Only had buddy 1 day & I'm out of commission....

Olive Oil · Post by **Olive Oil** » Wed May 23, 2007 11:57 am

Bonjourno,
Stupid things can happen....first big lesson learned..stay focused.....
Thanks to all who responded to my first posting. I appreciate all the great advice and book references. Last night while pushing "Olive Oil" into the house , I lost my balance a little & I ran over my foot and broke my big toe. MMMMMmmmm...so much for storing her in the house. Guess she was heavier than I anticipated. Guess I can think about that for the next 3 weeks while I can't ride. Arrrrrggggggg.... I get into a scooter accident and I'm not even on the scooter.!!!!My friends seem to be taking great pleasure in this story as I am trying to present it in a comical way....but seriously I WILL be taking everyone's advice and WILL definately be signing up for the safety classes!!!!! Thanks for the great advice. Ciao!

scooterstud · Post by **scooterstud** » Wed May 23, 2007 12:11 pm

Olive Oil wrote:Bonjourno,
Stupid things can happen....stay focused.....
Thanks to all who responded to my first posting. I appreciate all the great advice and book references. Last night while pushing "Olive Oil" into the house , I lost my balance a little & I ran over my foot and broke my big toe. MMMMMmmmm...so much for storing her in the house. Guess she was heavier than I anticipated. Guess I can think about that for the next 3 weeks while I can't ride. Arrrrrggggggg.... I get into a scooter accident and I'm not even on the scooter.!!!!My friends seem to be taking great pleasure in this story as I am trying to present it in a comical way....but seriously I WILL be taking everyone's advice and WILL definately be signing up for the safety classes!!!!! Thanks for the great advice. Ciao!

Sorry to hear about that Olive. What a way to be put out of commission!

I'm still trying to wrap my head around all the safety issues invloved with riding a scooter, and running over your own toe was not one I had even thought about. I do wear steel toe boots exclusively when on my buddy which may help in such a situation. One thing this forum is teaching me is that the proper gear can make a huge difference. Before getting on here I didn't even think about wearing anything different that my everyday clothes.

Olive Oil · Post by **Olive Oil** » Wed May 23, 2007 12:16 pm

Hey scooterstud, what gear do you have that you really like/dislike? I think right now I am really liking the steel toe boot idea, ha,ha. Too bad I did not think about things a little bit more carefully, I think I was just so excited about finally getting the scooter...guess it pays to be methodical and keep a clear head. Thanks

Post by **jrsjr** » Wed May 23, 2007 12:22 pm

Olive Oil wrote:...while pushing "Olive Oil" into the house , I lost my balance a little & I ran over my foot and broke my big toe.

Oh No!!!

I'm so sorry to hear about your toe. On the other hand, I'm pleased and inspired to see you responding with humor and grace.

Welcome to Modern Buddy!

scooterstud · Post by **scooterstud** » Wed May 23, 2007 12:31 pm

Olive Oil wrote:Hey scooterstud, what gear do you have that you really like/dislike? I think right now I am really liking the steel toe boot idea, ha,ha. Too bad I did not think about things a little bit more carefully, I think I was just so excited about finally getting the scooter...guess it pays to be methodical and keep a clear head. Thanks

Well, I am really in the same boat, the only difference is I did not have an accident...

I read on here about someone who had their toes mangled and about how you need ankel high boots when riding, but I did not read enough as there is a lot more gear you can have.

From what I can gather, the essentials are, helmet, and protective shatter-proof eyewear. I see people riding around town with nothing more than this (in shorts no less), but I guess they are taking their chances if they should go down. I've added ankle-high leather boots to the list but you can also add an armored jacket and armored pants.

I have not figured out what kind of jacket and pants to get yet and I live in a four season town and it is about to get very hot, yet I associate wearing a jacket with cold weather, so I am having to get used to the idea that I am going to be wearing a jacket when it is 95 degrees here in Hotlanta.

I am tring to decide if I should just get "riding gear" that I shed when I arrive at my destination or if I should try to get gear that will "blend in" that I can keep on when at my destination. I can see each approach having its advantages and disadvantages. For instance, it may not always be convinient to have to take off and put on special pants to ride in when arriving at a destination. On the other hand, if you have speical jeans with armor in them, but they are very uncomfortable, then you may not wear them much and if you are not wearing them they will not do you much good in an accident.

