Speed. Blur 150 or Buddy 150 faster?

vbl · Post by **vbl** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 3:58 pm

Off the line and near the top.

Thoughts?

NoogaScooter · Post by **NoogaScooter** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 4:01 pm

I have a Buddy 125 (not 150) and a Blur.

The Buddy 125 in my opinion is quicker and maybe the same top end if not faster. I would imagine the 150 Buddy would really take the Blur.

EP_scoot · Post by **EP_scoot** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 4:20 pm

I don't have a Buddy, I have a Blur.
The Buddy might be faster than the Blur as I am guessing it is lighter. But I would think the same rider would be able to ride the twisties faster on a Blur than a Buddy because of chasis, suspension, wheel size, etc.

Post by **jrsjr** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 6:31 pm

The Buddy 125 is quicker than the Blur 150 because of the Blur's higher weight. The Blur handles and stops better than the Buddy because of it's superior suspension and brakes.

Don't know which is faster on the top end. It'd be interesting to run them flat out side-by-side to see.

NathanielSalzman · Post by **NathanielSalzman** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 6:42 pm

I can't attest to the top end, but my Blur 150 is quicker off the line than my wife's Buddy 125. I bet gearing has a lot to do with it.

vbl · Post by **vbl** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 6:51 pm

NathanielSalzman wrote:I can't attest to the top end, but my Blur 150 is quicker off the line than my wife's Buddy 125. I bet gearing has a lot to do with it.

That seems exactly opposite what several people said above.

Anyone have actual specifications on the power output, weight and gearing of both 150s?

EDIT: Most of the resources I've looked at (bikez.com, PGO's website, various reviews) show the Blur as, on average, about 50 lbs heavier.

With the same engine one would expect the Buddy to be faster, but the gearing may still be the x-factor.

My assumption would be that the Blur has a higher top end gearing, with the Buddy being geared for more off the line performance.

NathanielSalzman · Post by **NathanielSalzman** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:00 pm

That seems exactly opposite what several people said above.

Yeah, that's why I brought it up.

If the weather weren't all crappy in Minneapolis today, I'd grab a stop watch and do some tests.

Post by **illnoise** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:09 pm

Rider weight has a ton to do with it. a skinny chick on a Buddy 125 could easily kick my fat a** on the Blur.

I'd agree that the Blur and Buddy 125 are fairly similarly matched, I'd guess with evenly-weighted riders, the buddy'd accellerate a bit faster and the blur would eventually catch up and pass it, but not by much.

I've still not seen a straight-up test of the 125 vs 150 Buddys, I have a feeling the 150s not WILDLY faster, but i'd imagine that'd give it a clear advantage over the blur, speed and acceleration-wise.

As a Blur owner, I should point out that speed means nothing once you've encountered the handling and braking of the Blur, that extra couple mph will no longer matter. : )

Bb.

NathanielSalzman · Post by **NathanielSalzman** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:13 pm

As a Blur owner, I should point out that speed means nothing once you've encountered the handling and braking of the Blur, that extra couple mph will no longer matter. : )

That's the truth! There's a G-Max 50cc in Asia and I imagine it's a blast, even without all the power. Once I rode the Blur for about 5 minutes I realized "this is how a scooter should ride", walked back into Scooterville and laid my money down.

Post by **jrsjr** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:46 pm

vbl wrote:With the same engine one would expect the Buddy to be faster...

I would expect the Buddy to be quicker, as in accelerate faster, due to lower weight. I saw your 56 lbs weight difference number elsewhere in this thread. I don't have the numbers, but I think the weight difference between the Buddy and the Blur is actually greater than that. I could be wrong. Anybody?

brimstone · Post by **brimstone** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:46 pm

this is the rule of thumb i use.

if you have to go farther and faster, then go bigger.

jradanov · Post by **jradanov** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 7:58 pm

I am also interested in whooping the biggest Vespa I can, I wonder if I dare drag a 200?

Post by **illnoise** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 8:14 pm

jradanov wrote:I am also interested in whooping the biggest Vespa I can, I wonder if I dare drag a 200?

You'd probably have a chance.

I can beat just about anything on my Vespa Primavera 125, because it's so light and small and it's geared so well (it's the Buddy of the olde tymes). If only the brakes worked, at all. : (
I've smoked sportbikes before.

For 30 feet anyway, ha.

Bb.

jradanov · Post by **jradanov** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 8:20 pm

Ha.

