Buddy performance pipe!
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- SirLexelot
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Buddy performance pipe!
Just got an email of specials from Scooterworks, and it included a BUDDY 125 PERFORMANCE PIPE! Nice The price is $189, and it's a Prima pipe. Here's the pic and info:
_________________
Buddy 125 PERFORMANCE PIPE
LOOKS, SOUND and PERFORMANCE turn your Buddy into a DEMON. From Prima...absolutely top quality.
Part number PE31
Our Price: $189.00
[/img]
I wonder what kind of performance increase/mileage decrease this will make...
_________________
Buddy 125 PERFORMANCE PIPE
LOOKS, SOUND and PERFORMANCE turn your Buddy into a DEMON. From Prima...absolutely top quality.
Part number PE31
Our Price: $189.00
[/img]
I wonder what kind of performance increase/mileage decrease this will make...
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- x-mojito50mod
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They have 11g roller weights as well.x-mojito50mod wrote:http://www.psn-scooters.co.uk/htm/pgo3.htm
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Is there any other place we can find this pipe. I am very interested in increasing the pickup on my 125. I have done searches under Japan Speed, but I am not sure if that is the brand name or just the name of the pipe.
Any help will would be greatly appreciative.
Any help will would be greatly appreciative.
Evil will always prevail, cause Good is just dumb!
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They have a Prima Pipe at www.clevelandscooters.com
http://autos.ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/ ... w/e9b3?b=5
http://autos.ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/ ... w/e9b3?b=4
Pics:Performance Pipe: $199 - Stainless Steel, Chrome plated and built to
last a lifetime, Designed specifically for the Buddy 125. More
details to follow as I rack up the miles and see what it can really
do. Initially it's a kick in the pants and sounds great.
http://autos.ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/ ... w/e9b3?b=5
http://autos.ph.groups.yahoo.com/group/ ... w/e9b3?b=4
- pocphil
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Buddy Pipes, Racks and Bags
We have the new Prima Exhaust Pipe for the Buddy 125.
For those wondering, it is NOT an expansion chamber, 4 strokes do not benefit from expansion chamber theory.
The sound is great, the performance seems better, but we won't have exact numbers for you until we get a chance to run it on the dyno.
Fit and Finish is second to none. I've seen pipes from the UK that cost twice as much but don't look as well made or finished. Installation is a snap and shouldn't take more than a few minutes by anyone with a 12mm wrench.
Also just in are the Givi Small Collapsible saddlebags. Weatherproof and easy removed and converted to messenger bags with included shoulder straps. These look like they were custom designed for the Buddy and other smaller scooters. You can unzip the sides and they nearly double in size, able to carry just about anything.
http://clevelandscooters.com/_wsn/page11.html
We've heard people complain that there are no more chrome racks out there...we have a full supply of ALL of the Buddy accessories.
http://clevelandscooters.com/_wsn/page12.html
For those wondering, it is NOT an expansion chamber, 4 strokes do not benefit from expansion chamber theory.
The sound is great, the performance seems better, but we won't have exact numbers for you until we get a chance to run it on the dyno.
Fit and Finish is second to none. I've seen pipes from the UK that cost twice as much but don't look as well made or finished. Installation is a snap and shouldn't take more than a few minutes by anyone with a 12mm wrench.
Also just in are the Givi Small Collapsible saddlebags. Weatherproof and easy removed and converted to messenger bags with included shoulder straps. These look like they were custom designed for the Buddy and other smaller scooters. You can unzip the sides and they nearly double in size, able to carry just about anything.
http://clevelandscooters.com/_wsn/page11.html
We've heard people complain that there are no more chrome racks out there...we have a full supply of ALL of the Buddy accessories.
http://clevelandscooters.com/_wsn/page12.html
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Phil Waters
ClevelandMoto
Pride Of Cleveland Scooters
18636 Detroit Rd.
Lakewood, Ohio 44107
216-227-1964
www.clevelandmoto.com
ClevelandMoto
Pride Of Cleveland Scooters
18636 Detroit Rd.
Lakewood, Ohio 44107
216-227-1964
www.clevelandmoto.com
- vitaminC
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Re: Buddy Pipes, Racks and Bags
That pipe looks great!pocphil wrote:We have the new Prima Exhaust Pipe for the Buddy 125.
