So, can/should I try and change the oil right now to get the TC-W3 out of it? I didn't run the scoot more than a couple blocks home after filling it, so maybe I can still fix my screw-up?
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crcfailed
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Post by crcfailed »

Just searched and came across this topic,

http://www.modernbuddy.com/forum/topic27954.html

I guess someone has done worse than me, at least I was in the ballpark :oops: :D

I guess I'm going to try to drain the oil reservoir and refill it with the Genuine recommended oil, the SAE 140 stuff.[/url]
JJScoot
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Post by JJScoot »

Take a breath. You’re ok. You put in the right oil. FYI you won’t need to do it every time you get gas. The sae140 is gear oil which you definitely do not put in tank for your gas mixture. It’s for your rear gear lubrication which you will do on your first service. I was pretty much in your situation too. The shop I bought from showed me how to start it. The rest I learned on my own.
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Post by JJScoot »

And really, you’re really very ok on the break in issue. There is a lot of info regarding 2 stroke break in (hard vs soft) and I came to the conclusion that if guys are out there going WOT from the get go, I was fine for the few times I opened it up in the beginning. Just try to vary your speeds and don’t cruise wot for long periods for those first few hundred miles. And don’t worry- you have a 2 year warranty anyway!
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crcfailed
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Post by crcfailed »

Whew, thanks lot JJScoot! You are right, I see now the SAE 140 is listed as the gear oil. I am just so on edge that I'm freaking out over nothing.

Maybe what I actually need to do is to grab a beer and chill out... :D
JJScoot
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Post by JJScoot »

That’s almost always the right answer!

I am new to the two wheel world. I bought my buddy about a year ago. I wouldnt hesitate to do it again. These things are so much fun and although I don’t like the sound of a 2 stroke, I would never buy a 4 stroke 50. Once you gain confidence you will be like me and daydreaming at work about taking a scoot. You’ll learn about it and probably want to make a couple of mods to make it yours. I’ve done a couple of simple things so far. There is a lot of info on this site. One thing I found nd easier to do is search on google and then add modern buddy to it. The search function here isn’t all that great. Enjoy your new scooter. It is a tough little guy and as long as you keep it upright, it’s all good.
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Post by Christophers »

JJScoot wrote:And really, you’re really very ok on the break in issue. There is a lot of info regarding 2 stroke break in (hard vs soft) and I came to the conclusion that if guys are out there going WOT from the get go, I was fine for the few times I opened it up in the beginning. Just try to vary your speeds and don’t cruise wot for long periods for those first few hundred miles. And don’t worry- you have a 2 year warranty anyway!
I was going to mention the hard vs soft break in controversy as well, but I wasn't sure if it also applied to 2 stroke engines. One of the reasons the hard break in approach is thought to be an option for modern engines is because of the quality of modern engine oils. (And 2T engines utilize an oil/gasoline mixture ~ hence I was not sure if this also applied to 2T motors)

I have broken in all of my new motor using the hard break in procedure with excellent results in each case ("like new" compression readings after several subsequent miles of hard riding).
Last edited by Christophers on Thu Aug 02, 2018 11:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.
If this is your first day with PSYCHO, you have to ride.
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Stanza
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Post by Stanza »

crcfailed wrote:
Stanza wrote:Wait a second....the dealership didn't give you any guidance, or even a crash course in riding the thing? Even after you'd paid for it?
I'd pre-paid for it in full. They gave me a 5 minute tour of the controls and how to start it, but didn't offer much more than that despite my obvious ignorance. I had to go back in once and ask for help with getting it off the center stand, because I couldn't figure it out. They were very polite, but also seemed really busy and I didn't want to be a bother, so I just figured it was my problem to figure the thing out beyond that.