I smoked and then cut off a rude Aston Martin punk on Palm Beach not so long ago--couldn't resist, safety or not. Of course he spanked me at the next light once he decided to pay attention; I didn't even get 30 feet. I blame those damn dual exhausts! Now, one of the new 150s might have hung in longer...

NathanielSalzman · Post by **NathanielSalzman** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 9:09 pm

I don't have the numbers, but I think the weight difference between the Buddy and the Blur is actually greater than that. I could be wrong. Anybody?

According to PGO...

Weight/HP of the Blur 150: 291 lbs / 10.33 hp = power-to-weight of .035 hp/lb

Weight/HP of the Buddy 125: 223 lbs / 9.52 hp = power-to-weight of .043 hp/lb

So the Buddy's got a weight advantage large enough to offset the Blur's bigger engine. But that still doesn't account for wheel size and gearing though. I want to do a stop-watch test! I don't even care if I'm wrong, I just want to know! Stupid rainy snow!

KRUSTYburger · Post by **KRUSTYburger** » Fri Apr 11, 2008 11:15 pm

NathanielSalzman wrote:Weight/HP of the Blur 150: 291 lbs / 10.33 hp = power-to-weight of .035 hp/lb

Weight/HP of the Buddy 125: 223 lbs / 9.52 hp = power-to-weight of .043 hp/lb

So the Buddy's got a weight advantage large enough to offset the Blur's bigger engine.

And that's just the 125. I think he was asking about the Bud150!

Post by **jrsjr** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 12:01 am

NathanielSalzman wrote:According to PGO...

Weight/HP of the Blur 150: 291 lbs / 10.33 hp = power-to-weight of .035 hp/lb

Are those PGO stats for the the Blur or the GMax? Some of the Asia market GMax scooters have a different (4-valve) head (and a ceramic coated cylinder which I don't believe the Glur has) and, hence, make more horsepower. Just wondering...

jfrost2 · Post by **jfrost2** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 12:35 am

People are getting 70+ mph on the blur on a flat road, people get 60-65mph on a buddy on a flat road. The blur in the end has higher top, but no one is sure about acceleration yet. Most of us own 1 scooter or if more than one, it's probably not a blur.

Corsair · Post by **Corsair** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 12:49 am

illnoise wrote:Rider weight has a ton to do with it. a skinny chick on a Buddy 125 could easily kick my fat a** on the Blur.

I'm sorry but... HAHAHAHAHAHAHA! ok back to your regularly scheduled programming.

Post by **jmazza** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 1:46 am

jradanov wrote:Ha.

I smoked and then cut off a rude Aston Martin punk on Palm Beach not so long ago--couldn't resist, safety or not. Of course he spanked me at the next light once he decided to pay attention; I didn't even get 30 feet. I blame those damn dual exhausts! Now, one of the new 150s might have hung in longer...

Every day on my commute. Every day.

Either a punk in a sports car or an old ass lady in a Lincoln trying to cut me off. Smoke 'em all.

Post by **ericalm** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 8:35 am

The Blur was included in the side-by-side unscientific comparisons that Motorsport did some time ago.

Motorsport Scooters wrote:I love working at a scooter shop. We took 5 bikes out on Friday and did off the line and top speed tests. Here's the results. I think the buddy did quite well for a 125.

Off the line:
1. Kymco People 150
2. Buddy!!!
3. Vespa LX150
4. Blur 150
5. Kymco Agility 125

Top Speed:
1. Kymco People 150
2. Vespa LX150
3. Buddy!!!
4. Blur 150
5. Kymco Agility 125

Having ridden next to a Kymco People 150, I can attest to the fact that it hauls ass.

Dibber · Post by **Dibber** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 1:45 pm

Thanks Eric for this information. I never new the Kymco 150 was that fast and I always thought the Blur was supposed to a really fast scooter. Sure am glad I bought a Buddy and not the Blur.

Post by **jrsjr** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 2:34 pm

ericalm wrote:The Blur was included in the side-by-side unscientific comparisons that Motorsport did some time ago.

Motorsport Scooters wrote:I love working at a scooter shop. We took 5 bikes out on Friday and did off the line and top speed tests. Here's the results. I think the buddy did quite well for a 125.

Off the line:
1. Kymco People 150
2. Buddy!!!
3. Vespa LX150
4. Blur 150
5. Kymco Agility 125

Top Speed:
1. Kymco People 150
2. Vespa LX150
3. Buddy!!!
4. Blur 150
5. Kymco Agility 125

I wonder if we could convince Max to run that again with a Buddy 150. Smackdown!

