Buddy 125 a bit Squirrely, especially when turning left

DKAudio · Post by **DKAudio** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:02 pm

I have a 09 Buddy 125. Everything is great on it except when I turn I feel very uneasy. It especially happens when turning left. I've even had slight curves in the road when going 35mph or so where I felt like it was starting to lay and I freak out and slow down. I have had scooters for 3 years (started with a 85 Aero 50) and definitely am not a risk taker/racer. Any ideas on what to look for? I wonder if the tires have something to do with it? There is only 2,500 miles on it if that matters.

agrogod · Post by **agrogod** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:04 pm

Knowing the type of tires would help.

DKAudio · Post by **DKAudio** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:12 pm

agrogod wrote:Knowing the type of tires would help.

Hmm, the scooter is stored for winter. I wanted to create this thread now so I know what to look for in spring. The tires are stock I'm sure.

PeteH · Post by **PeteH** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:24 pm

Well, if this is a 2009 scoot and the tires are original-equipment, then they're coming up on 4 or 5 years old, depending on how old they were before PGO put 'em on the scoot. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the tires themselves, esp. the sidewalls, were starting to deteriorate. Even though you may have good-looking tread, the tire isn't as strong and the rubber dries out.

I'm in the same boat - before I put my scoot away for the bad weather, mine was feeling a little squirrely, too. I think I'll be springing for some new shoes when things warm up and dry out.

DKAudio · Post by **DKAudio** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 2:30 pm

PeteH wrote:Well, if this is a 2009 scoot and the tires are original-equipment, then they're coming up on 4 or 5 years old, depending on how old they were before PGO put 'em on the scoot. It wouldn't surprise me at all if the tires themselves, esp. the sidewalls, were starting to deteriorate. Even though you may have good-looking tread, the tire isn't as strong and the rubber dries out.

I'm in the same boat - before I put my scoot away for the bad weather, mine was feeling a little squirrely, too. I think I'll be springing for some new shoes when things warm up and dry out.

That is hard for me to believe, do you think they are starting to dry rot already? That would be one crappy tire after only 3 riding seasons. My 85 Aero had originals still on it when I bought it. They were cracking a little on the sidewalls but the scooter was solid still. I was hoping the stock tires were just cheapos.

My Buddy125 · Post by **My Buddy125** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:01 pm

Did you check the tire pressure? That would be the first thing to check.

DKAudio · Post by **DKAudio** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 3:20 pm

My Buddy125 wrote:Did you check the tire pressure? That would be the first thing to check.

Yup, I kept them how the Buddy repair manual said.

Mutt the Hoople · Post by **Mutt the Hoople** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 8:53 pm

Also, your headset might be a little lose. Also worth checking.

DKAudio · Post by **DKAudio** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:10 pm

Is that what connects the stem to the forks? How do I properly check that it is tight?

Mutt the Hoople · Post by **Mutt the Hoople** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:32 pm

DKAudio wrote:Is that what connects the stem to the forks? How do I properly check that it is tight?

I was having a similar issue with my Vespa, and told the service department when I took it in for another issue. Yes... I am assuming that is where it is. I just know when they tightened it up, the squirrelliness went away. I also over--inflated the tires a bit once and that made it feel squirrelly too. Sorry that I can't be more specific, I haven't really worked on either of my scoots myself... No tools and no place to work. Luckily I have as great mechanic. And eventually I will learn more

DKAudio · Post by **DKAudio** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:39 pm

Thanks for the tips, I will check that as soon as I pull the scooter out of my shed. Maybe I should put some thread locker on it?

Anyone know what the PSI should be off the top of their heads?

PeteH · Post by **PeteH** » Fri Feb 22, 2013 9:58 pm

I run 30/30, but that's with warmed-up tires (driving from home to the gas station that still has free air). If I get much below 25, it really gets squirrely in the corners.