On top of all those considerations I don't feel I have a ton of money to burn experimenting with different kinds of gear. I know I spent the extra to get the SI, but that was before I knew I would need so much extra gear. Since I am at a bit of an impasse gear wise I have decided not to ride for the time being until I get it all sorted out.

Oh, BTW, I would get a Full Face now if I had to do over again and I hope to get one soon.

JeremyZ · Post by **JeremyZ** » Wed May 23, 2007 1:43 pm

One poster on another forum said he crashed up with one of those cool weather fabric jackets; the armor shifted and the material burned through. (and he was only going like 10-15 mph)

This makes me think about maybe getting one of those kevlar shirts I heard about. It wouldn't protect my joints from being broken, but it would at least not burn through easily.

mlstephens · Post by **mlstephens** » Wed May 23, 2007 2:16 pm

scooterstud wrote:...I do wear steel toe boots exclusively when on my buddy which may help in such a situation. One thing this forum is teaching me is that the proper gear can make a huge difference. Before getting on here I didn't even think about wearing anything different that my everyday clothes.

Yesterday I was out on the Buddy, in full gear with gloves, boots, armored mesh jacket, etc., and across the intersection from me was a big guy (I'm being kind) on a Harley, no helmet, t-shirt, wearing flip-flops. If we were side-by-side it would have made a funny picture, but I shudder to think what would happen if the guy would have an accident.

mlstephens · Post by **mlstephens** » Wed May 23, 2007 2:22 pm

JeremyZ wrote:One poster on another forum said he crashed up with one of those cool weather fabric jackets; the armor shifted and the material burned through. (and he was only going like 10-15 mph)

This makes me think about maybe getting one of those kevlar shirts I heard about. It wouldn't protect my joints from being broken, but it would at least not burn through easily.

I bought a really nice Olympia jacket, after doing a bit of reading. Not all armor and not all fabric is of the same quality and protection. And now after doing more reading, I think I would have spent more and bought from Motoport. You get what you pay for when it comes to protective gear; don't expect a $99 jacket to do what a $399 jacket will, although it is certainly better than plain street clothing.

codemonkey · Post by **codemonkey** » Wed May 23, 2007 2:34 pm

I'd think it would be difficult to ride in flip-flops. They don't exactly stay on your feet really well and you do have to put your feet down on asphalt when you stop.

Back to the original poster, that sucks that you broke your toe. My second day practicing on my buddy, I put my foot down at a bad moment, tipped the bike over and sprained my ankle.

scooterstud · Post by **scooterstud** » Wed May 23, 2007 2:35 pm

JeremyZ wrote:One poster on another forum said he crashed up with one of those cool weather fabric jackets; the armor shifted and the material burned through. (and he was only going like 10-15 mph)

This makes me think about maybe getting one of those kevlar shirts I heard about. It wouldn't protect my joints from being broken, but it would at least not burn through easily.

This is exactly the kind of reason I am finding it hard to buy the right gear. All the mesh stuff looks so loose and thin that I would imagine if I hit the pavemet in it and slid it would rotate around my body and all the armor would be in the wrong places to do any good. I don't think you would have this problem with bohn armor which I am considering wearing under jeans when riding along with a jacket which I could still see shifting, but perhaps not as much as pants.

I sometimes wonder if some armor does not give the rider a false sense of protection. There are so many different brands with different approaches. Is anyone keeping track if this stuff really works or not. I am sure some of it does, but when you are bargan shopping like me, I could imagine you may end up with what you pay for in the armor department, which is a scary thought.

I suppose you could take the argument that some armor is better than no armor, but this is assuming that there is nothing else you can do with that money to help reduce your risk. What if the $200.00 you spent on crappy armor was instead spent on the MSF course? I think its actually more like $300.00 here in GA. These are just thoughts running though my head as I don't have unlimited funds to spend here and I am trying to apply them in the best manner.

Personally I like the idea of becoming the best possible rider I can be to try to avoid needing armor. I know the safest route is to do both, but as I said, I can see an instance where the armor could give you a false sense of security where as I think the MSF course and books like proficient motorcycling do the opposite, they make you more aware of the dangers and help make you a better rider.