Do you know the weight difference between the stocker and Prima? Every pound counts!
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- vitaminC
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Re: Buddy Pipes, Racks and Bags
Would also be great to get an idea of any jetting and airbox mods that might eek out an extra 0.5 hp!pocphil wrote:We have the new Prima Exhaust Pipe for the Buddy 125.
For those wondering, it is NOT an expansion chamber, 4 strokes do not benefit from expansion chamber theory.
The sound is great, the performance seems better, but we won't have exact numbers for you until we get a chance to run it on the dyno.
Definitely looking forward to seeing those dyno results!
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Well, I personally don't have a showroom, but Scooter World KC has it in stock. I was dropping off one review bike and picking up another and I was told that while I was waiting for the new one I needed to try out the pipe equipped Buddy. So you should go up and check it out.KidDynomite wrote:Bryce......do you have it on your showroom? Also, is there a place I can go online to confirm when you are/aren't having Sunday rides? Football season is over and--weather permitting--I'm healed up and ready to ride.
Check the club message board if you want to know when we're riding. This time of year, people post stuff when they plan to do some riding. There's always the weather to deal with, but we shake things up a bit this time of year. We've done several Saturday rides because some Sundays haven't been cooperative weather wise.
Oh, and don't forget Will Scoot 4 Food III, our annual charity ride. It's February 4th.
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I heard the same thing from Phil at POC. Just figured I'd ask to confirm what I thought.
BTW, I didn't get the Scooterworks ad.
ECS
BTW, I didn't get the Scooterworks ad.
ECS
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"I aim to misbehave."
Yes, I wear a helmet and a FIRSTGEAR armored jacket.
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Yes, that is an NRA sticker on the fender.
"I aim to misbehave."
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The scooterworks add is here: http://www.scooterworks.com/images/pdf/ ... lowres.pdf
I also can't wait to see the results of the test![/url]
I also can't wait to see the results of the test![/url]
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So I wrote to PGO to see if they would sell me their dual exhaust that they show on their web site. My e-mail was forwarded to Genuine Scooter who in turn referred me to Scooterworks.
Here is the correspondence:
Ron:
PGO forwarded your email to me.
www.scooterworks.com sells a high performance pipe for the Buddy 125 scooter under the Prima brand. I have a ridden a scooter with this pipe installed and it makes a VERY noticable increase in power (and it sounds really good, too).
I hope this is helpful information.
Brett Ratner
Genuine Scooters Dealer Development
877.MY.STELLA
At Scooterworks they refer to this link: - sparty provided the link above as well.
http://www.scooterworks.com/images/pdf/ ... lowres.pdf
On this flyer they advertise the Prima PE31 for $189.00
The flyer says “Buddy 125 – Polished stainless performance pipe. GROWLS like a little lion and adds more oomph to an ALREADY speedy machine.
Yep, it does nullify the old warranty…who cares?"
So, should I do it?
I would hate to void the warranty just for more noise.
Here is the correspondence:
Ron:
PGO forwarded your email to me.
www.scooterworks.com sells a high performance pipe for the Buddy 125 scooter under the Prima brand. I have a ridden a scooter with this pipe installed and it makes a VERY noticable increase in power (and it sounds really good, too).
I hope this is helpful information.
Brett Ratner
Genuine Scooters Dealer Development
877.MY.STELLA
At Scooterworks they refer to this link: - sparty provided the link above as well.
http://www.scooterworks.com/images/pdf/ ... lowres.pdf
On this flyer they advertise the Prima PE31 for $189.00
The flyer says “Buddy 125 – Polished stainless performance pipe. GROWLS like a little lion and adds more oomph to an ALREADY speedy machine.