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Sat Feb 23, 2013 12:24 am

whenever my buddy feels squirrely i throw some nuts in the tank. fixes it right up

Drum Pro · Post by **Drum Pro** » Sat Feb 23, 2013 7:14 pm

JHScoot wrote:whenever my buddy feels squirrely i throw some nuts in the tank. fixes it right up

Lol...

KABarash · Post by **KABarash** » Sun Feb 24, 2013 3:32 pm

PeteH wrote:I run 30/30, but that's with warmed-up tires (driving from home to the gas station that still has free air). If I get much below 25, it really gets squirrely in the corners.

Here's a thought for this situation for those who don't have readily available 'air' close to home:
Check your pressure cold, remember, write down, what you need to add from cold to proper pressure. When you arrive at the 'air' check your pressure again and add that 'plus' amount to the warmed up tires. It'll keep you closer to that necessary "cold tire pressure" we desire....

I did this for years, until I was having issues keeping even the lowest amount of pressure in my rear tire, that needed to be replaced, to make it any sort of 'ride-able' then I bought a $40 compressor at HF.

DKAudio · Post by **DKAudio** » Mon Feb 25, 2013 5:14 pm

So is the proper pressure 30/30 cold? I checked when the tires had about a mile of riding at 30mph.

skully93 · Post by **skully93** » Mon Feb 25, 2013 7:03 pm

I run a tad higher, maybe 33 in both tires. Mostly because our weather goes up and down so much in the desert conditions. if you go too high though the ride is very bumpy and I would think you'd wear 'em faster.

Cheshire · Post by **Cheshire** » Wed Feb 27, 2013 2:20 am

Tire pressure needs to be checked COLD. If you don't have one, get a tire gauge. I keep one in the scooter at all times, next to my luggage straps and a flashlight.

I keep a bicycle floor pump next to the door I go out to get to the scooter. I paid $30 for it 4 years ago, it has a gauge built into the line, and doesn't spook the wildlife.

I highly recommend bicycle pumps: no worrying if the power goes out, if the gas station might start charging for air, etc. Unlike a car, they wok very well for scooter (and even motorcycle) tires.

PeteH · Post by **PeteH** » Wed Feb 27, 2013 1:34 pm

Yes, yes, I'm sure that's true. Cold tire pressure accuracy is nice, but not everybody has the luxury of a garage or a dry place to get down on hands and knees. So I drive to the gas station.

I do have a stick gauge in my tool bag, as well as a Topeak Pocket Rocket pump. Got a compressor, too, but that's in my basement and too much of a pain to drag out, hook together, and run an extension cord. So it boils down to a matter of accuracy vs. safety vs. convenience. Me, I bounce the tires to make sure I've got enough smash to get to the gas station. And should my two freebie stations (QuikTrip and UGas) stop offering free air, my strategy will change.

Post by **ericalm** » Wed Feb 27, 2013 11:10 pm

DKAudio wrote:So is the proper pressure 30/30 cold? I checked when the tires had about a mile of riding at 30mph.

This is the optimum recommended pressure. You can go a bit higher—it's good to add a few psi to the rear when carrying a passenger—but I wouldn't let it go less than 25psi cold.

Dry rot usually occurs when the scoot is stored on dirt, leaves, etc. If stored in a dry garage with a concrete floor, shouldn't be a problem unless it's been sitting a very long time!

Did you buy this scoot new and has it ever been dropped or had (even a soft) front-end collision?

Do you feel the squirreliness in the handlebars when turning?

Here's a little test that might help shed a little more light on this: sit on the scooter while it's not running, turn handlebars all the way left, walk the scooter forward (or rather through a very slow left turn). Is there any weird vibration, rough spots or difficulty in moving it with the handlebars all the way to the left?

DKAudio · Post by **DKAudio** » Thu Feb 28, 2013 1:28 pm

ericalm wrote:
DKAudio wrote:So is the proper pressure 30/30 cold? I checked when the tires had about a mile of riding at 30mph.
This is the optimum recommended pressure. You can go a bit higher—it's good to add a few psi to the rear when carrying a passenger—but I wouldn't let it go less than 25psi cold.