Having said all that, I would love to hear more about these kevlar shirts you are talking about JeremyZ. Any links for us newbies who are in the market for new gear. This kind of post is invaluable to newbies like me as it can help steer us towards the gear that actually works for people, both in terms of convinience but also in terms of what works. Its nice if your gear is very convinient however if it doesn't work when you need it, whats the point?

mandelia · Post by **mandelia** » Wed May 23, 2007 2:38 pm

Olive Oil wrote:Last night while pushing "Olive Oil" into the house , I lost my balance a little & I ran over my foot and broke my big toe

i'm sorry! that's really too bad. but one of the best pieces of advice i got from pocphil's wife, merritt, was "never push your scooter"... just sit on it with the engine off and manouver with your feet. it's not as easy, but you'll never lose your balance.

Post by **ericalm** » Wed May 23, 2007 3:13 pm

scooterstud wrote:
JeremyZ wrote:One poster on another forum said he crashed up with one of those cool weather fabric jackets; the armor shifted and the material burned through. (and he was only going like 10-15 mph)

This makes me think about maybe getting one of those kevlar shirts I heard about. It wouldn't protect my joints from being broken, but it would at least not burn through easily.
This is exactly the kind of reason I am finding it hard to buy the right gear. All the mesh stuff looks so loose and thin that I would imagine if I hit the pavemet in it and slid it would rotate around my body and all the armor would be in the wrong places to do any good. I don't think you would have this problem with bohn armor which I am considering wearing under jeans when riding along with a jacket which I could still see shifting, but perhaps not as much as pants.

I sometimes wonder if some armor does not give the rider a false sense of protection. There are so many different brands with different approaches. Is anyone keeping track if this stuff really works or not. I am sure some of it does, but when you are bargan shopping like me, I could imagine you may end up with what you pay for in the armor department, which is a scary thought.

I suppose you could take the argument that some armor is better than no armor, but this is assuming that there is nothing else you can do with that money to help reduce your risk. What if the $200.00 you spent on crappy armor was instead spent on the MSF course? I think its actually more like $300.00 here in GA. These are just thoughts running though my head as I don't have unlimited funds to spend here and I am trying to apply them in the best manner.

Personally I like the idea of becoming the best possible rider I can be to try to avoid needing armor. I know the safest route is to do both, but as I said, I can see an instance where the armor could give you a false sense of security where as I think the MSF course and books like proficient motorcycling do the opposite, they make you more aware of the dangers and help make you a better rider.

Having said all that, I would love to hear more about these kevlar shirts you are talking about JeremyZ. Any links for us newbies who are in the market for new gear. This kind of post is invaluable to newbies like me as it can help steer us towards the gear that actually works for people, both in terms of convinience but also in terms of what works. Its nice if your gear is very convinient however if it doesn't work when you need it, whats the point?

It is hard to balance the pros, cons and economics of all the different riding gear options. All you can do is set your priorities, weigh the options, and get the best gear you can afford. IMHO, it's most important to get something because otherwise, you'll have to fight the temptation to ride, even without gear.

There are a ton of good places to buy gear. If you shop well and do some research, you'll be able to find good quality gear at well below retail price. Some of my favorites:
http://newenough.com/
http://www.motorcycle-superstore.com/
http://www.ridegear.com/
http://motorcyclecloseouts.com/
http://www.sandhillspowersports.com/
http://www.corazzo.net/

Though taking the MSF and doing anything to become the best rider possible is great, it doesn't mitigate the need for proper gear. I know several experienced riders who've gone down over the past year. And there's the "other drivers" factor—I was in a crash caused by an SUV. I can definitely say that my gear saved me from more serious injury.

I'm still constantly shopping for new gear, too. I just haven't found my ideal set... and I keep finding deals on eBay... Next purchase will likely be a Corazzo Max or Speedway mesh jacket to get me through the summer. My favorite piece of gear is a Belstaff jacket—perfect in terms of comfort, warmth in the winter, appearance, etc.—but I need to add armor to it.

Post by **ericalm** » Wed May 23, 2007 3:16 pm

mandelia wrote:
Olive Oil wrote:Last night while pushing "Olive Oil" into the house , I lost my balance a little & I ran over my foot and broke my big toe
i'm sorry! that's really too bad. but one of the best pieces of advice i got from pocphil's wife, merritt, was "never push your scooter"... just sit on it with the engine off and manouver with your feet. it's not as easy, but you'll never lose your balance.

Someone I know has tipped over this way, too. Ha!
There's just no 100% klutz-proof way, I guess.