Yep, it does nullify the old warranty…who cares?"
So, should I do it?
I would hate to void the warranty just for more noise.
- ScooterDave
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I think I just found tool #3 after Phil McCaleb & Randolf. Golly Brett, I want my scooter to sound really good too. Gee whiz, do you think the gang at the malt shop will like it or will they give me the business for voiding my warranty?rajron wrote:I have a ridden a scooter with this pipe installed and it makes a VERY noticable increase in power (and it sounds really good, too).
I hope this is helpful information.
Brett Ratner
Genuine Scooters Dealer Development
877.MY.STELLA
In my opinion, if you want to try it, then buy it. Just put the stock muffler back on before you take it back to the dealer for service. Myself, I would not buy a product just because sme guy says it gives you "VERY noticable increase in power". That is very subjective. I find it hard to believe that Phil does not have access to a Dyno to actually show the improved power (if any). If it does make my Buddy go faster, show me.
Dave
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- ericalm
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Well, these things are usually purchased on the basis of other riders' self-reports. So the more reserved among us wait while the early adopters go out and get their pipes just to see what happens.
*This Brett Ratner isn't a tool. This one: TOTAL TOOL.
This one I can directly address: Brett Ratner is not a tool.* He's actually been very responsive and helpful to a number of people on the forum, myself included. That's more than you'd get from corporate at any other scooter company. Still, he works for The Man (in this case), and gave the company line on the pipes. What do you expect him to say? "There's a pipe which will void your warranty in exchange for as-yet-undetermined effects on your performance." Not likely.ScooterDave wrote:I think I just found tool #3 after Phil McCaleb & Randolf. Golly Brett, I want my scooter to sound really good too. Gee whiz, do you think the gang at the malt shop will like it or will they give me the business for voiding my warranty?
*This Brett Ratner isn't a tool. This one: TOTAL TOOL.
Eric // LA Scooter Meetup Group // Stella 4T // Vespa LX // Vespa LXS // Honda Helix // some, uh, projects…
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Far be it from me to fuel the flames of Dave's feelings for Phil and Scooterworks/Genuine, but...
Does anybody other than me have a problem with the pipe that scooterworks is advertising and selling voids the warranty and they say "who cares"?
Perhaps I am missing something, but isn't Genuine the sister company and owned by the same guy as scooterworks? If they really wanted to sell us something like this, and really thought it wouldn't hurt our Buddy, how about honoring the warranty? To make matters worse, they say "who cares".
It bothers me on some level that the guys who are supposed to honor our warranty are telling us not to care about voiding it. Yes, I know Genuine and Scooterworks are technically two different companies, but they're sister companies owned by the same guy. Genuine wouldn't exist if it weren't for Scooterworks.
Maybe it's just me, maybe it's just that I'm not feeling real well this morning. Maybe I am mis-reading something here. I love my scooter, but I don't think Genuine is doing a great job making me feel like they care about their customers. When is the last time Genuine updated their website? If you go to their website, you might get the idea the only scooter they really care about was named Stella.
Does anybody other than me have a problem with the pipe that scooterworks is advertising and selling voids the warranty and they say "who cares"?
Perhaps I am missing something, but isn't Genuine the sister company and owned by the same guy as scooterworks? If they really wanted to sell us something like this, and really thought it wouldn't hurt our Buddy, how about honoring the warranty? To make matters worse, they say "who cares".
It bothers me on some level that the guys who are supposed to honor our warranty are telling us not to care about voiding it. Yes, I know Genuine and Scooterworks are technically two different companies, but they're sister companies owned by the same guy. Genuine wouldn't exist if it weren't for Scooterworks.
Maybe it's just me, maybe it's just that I'm not feeling real well this morning. Maybe I am mis-reading something here. I love my scooter, but I don't think Genuine is doing a great job making me feel like they care about their customers. When is the last time Genuine updated their website? If you go to their website, you might get the idea the only scooter they really care about was named Stella.