Dry rot usually occurs when the scoot is stored on dirt, leaves, etc. If stored in a dry garage with a concrete floor, shouldn't be a problem unless it's been sitting a very long time!

Did you buy this scoot new and has it ever been dropped or had (even a soft) front-end collision?

Do you feel the squirreliness in the handlebars when turning?

Here's a little test that might help shed a little more light on this: sit on the scooter while it's not running, turn handlebars all the way left, walk the scooter forward (or rather through a very slow left turn). Is there any weird vibration, rough spots or difficulty in moving it with the handlebars all the way to the left?

Thanks for the reply. It is being stored in a shed with a cedar floor so I don't think the tires are rotted. I did not buy it new, I got it spring of 2012 and it is a 2009 model, too new for dry rot IMO.

I laid it down once when I was turning left; I hit a slick spot and a pot hole and dumped it. The brake handle broke but I did not see anything other than that.

The squirreliness is such that when turning or on a bending road it just feels like it is going to lay down at any moment. I usually slow down and watch myself. The weird thing is I am pretty confident on it when turning right, I can lean it pretty good and not be too worried.

I will have to do your test as soon as it gets warmer and I can get the scoot out of my backyard shed (once the snow melts). Good idea though.

DKAudio · Post by **DKAudio** » Fri Apr 26, 2013 3:42 pm

Sorry for the delay, we've had a crazy amount of snow this month. I finally was able to get the scooter out of the shed. I tried doing a left circle walking the scooter and it felt fine, same as it does going right. I then took off the plastic front and I did end up tightening some bolts. Near the bottom of the fork there are 4 12mm bolts (2 on each side). Those were pretty loose so I tightened them, I could not find a torque spec in the manual though. I wonder if I should remove them and put some Loctite on them? The left ones (if you are sitting on the scooter) were a lot looser than the right. I hope that was the problem but I need to change some fluids before I fire it up.

I did not mess with the big nut near the top, should I? Again, I couldn't find torque specs for this either. It appears there are two threaded pieces up there, a big nut and then a notched nut of some sort.

JettaKnight · Post by **JettaKnight** » Fri Apr 26, 2013 5:48 pm

Mutt the Hoople wrote:Also, your headset might be a little lose. Also worth checking.

I do believe the Buddy has a spline on the shaft. So, not an issue.

Beamster · Post by **Beamster** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 12:52 am

What many don't understand until they have many many years of riding is that anyone can have an inert aversion to turning in one direction.

Ask a Nascar driver to turn right and it's big trouble.

You just need to find a place to do it over and over until you get used to it.
It may never be natural, but you can get used to it.

It's like my high anxiety that takes painting the whole house before I really get reacquainted with the uneasy feeling at the top of the ladder.

scullyfu · Post by **scullyfu** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 2:19 pm

i know this is basic, but are you actually trying to 'turn' the handlebars or are you leaning into the turn? if you are trying to 'turn' the handlebars and you go too far, the scooter will try to right itself and it feels hinky. could that possibly be an issue?

JettaKnight · Post by **JettaKnight** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 2:30 pm

DKAudio wrote:I have a 09 Buddy 125. Everything is great on it except when I turn I feel very uneasy. It especially happens when turning left. I've even had slight curves in the road when going 35mph or so where I felt like it was starting to lay and I freak out and slow down. I have had scooters for 3 years (started with a 85 Aero 50) and definitely am not a risk taker/racer. Any ideas on what to look for? I wonder if the tires have something to do with it? There is only 2,500 miles on it if that matters.

So define squirelly - vibration, wobble, what does it feel like?
Check both tires - do a complete inspection of the tire - all the way around with you hands. There could be flat spot or bulge.