JeremyZ · Post by **JeremyZ** » Wed May 23, 2007 3:33 pm

One other thing that should maybe be mentioned here is lane positioning. A lot of accidents occur because cagers "didn't see us". So I wear a Class II safety vest and position myself so that I'm more visible.

Those of you who read Hough's stuff will know what I'm talking about.

The short story is that if you can position yourself in your lane such that you're seen sooner, you're less likely to be cut off by a left-turner.

Tbone · Post by **Tbone** » Wed May 23, 2007 3:35 pm

Dude, Olive...I'm laughing at you while am truly sorry about your pain!
Heal fast, read proficient motorcycling or Zen and the art of Motorcycle Maintenance or something in the mean time!

OH, POST PHOTO's OF THE SCOOT!!! If you have the $$$ do some modifications! There's plenty of ideas/threads on different things like a better horn, light modulators, reflective tape/stripes...etc.

Scooter, you are a few steps ahead of me but at the same time brother...just buy something! I KNOW $ is tight but you've got the scoot, you've got the helmet. You can buy some cheaper/discounted gloves. The jackets a bit more of a thing. Again I posted in the other thread my jacket (Actually they ran out of the Black one in my size. Got the silver instead. Wife's not as happy. Don't look as much like an X-MEN now

) It's got the removable linear and ventilation stuff. It was running late this am so I didn't throw it on when I pedal biked in. Hopefully tomorrow I'll test it out. I might want something else later but so far just wearing it, I like the jacket and am confident I made a good choice! At worst, you can always return an item for an exchange.

pesqueeb · Post by **pesqueeb** » Wed May 23, 2007 4:49 pm

Sorry bout' the toe dude, that sucks. At least you have the proper attitude.

For riding pants I bought a pair of Carhartt bib overalls. They are not armored but they are tough. In fact when I had my accident the firemen couldn't cut them off and had to pull them off me so they could cut off my shorts! The Carhartts had practically no road damage. The only down side is they are hot!
Try a ranch/feed store or one of those places that sells safety gear/work gear to construction workers and such.

http://www.carhartt.com/webapp/wcs/stor ... ogId=10101

Corsair · Post by **Corsair** » Wed May 23, 2007 6:48 pm

Sorry to hear about what happened! Yeah the first time I moved the Buddy the weight definitely surprised me (and to think it's lighter than most other scoots - I gotta start working out ...lol) Hope you have a speedy recovery and are back out enjoying your new scoot!

Better Days

PS
You can use the down time to read up and find just the right gear you want (hey and spend more time with all the great people here on the boards ....lol)

Keys · Post by **Keys** » Wed May 23, 2007 10:59 pm

I blew out my ankle once, years ago, and rode my scooter (it was all I had) for the whole 4 weeks with a neon-green cast on. Probably not recommended, but ya do what ya gotta do...

--Keys

Post by **ericalm** » Thu May 24, 2007 2:54 am

Keys wrote:I blew out my ankle once, years ago, and rode my scooter (it was all I had) for the whole 4 weeks with a neon-green cast on. Probably not recommended, but ya do what ya gotta do...

We can't all be as badass as you.

Sparky · Post by **Sparky** » Thu May 24, 2007 3:24 am

scooterstud wrote:
JeremyZ wrote: Having said all that, I would love to hear more about these kevlar shirts you are talking about JeremyZ.
http://dragginjeans.ca/prod_kshirt_intro.html

The Draggin' Jeans K-Shirt. I own one for riding around town in hot weather. It's thicker in feel than a simple T-shirt, more like a flannel button-down. The weave is quite tight--not mesh at all. Covers everything from neck to waist from abrasion. Most importantly, it breathes in hot weather in a way my armoured cordura jacket doesn't.

I personally would not trust it on speeds above 35 mph. Not because of quality or suspicion of the kevlar's abrasion resistance. It is just tempting fate too much to ask a long-sleeved shirt to deal with a long slide at highway speeds. For a riding around town garment that can be folded into the underseat trunk or for something to slip on when it's hot and sticky, the K shirt is aces.

xtetra · Post by **xtetra** » Thu May 24, 2007 4:05 am

JeremyZ wrote:One poster on another forum said he crashed up with one of those cool weather fabric jackets; the armor shifted and the material burned through. (and he was only going like 10-15 mph)

Oh man, I was just about to buy one of those jackets

Just wondering, did the post you refer to say anything about whether or not the coat fit right? Please tell me it was too loose! I'm melting in the jacket I have right now. I once turned down a fantastic leather motorcycle jacket for free b/c it was a size too big. I could just see it peeling off me in an accident b/c it was too loose.