Now I have a new problem... I'm scared to death I might have put the wrong type of oil in it! I had read in the manual about adding engine oil, but it didn't specify anything specific other than "2 stroke" (that's what "2T" also means I'm guessing...) and didn't offer many hints about when to add it or how much. There were several warnings about how using anything other than the "recommended" type would void the warranty. According to what I heard on the interwebs you're supposed to add oil every time you fuel up. Incidentally I had to fuel up today because they gave me the bike on a nearly empty tank. I called the dealership this afternoon to get more info on how to actually fuel the thing. I asked if I can just put whatever 2 cycle oil in it, and the guy was like "yeah sure." So I ended up buying this Penzoil 2 cycle outboard "TC-W3" oil which said it was good for boats, lawnmowers, chainsaws, motorcycles, etc. It was literally the only 2 cycle oil they had at the gas station, so I figured it was the right thing. I filled the oil thing up until I could see it in the tube, which didn't take a lot. Maybe 40-50ml tops.

Of course then I got home and had another look at the manual because I was second guessing myself. I finally found the oil specifications on one of the last pages, and I was supposed to use something called "SAE 140." I may have noticed the page before, but failed to connect the dots. Why they did not include that information (or at least a reference or footnote or something) in any of the other places the manual mentions oil, is beyond me. This manual is seriously garbage, I swear.

Although the relative silence about my break-in screwup is really killing me inside, I do appreciate the comments about safety. As a bicyclist I definitely understand its importance and also recognize my own vulnerability. I have done some reading on that topic too, but I will enthusiastically look into taking a course...IF I somehow don't destroy my scooter first, because clearly my attempted research in the area of basic care has failed to prepare me for ownership. :(

So, can/should I try and change the oil right now to get the TC-W3 out of it? I didn't run the scoot more than a couple blocks home after filling it, so maybe I can still fix my screw-up?

You'll be good on what's in the tank for now, but ditch that W3 oil and get something that's going to meet the requirements for the bike. Somewhere in the manual it covers it, but if memory serves it needs to be an oil that is JASO FD rated. Basically, synthetic, high grade stuff. Brand probably doesn't matter, as long as it's got that rating. The bike has a catalytic converter built into the pipe, and you don't want it clogging up with the cheap stuff.

What's in the tank, plus that little splash of gas station oil will be fine for a few hundred miles. But find an autozone, or a motorsports dealer and get the good stuff. Your bike will thank you.
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Engine Oil

Post by 14Buddy50 »

I use Maxima Formula K2 Racing 2-Cycle Oil.

It says premix only, but consider a misnomer.

Here's a note of importance:

Filling the tube until you see it in there is a bad idea.
Why?
Because the tube connects into the top of the reservoir.
The connection between the tube and the reservoir can leak.
This will get oil all over everything.

Here's what you should do:
When filling oil, open the seat.
Use a cross+point screwdriver to open the door on the bottom of the hatch.
Visually look to see the oil filling in the opaque white tank.
Just fill it a bunch, just not beyond the top and into the tube.
JJScoot
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Post by JJScoot »

Yes, get a good synthetic to use instead of the stuff you got at the gas station. You'll be surprised at how long you can actually go between fills- I know I was. I also learned that if I filled to up in the tube I would get some of it dripping out for a few days.
dasscooter
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Post by dasscooter »

Pro tip: Buy 2 stroke oil from your dealer

Normal city driving is fine for break in. Don't take it on a highway trip but you don't have to putt around at 15mph for 400 miles.
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Post by sc00ter »

I use Yamalube for 2-strokes. Most places that sell Yamaha motorized products sell it. Motorcycle and motorboat, so its easy to find. Safe for injector systems (your Buddy 50) and pre-mix. The injector/auto-mix reservoir under the seat (when full) will last around 600 miles before the oil light will come on. Actually, the oil light will flash when it gets low when you hit bumps. Don't ride it with the light on solid, I top mine up when it starts doing the random bump flash. I also find it funny that the oil reservoir will hold just under a quart, so you will have a bit left over for the next top up.
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