But, if they're fine and the bike is tight, I'm guessing it your nerves.

Also, you say "slow down", how exactly are you slowing down in the turn? Braking while leaning? This would only make it worse. Roll on the power, keep looking through the turn and you'll be fine.

Get a copy of Proficient Motorcycling from you library. I think MB used to have a floating copy.

DKAudio · Post by **DKAudio** » Mon Apr 29, 2013 3:08 pm

I slow down before entering the turn. I just started doing that because of me being uncomfortable going left. I do not turn the handle bars, I lean into the turn. Like I said, the 4 12mm bolts were loose on the fork, I took them all the way out and used some blue thread locker on them. I haven't had a chance to test drive though (head gasket blew in gf's car, trying to deal with that right now). It is difficult to describe but during a left turn all of a sudden I feel something give or move and I immediately slow down and stay more upright. It happened roughly 5 times last summer. The tires appear and feel fine from what I can tell.

olhogrider · Post by **olhogrider** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 5:01 pm

Have someone else who rides scooters take it out. If they have the same problem it is the scoot. If not, the problem is you. A cheaper but sometimes more difficult fix.

DKAudio · Post by **DKAudio** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 7:09 pm

olhogrider wrote:Have someone else who rides scooters take it out. If they have the same problem it is the scoot. If not, the problem is you. A cheaper but sometimes more difficult fix.

Good idea, if it feels the same to me then I will do that! Unfortunately, it is supposed to rain for the next few days, damn MN weather!

friendlynerd · Post by **friendlynerd** » Mon May 06, 2013 2:02 pm

Any updates on this? I feel like I have the same thing going on with my 2006 125, though I can't say it's necessarily limited to going left. No accidents of any kind, though about a month ago I had a near accident where the front wheel locked up and I went into a skid. I recovered from it and stayed upright, but it rattled me pretty bad. So now I'm kind of in the same boat where I don't know if it's the scoot or my degraded confidence.

DKAudio · Post by **DKAudio** » Mon May 06, 2013 2:06 pm

This is what I have done...
Tightened all front bolts, put blue thread locker on the 4 12mm fork bolts.
Changed oil.
Changed final rear drive oil.
Filled tires to 30 PSI front and back this morning (50 degrees out).

I rode it to work then, about 9 miles. I was cautious going into left turns but the bike felt ok. On the ride home I may try a little more speed and lean and see how it performs.

DKAudio · Post by **DKAudio** » Mon May 13, 2013 12:35 pm

After riding many miles I can confidently say that it was not my nerves doing it. The left turns no longer feel like the bike is going to dump, I think it had a lot to do with the 4 12mm fork bolts that were loose.

JettaKnight · Post by **JettaKnight** » Mon May 13, 2013 1:45 pm

DKAudio wrote:After riding many miles I can confidently say that it was not my nerves doing it. The left turns no longer feel like the bike is going to dump, I think it had a lot to do with the 4 12mm fork bolts that were loose.

Glad it's fixed up!

friendlynerd · Post by **friendlynerd** » Mon May 13, 2013 4:33 pm

Thanks for the update - I'll have to check those bolts. I'm not very DIY with the scooter - is this something you need to remove the plastic to get to? Any pointers on how to find them?

DKAudio · Post by **DKAudio** » Mon May 13, 2013 4:37 pm

Just remove the front plastic piece (the piece that has the Genuine emblem). The 4 bolts will be obvious once that is off.

friendlynerd · Post by **friendlynerd** » Mon May 13, 2013 4:39 pm

Excellent, thanks for the quick reply. I should be able to handle that!

scullyfu · Post by **scullyfu** » Tue May 14, 2013 1:24 pm

this eager to help other riders mentality is one reason this is such a great board.

Modern Buddy

Buddy 125 a bit Squirrely, especially when turning left

Buddy 125 a bit Squirrely, especially when turning left

Re: Buddy 125 a bit Squirrely, especially when turning left