I believe in and own the best gear I can afford but there is a lot to be said for safety courses too. This is my first season on a scooter but I've had a motorcycle for five seasons now. Within a month after my safety course (in my first year) what I had learned from a long weekend of classes and riding practice saved by butt when a pickup pulled out in front of me. Lane positioning and having my hands already over the brake/clutch lever is what gave me enough reation time to miss the guy. If not for the course I wouldn't have been thinking very much about either.

My dumb mistake for the day was pulling out from work with my side stand down. My motorcycle shuts off if its in gear and the clutch is out with the side stand down. Still getting used to the Buddy I guess.

JeremyZ · Post by **JeremyZ** » Thu May 24, 2007 1:01 pm

xtetra wrote:
JeremyZ wrote:One poster on another forum said he crashed up with one of those cool weather fabric jackets; the armor shifted and the material burned through. (and he was only going like 10-15 mph)
Oh man, I was just about to buy one of those jackets Just wondering, did the post you refer to say anything about whether or not the coat fit right? Please tell me it was too loose!

Here's the thread:
http://www.urbanscootin.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6061

I was about to buy one too. I don't know now. The kevlar shirts mentioned above seem to offer more reliable abrasion resistance due to their superior thread. But no padding, so it won't help with broken bones. I guess what we need is a mesh jacket sewn from kevalr thread, snug-fitting. Someone will eventually make one I suppose.

mlstephens · Post by **mlstephens** » Thu May 24, 2007 1:43 pm

JeremyZ wrote: I was about to buy one too. I don't know now. The kevlar shirts mentioned above seem to offer more reliable abrasion resistance due to their superior thread. But no padding, so it won't help with broken bones. I guess what we need is a mesh jacket sewn from kevalr thread, snug-fitting. Someone will eventually make one I suppose.

You get what you pay for with mesh jackets. My Olympia Airglide mesh jacket actually fits quite snug, and it has velcro straps to snug the sleeve at the elbow so that the pad doesn't move much, and it is quite comfortable. It isn't Kevlar or 1000 Denier Cordura, but was less than $200. If you want Kevlar, and one of the best jackets made, Motoport is the way to go, but be prepared for sticker shock if you've been shopping at Newenough. If/when I ever replace my mesh, that's what I'm buying, do it once (er, twice) and be done with it.

Post by **ericalm** » Thu May 24, 2007 2:20 pm

JeremyZ wrote:Here's the thread:
http://www.urbanscootin.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6061

I was about to buy one too. I don't know now. The kevlar shirts mentioned above seem to offer more reliable abrasion resistance due to their superior thread. But no padding, so it won't help with broken bones. I guess what we need is a mesh jacket sewn from kevalr thread, snug-fitting. Someone will eventually make one I suppose.

The forthcoming Corazzo mesh is supposedly made from a very strong material with the highest melting point of any mesh. I don't know about the rest of the jacket; I believe it's a lighter Cordura than what's in their 5.0 jackets (which many owners report have survived crashes and provided very good protection).

There are a lot of snug-fitting, adjustable mesh jackets out there. Part of what's kept me out of a mesh jacket is the fact that most look like excess wardrobe from a Road Warrior movie. (I have a medium weight textile that's fine for most SoCal days.) But it stands to reason that the mesh part of any jacket would be more vulnerable to friction in a slide because of the weave—just not a smooth surface like solid fabric.

A lot of riders own this First Gear Mesh Tex (thanks in part to its wide availability as a closeout) and should read the post about its poor performance.

xtetra · Post by **xtetra** » Thu May 24, 2007 3:46 pm

Thanks Jeremy, that was good info. The jacket I use now is a Joe-Rocket Ballisitic and after reading that I'll be checking to see if any of the snaps can be adjusted to keep the armor in place.

Of course, there is always duct tape too.......

Modern Buddy

Only had buddy 1 day & I'm out of commission....

Only had buddy 1 day & I'm out of commission....

Re: Only had buddy 1 day & I'm out of commission....

proper gear..

Re: Only had buddy 1 day & I'm out of commission....

Re: proper gear..

Re: Only had buddy 1 day & I'm out of commission....

Re: Only had buddy 1 day & I'm out of commission....

Re: Only had buddy 1 day & I'm out of commission....

pants