Kevin
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Holy Pipe Performance Batman!
I did not know that both companies were owned by the same guy! That would make sense to sell a pipe that would not void the warranty then. I would still like to see some Dyno numbers. And I am not investing 200$ for sound. My local guy said they were getting a pipe in soon, but would not be selling it to the public until they got numbers. That is smart! and I have to give Dan big ups for being honest like that. Anyway, this is my first time reading flaming notes on this forum, does this happen often, is it just Scooter Dave, or do I need to read around more?
Anyway, may your rides be smooth and fun!
GFP out
I did not know that both companies were owned by the same guy! That would make sense to sell a pipe that would not void the warranty then. I would still like to see some Dyno numbers. And I am not investing 200$ for sound. My local guy said they were getting a pipe in soon, but would not be selling it to the public until they got numbers. That is smart! and I have to give Dan big ups for being honest like that. Anyway, this is my first time reading flaming notes on this forum, does this happen often, is it just Scooter Dave, or do I need to read around more?
Anyway, may your rides be smooth and fun!
GFP out
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I don't know why people are getting all wound up about this pipe and it's advertising. I'm new to scooters but have been modifying my cars for years. In general it is rare to see "real numbers" (dyno charts etc) from an aftermarket exhaust. Also in my looking into a Stella or older Vespa I have never seen any dyno charts for pipes or even a full on head kit which is much more expensive and involved than a bolt on muffler. Very few aftermarket companies are willing to actually prove their hp claims. Also Genuine or Scooterworks is not the first company willing to sell you bolt ons that will void you warranty.
Personally I think the pipe looks nice, has been getting positive feedback so far and is very reasonably priced. I plan to buy one in the spring when I take the Buddy out of storage.
Personally I think the pipe looks nice, has been getting positive feedback so far and is very reasonably priced. I plan to buy one in the spring when I take the Buddy out of storage.
- rajron
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When you modify a car, the item modified looses its warranty, not the whole car warranty. To modify emissions related items it is against most state laws. In the case of exhausts anything behind the catalytic converter is open, if not too loud and some states say the pipe end has to be behind the rear axel.
So does the Buddy 125 incorporate a catalectic converter it the exhaust pipe? Is the exhaust part of emissions control?
I don’t know those answers so, to me, the advertising is confusing because it just states the void of some warranty.
For that matter: I think modern day small engines are tuned very well and are pretty much optimized by the factory. You always see the guys with the loud exhaust pipes (cars) who swear they feel an increase in power to their ride but the reality of it atmospheric conditions contribute more to feeling changes in engine performance than an exhaust pipe. After all who can feel a difference between let’s say 120 hp and 125 hp or whatever the claim may be.
Still its intriguing, for the pipe that is relatively inexpensive easy to change, and change back (warranty) it might give me an edge over another Buddy 125.
This is really why I am hoping someone comes up with some performance charts like PGO did with their dual pipe exhausts where it clearly showed the new pipe at higher rpm had an increase in torque and horsepower- that will finalize it, I would by the pipe today!
When its all said and done I am really just writing this to convince myself to get the pipe - just dont want to spend the money to make more noise.
So does the Buddy 125 incorporate a catalectic converter it the exhaust pipe? Is the exhaust part of emissions control?
I don’t know those answers so, to me, the advertising is confusing because it just states the void of some warranty.
For that matter: I think modern day small engines are tuned very well and are pretty much optimized by the factory. You always see the guys with the loud exhaust pipes (cars) who swear they feel an increase in power to their ride but the reality of it atmospheric conditions contribute more to feeling changes in engine performance than an exhaust pipe. After all who can feel a difference between let’s say 120 hp and 125 hp or whatever the claim may be.
Still its intriguing, for the pipe that is relatively inexpensive easy to change, and change back (warranty) it might give me an edge over another Buddy 125.
This is really why I am hoping someone comes up with some performance charts like PGO did with their dual pipe exhausts where it clearly showed the new pipe at higher rpm had an increase in torque and horsepower- that will finalize it, I would by the pipe today!
