Scooter crash in San Diego...plus odd outcome

peabody99 · Post by **peabody99** » Sun Jan 01, 2012 4:19 pm

This was in this AMs papers:
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/2011 ... leg-crash/

after reading this: the scooter traveling with the right of way, has a car turn left in front of him, his leg is severed and then HE is charged? They say the head light may not have been on. If this is a modern scooter that is bunk. I hope he was not drunk but it may not matter. He could have been cold sober and hit someone turning in from of him. Anyway I hope he heals up fast.

(i am not copying the name in the article)

FALLBROOK — A suspected drunken driver on a scooter suffered a partially severed leg in a collision in Fallbrook Saturday night, the California Highway Patrol said.

XXXXXX, 44, from Encinitas, was riding a Vespa scooter south on Gird Road, possibly without the headlights on about 5:20 p.m., CHP Officer Jim Bettencourt said.

A northbound Honda Civic, driven by a 45-year-old Fallbrook man, turned left across XXXs’ path at Caballo Lane, Bettencourt said. He said the scooter hit the front corner of the car, and XXXX was thrown from the motorbike. Part of his left leg was severed in the accident.

XXXX was taken to Palomar Medical Center and placed under arrest on suspicion of drunken driving, Bettencourt said. The Honda driver was not injured.

LunaP · Post by **LunaP** » Sun Jan 01, 2012 5:06 pm

Sigh.... It's not THAT dark at 5:20pm, is it? (I hate winter...)

The scooter driver being drunk... well, there's no way anybody can speculate that. Having your leg partially severed would send one into shock, I'm sure. But this all sounds like the driver of the car's reaction was just to go "I didn't see him! He's driving drunk!!" Even if the Vespa driver is charged with a headlight being out and/or being drunk, he had right of way and was driving correctly... the Civic driver should at least be charged with failure to yield. Pisses me off.

Ugh, what an awful thing either way. Poor guy. I hope he recovers quickly, and they get to the bottom of it.

peabody99 · Post by **peabody99** » Sun Jan 01, 2012 5:20 pm

Its like scooter riders are being punished for existing. At that time of night it is pretty dark here as the sun sets just before 5, but I am not sure I have heard of people hitting cars without headlights on and the car w/o headlights being charged.

Over many years, I have seen cops pass cars without headlights turned on a 1000 times probably, esp right after the sun sets this is not uncommon.

BlueMark · Post by **BlueMark** » Sun Jan 01, 2012 5:26 pm

Motorcyclists (including scooters), teenagers, and pizza delivery guys are always at fault, even when they aren't.

Drum Pro · Post by **Drum Pro** » Sun Jan 01, 2012 7:29 pm

Usually the person driving the car aren't paying much attention to motor bikes as they are usually concerned about looking out for other cars. F'N A tho, that's some BS. Sounds like the person driving the car was more at fault for not watching what they are doing. Makes me wonder if the driver of the car was a bit drunk as well. BUZZED DRIVING IS DRUNK DRIVING!!!

neotrotsky · Post by **neotrotsky** » Sun Jan 01, 2012 11:03 pm

Regardless on how cycle riders get shafted by the ignorant public, if he's got alcohol in his system, he's at fault. He knows the game getting on that bike and would have a fighting chance since any driver making a left into oncoming traffic is automatically at fault if hit from the front (failure to yield). But, once there's a potential DUI, it's burden on the rider.

Post by **ericalm** » Sun Jan 01, 2012 11:24 pm

BlueMark wrote:Motorcyclists (including scooters), teenagers, and pizza delivery guys are always at fault, even when they aren't.

I've not been at fault in two crashes in which scooters were totaled and I wound up in the ER. The drivers were clearly at fault and there was no contesting it.

Being sober helped my cases, I'm sure.

neotrotsky wrote:Regardless on how cycle riders get shafted by the ignorant public, if he's got alcohol in his system, he's at fault. He knows the game getting on that bike and would have a fighting chance since any driver making a left into oncoming traffic is automatically at fault if hit from the front (failure to yield). But, once there's a potential DUI, it's burden on the rider.

This is sticky. If the driver crossed right of way, I think he should still get cited. The rider should get hit for being drunk if that was the case. The light, well… Who knows? As peabody99 said, probably bullshit if it's a modern scooter. Everyone should be held responsible for whatever they did wrong and their part in this crash. Sigh… justice is so hard to find.

Who knows if it's even a Vespa? News reports refer to anything that's not a motorcycle as a "Vespa." Could be a moped for all we know.

Post by **ericalm** » Sun Jan 01, 2012 11:30 pm

Also, report doesn't say whether the Honda driver was cited, just that the rider was arrested for DUI.