Post by **ericalm** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 4:45 pm

Dibber wrote:Thanks Eric for this information. I never new the Kymco 150 was that fast and I always thought the Blur was supposed to a really fast scooter. Sure am glad I bought a Buddy and not the Blur.

Yeah, again, that was one of the problems with marketing and selling the Blur. The fact is, when most prospective first-time scooter buyers are thinking about scooters, they are thinking about something vaguely Vespa-shaped with classic, retro looks. To sell something that looks like a Blur (very modern, somewhat maxi-like, an angled, not curved design with a hump in the step-through) to these customers—who I would guess make up a huge percentage of Buddy buyers—the Blur would have had to offer major performance advantages over the Buddy. And it just didn't. At best, if all the anecdotal reports are wrong, it may have had some edge in speed and top end. But not enough to sway most buyers away from the Buddy.

When strangers ask me about my scoot, the first question is often "How fast does it go?" When they go into a dealer, they probably ask the same thing.

A Blur 250 would be a totally different thing altogether. Even then, if it's to appeal to the more speed-freaked or performance-oriented side of the market (which will grow as more people adopt to scooters) or lure potential motorcycle buyers, the Blur should have more performance upgrade/mod options so people can trick them out.

IMHO, it just wasn't a product the U.S. scooter market was ready for. Maybe a different version, in the near future... Which may happen, but I've heard rumors (discussed elsewhere in the forum) of some other plans for a PGO 250cc engine...

Post by **jrsjr** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 7:50 pm

ericalm wrote:IMHO, it just wasn't a product the U.S. scooter market was ready for.

Amen.

ericalm wrote:...I've heard rumors (discussed elsewhere in the forum) of some other plans for a PGO 250cc engine...

You know what's weird? I looked on the PGO site, and I don't see a 250cc scooter there any more. I know they used to make a 250cc GMax. I don't see that, or any other 250cc scooter, on their site. Have PGO stopped making the 250cc engine?

P.S. It looks to me like they've changed the focus of their larger engine development to ATVs. I guess that's where the money is these days...

Post by **illnoise** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 8:07 pm

The 250 Blur looked basically like the 150/200, but the engine and suspension were totally different.

And again, don't knock the Blur until you've tried it. A jet engine mounted on a rollerskate is faster than the Blur, too, but it's not such a joy to ride. Speed ain't everything.

Bb.

Post by **jrsjr** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 9:03 pm

Something nobody ever talks about, which is a big consideration for you Chicago folks, the Blur is practically immune to cross-winds. Traditional scoots with legshields are hateful to ride in strong crosswinds while the Blur is hardly affected by them at all.

EP_scoot · Post by **EP_scoot** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 9:37 pm

The reason I got the Blur is not to be the fastest on a straight line, it is to have the most fun on the twisties

vbl · Post by **vbl** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 10:10 pm

jrsjr wrote:Something nobody ever talks about, which is a big consideration for you Chicago folks, the Blur is practically immune to cross-winds. Traditional scoots with legshields are hateful to ride in strong crosswinds while the Blur is hardly affected by them at all.

It definitely has an aerodynamic advantage.

DarbyWalters · Post by **DarbyWalters** » Sat Apr 12, 2008 10:24 pm

jradanov wrote:Ha.

I smoked and then cut off a rude Aston Martin punk on Palm Beach not so long ago--couldn't resist, safety or not. Of course he spanked me at the next light once he decided to pay attention; I didn't even get 30 feet. I blame those damn dual exhausts! Now, one of the new 150s might have hung in longer...

West Palm Beach makes Beverly Hills look like a slum. I used to race the 24hours of Moroso up there for Mazda. I used to leave a week early just to hang out. We would start the race on New Years Eve and finish on New Years Day.

NoogaScooter · Post by **NoogaScooter** » Mon Apr 14, 2008 5:57 pm

Owning both, I would have to agree that the Blur handles MUCH nicer than the Buddy in turns and higher speeds, as well as windy conditions. It just begs to take the twisties and such. The brakes on the Blur are da bomb! They can't be beat.

NathanielSalzman · Post by **NathanielSalzman** » Mon Apr 14, 2008 6:09 pm

NoogaScooter wrote:Owning both, I would have to agree that the Blur handles MUCH nicer than the Buddy in turns and higher speeds, as well as windy conditions. It just begs to take the twisties and such. The brakes on the Blur are da bomb! They can't be beat.

Indeed! The Blur is just ridiculous fun.