When its all said and done I am really just writing this to convince myself to get the pipe - just dont want to spend the money to make more noise.
- gt1000
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Bingo! And, I'd like to take this a step farther. Personally, I'll take the word of a person I trust over some arbitrary dyno numbers churned out by god knows who, got knows where. Dyno numbers are not, by definition, accurate, mainly because dynos (as I understand them) are calibrated to an "average" bike. Scooters are not your average bike. If you're thinking about performance parts your best bet is to arrange for a test ride on a bike equipped with those parts. Use your own personal butt dyno. While the butt dyno may exaggerate, the butt dyno does not lie.DO3 wrote:I don't know why people are getting all wound up about this pipe and it's advertising. I'm new to scooters but have been modifying my cars for years. In general it is rare to see "real numbers" (dyno charts etc) from an aftermarket exhaust. Also in my looking into a Stella or older Vespa I have never seen any dyno charts for pipes or even a full on head kit which is much more expensive and involved than a bolt on muffler. Very few aftermarket companies are willing to actually prove their hp claims. Also Genuine or Scooterworks is not the first company willing to sell you bolt ons that will void you warranty.
Personally I think the pipe looks nice, has been getting positive feedback so far and is very reasonably priced. I plan to buy one in the spring when I take the Buddy out of storage.
As for the warranty, I'm mixed. The Buddy has a pretty good warranty and I'm hesitant to void it for a bit more power, so I'll wait. I think Ducati handles this issue unusually well. Their motorcycles come with fairly quiet stock exhaust systems, mainly to pass the DOT drive-by tests. You can purchase all sorts of aftermarket exhausts that pump up the performance, volume and looks but also void the warranty. However, you can also buy a Ducati approved system built by Termignoni that includes pipes and performance chip that does NOT void the warranty but still provides the look, sound and tunable performance increase.
Of course, the Termi system costs more than most of the competition...
Andy
2006 Buddy 125 (orange), going to a good MB home
2009 Vespa 250 GTS (black)
2012 Triumph Tiger 800 (black)
2008 Ducati Hypermotard S, traded for Tiger 800
2006 Buddy 125 (orange), going to a good MB home
2009 Vespa 250 GTS (black)
2012 Triumph Tiger 800 (black)
2008 Ducati Hypermotard S, traded for Tiger 800
- lobsterman
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We're generally fairly flame retardant around here, but ScooterDave and Phil McCaleb (owner of scooterworks/genuine) have a special relationship going way back many years to when boys were boys and real men rode only vintage Vespas. Things were said, gauntlets thrown, etc.GalacticFattPatt wrote:Anyway, this is my first time reading flaming notes on this forum, does this happen often, is it just Scooter Dave, or do I need to read around more?
If you've seen "Dead Men Don't Wear Plaid" you know how Steve Martin's character got whenever anybody said "cleaning woman". It's kind of like that if you mention scooterworks or Phil McCaleb around ScooterDave.
For my part, I am probably all wrong about my reaction to the "who cares?" comment about the warranty. Like I said, not feeling too good today (I stayed home, no riding for me today).
Kevin
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- ericalm
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To further the connections, I think there's a relationship between Scooterworks, Genuine and Prima!lobsterman wrote:Does anybody other than me have a problem with the pipe that scooterworks is advertising and selling voids the warranty and they say "who cares"?
Perhaps I am missing something, but isn't Genuine the sister company and owned by the same guy as scooterworks? If they really wanted to sell us something like this, and really thought it wouldn't hurt our Buddy, how about honoring the warranty? To make matters worse, they say "who cares".
It bothers me on some level that the guys who are supposed to honor our warranty are telling us not to care about voiding it. Yes, I know Genuine and Scooterworks are technically two different companies, but they're sister companies owned by the same guy. Genuine wouldn't exist if it weren't for Scooterworks.