Too many wrongs here. No one's right.

jijifer · Post by **jijifer** » Sun Jan 01, 2012 11:52 pm

I wonder if Fallbrook had the super dense fog we did in carlsbad. I left La Jolla at around 3pm yesterday to blue skies and sunshine, by solona beach the fog was so thick you couldn't tell there was any sun. 3 times on that ride of about what? 20miles. The same mercedes with super tinted windows tried to run me off the road. the first time i thought he was just blind because of his stupid windows but by the 3rd time I could tell he (or she, I couldn't see into the car the windows were so dark. was doing it on purpose, often just straddling the dotted line and swerving my way if I caught up.

that's a different story, though, and the first time i've ever experienced a jerk like that.

But if it was super foggy there and the headlight was off that's nuts. But yeah, on a scoot could a headlight be off?

he's being charged with being drunk for now, it seems. Doesn't mean the driver won't eventually be charged. when my high school sweetheart was killed in a car accident by being rear-ended at a stop light by a car doing 65mph, shoving the front end of his car under the drunk in front of him and collapsing the back of his car so that back seat was up against the front, causing fires at both ends - the driver rearending wasn't immediately charged either though there was no dispute whatsoever what happened. When injuries are involved, I think a full investigation is required before charges are handed down. If someone is drunk, or has a suspended license or someone other offense independent of crash, those are charged at the scene. That's my guess.

SUCKS!

JohnnyScoots · Post by **JohnnyScoots** » Mon Jan 02, 2012 3:07 am

Question : Is it possible for a Vespa's headlight to be "off"?

jprestonian · Post by **jprestonian** » Mon Jan 02, 2012 3:14 am

JohnnyScoots wrote:Question : Is it possible for a Vespa's headlight to be "off"?

If the bulb is bad, definitely. Or if it's been modified.
.

LunaP · Post by **LunaP** » Mon Jan 02, 2012 4:44 am

jprestonian wrote:
JohnnyScoots wrote:Question : Is it possible for a Vespa's headlight to be "off"?
If the bulb is bad, definitely. Or if it's been modified.
.

This. But everybody's right. There's too much speculation and the article is much to vague to give us any indication of what actually happened. Sadly, all we know for sure is that the scooterist probably can never scoot again. :*(

It's a sobering, in every sense of the word, reminder of how cautious we need to be on the road.

I for one am curious as to HOW his leg was taken, and what gear he was wearing. It's possible he was under-geared, but also possible gear saved him from losing more.

viney266 · Post by **viney266** » Mon Jan 02, 2012 5:02 am

All I can add is this.

when I was an MSF instructor, I remember reading the statistics on the numbers of bike crashes envolving alcohol versus the "sober" ones. I don't even need to tell you what those graphs looked like. Especially when they graphed single vehicle fatalities on two wheels.

A Eric said, you can get hit when you are smart and sober. I was,too. But, as bad as I feel for a rider losing his leg. Riding drunk? you just lost most of my sympathy for your accident. Loss of your leg I feel bad about. But, you have to ask yourself. If the guy on the scooter was sober, would he/she avoided the whole thing???

I don't know wasn't there, and as others have said. Its a sticky situation. Bad all the way around.

Post by **ericalm** » Mon Jan 02, 2012 5:39 pm

Regarding the headlight:
"Officers said Mills may have been driving the scooter, a 2002 Vespa, without lights because of a mechanical problem."

Read more: http://www.nctimes.com/news/local/fallb ... z1iK7y0pRP

sickpuppy · Post by **sickpuppy** » Mon Jan 02, 2012 10:07 pm

I'm guessing there is a law that says you have to have your lights on during the day in Cali ?

Post by **ericalm** » Mon Jan 02, 2012 10:29 pm

sickpuppy wrote:I'm guessing there is a law that says you have to have your lights on during the day in Cali ?

All motorcycles newer than a certain year have to. This may be a federal regulation. It's why you can't switch off headlights on any new 2-wheeler.

Edwub · Post by **Edwub** » Mon Jan 02, 2012 10:41 pm

also, it was dark. Sunset was before 5pm every day

(http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/a ... =-11&day=1)

agrogod · Post by **agrogod** » Tue Jan 03, 2012 3:15 am

If the driver of the car was distracted from seeing the scooterist was the distraction because of a (evil,dreaded) cell phone?

I quite agree that after a full investigation into this there may be more charges handed out to all involved. Just glad to know this didn't end with a fatality.

Lotrat · Post by **Lotrat** » Tue Jan 03, 2012 5:46 am

California VC Section 25650.5
Headlamps on Motorcycles Manufactured After 1978

25650.5. Every motorcycle manufactured and first registered on and after January 1, 1978, shall be equipped with at least one and not more than two headlamps which automatically turn on when the engine of the motorcycle is started and which remain lighted as long as the engine is running.

I've had a few bike that won't run if the headlight burns out. I had to cross wire a turn signal to get home once. Didn't get stopped for it either.

Fallbrook is a small town north of San Diego. No street lights and it gets really dark out there. 5:20pm is way too dark to be without a headlight. The guy is nuts for riding without a working headlight if that's really the case.

Here's a street view of where it took place: http://g.co/maps/txe25