But... That's not how I interpreted the advertising. I'm not one to give companies the benefit of the doubt; these guys are obviously motivated to sell pipes. "Yep, it does nullify the old warranty...who cares?" seems like a facetious way of putting a disclaimer in the ad. It's aimed at the sort of riders who have posted on various threads saying that they'd happily sacrifice their warranty for a pipe or cylinder kit—the aforementioned early adopters looking for speed at any price.
That message is somewhat different than telling us not to care about our warranties... They know those who do care will wait on performance mods.
Eric // LA Scooter Meetup Group // Stella 4T // Vespa LX // Vespa LXS // Honda Helix // some, uh, projects…
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Flaming is strongly discouraged on MB. From the Posting Guidelines:GalacticFattPatt wrote:Anyway, this is my first time reading flaming notes on this forum, does this happen often, is it just Scooter Dave, or do I need to read around more?
I would think this extends to personal attacks against well-known members of the community who may not be participating in the forum, particularly when these attacks aren't informative, constructive or even pertinent. Don't bother reading around more for other flames, you won't find them.Personal Attacks
Personal attacks, even minor ones, are strictly prohibited.
Dave, please tone it down and leave out the personal jabs and name calling. I know you have some kind of beef with a bunch of these guys and, frankly, I don't care what it is. This isn't the appropriate place for airing it or venting. It's clearly affecting the tenor of the forum when other members start taking notice. Thanks.
Eric // LA Scooter Meetup Group // Stella 4T // Vespa LX // Vespa LXS // Honda Helix // some, uh, projects…
- ScooterDave
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Do some people still not know that Scooterjerks & Genuine are both owned by Phil?ericalm wrote:To further the connections, I think there's a relationship between Scooterworks, Genuine and Prima!
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I was adding Prima to that list.ScooterDave wrote:Do some people still not know that Scooterjerks & Genuine are both owned by Phil?ericalm wrote:To further the connections, I think there's a relationship between Scooterworks, Genuine and Prima!
Eric // LA Scooter Meetup Group // Stella 4T // Vespa LX // Vespa LXS // Honda Helix // some, uh, projects…
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I did not know that they were related. All I know is that the are made overseas. I saw the pics from the factory tour and road testing course. Pretty cool! I wish they had those testing roads in my area. That looks fun.
Have any of you heard of parking lot scooter racing. I was in a store a couple weeks ago and the salesman said some guy was in there buying lether chaps for racing his scooter. That sounds like fun too!
back to work
GFP out
Have any of you heard of parking lot scooter racing. I was in a store a couple weeks ago and the salesman said some guy was in there buying lether chaps for racing his scooter. That sounds like fun too!
back to work
GFP out
Evil will always prevail, cause Good is just dumb!
- vitaminC
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- Joined: Mon Aug 07, 2006 4:32 pm
- Location: Redwood City, CA
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- ScooterDave
- Most Likely to Spontaneously Combust
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- Joined: Tue Oct 31, 2006 6:43 am
- Location: 127.0.0.1
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They do make a Dyno for scooters. I do not think you understand how a dyno operates and what it does. Dyno numbers are by definition accurate and if this pipe did in fact increase horsepower, Phil's ego would have the numbers plastered all over the place.gt1000 wrote: Personally, I'll take the word of a person I trust over some arbitrary dyno numbers churned out by god knows who, got knows where. Dyno numbers are not, by definition, accurate, mainly because dynos (as I understand them) are calibrated to an "average" bike. Scooters are not your average bike. If you're thinking about performance parts your best bet is to arrange for a test ride on a bike equipped with those parts. Use your own personal butt dyno. While the butt dyno may exaggerate, the butt dyno does not lie.
As far as a test ride on a bike equipped with performance parts, yeah right. Finding a dealer to do a test ride on a stock scooter is a rare enough thing in and of itself. I am picking up a Vespa with a Malossi 210 kit on it (along with many other enhancements) in about 70 days and if anyone thinks they will be able to test ride it, they are thinking wrong.
Dave
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