Well, crap.

The original 2-stroke Genuine scooter and its 4-stroke manual and automatic offspring

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az_slynch
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Well, crap.

Post by az_slynch »

164 miles.

I was out running an errand after work on the 4T. I'd driven the truck to work today and had a 12-hour workday with plenty of crap from covering for a sick employee and dealing with various and sundry headaches related to new call center projects. After that guff, I figured a relaxing ride on the Stella was the therapy I needed.

The engine was warmed up fully and I was about halfway to my destination. I'd shifted into second and had about 2/3 throttle set. I'd just about gotten to the shift point for third when the bike lurched violently out of second, revved briefly, lurched back into second briefly and lurched back out into neutral. I dropped throttle, shifted to neutral (it didn't light the indicator when it jumped out of second, but did when I selected it), then shifted back into second. The bike sounded louder right after this, but I really didn't appreciate it until I stopped at the next light. It was ticking loudly, like it had a badly adjusted valve.

Sonofabiscuit! I'd lay a Hamilton down that this infernal contraption yanked it's cam chain and either broke a chain guide, jacked the tensioner or murdered the chain idler gear bearing.

The gear jumping is particularly vexing, since I took it in about a month ago for a 50-mile oil change (surprisingly clean) and a gear cable adjustment because it had been a bit funny about shifting between neutral and second. It had been fine after the adjustment and gave no indication of having trouble holding gears prior to this. To add insult to injury, it jumped out of second again on my way home and I wasn't even at half throttle!

I want it torn down and I want to inspect it. No engine swaps, Genuine. I've been mindful to roll in and out of throttle since this short-legged gearbox puts such a torque load on the clutch basket and I know how soft LMLs parts are compared to OE Piaggio. I haven't speed shifted it or dropped the clutch. Heck, even after being kinder to it than my PE, I want to toss the stock shift box and gears and replace them with PX Lusso parts since every Stella I've ever ridden has a sloppy shifter. I just bought a DRT clutch pusher arm because I know the LML ones tend to fracture and I was expecting that a few years down the road. I was also saving a new Piaggio clutch as a contingency after seeing a few gnarled-up 4T clutches. Kinda sad when you are expecting things to break later, but they break before break-in was completed.

Despite all the annoyance I have with LML's build quality and Genuine's lack of oversight, I will see this scooter fixed properly. If it wasn't in warranty, I'd be pulling the motor and doing an RDI this weekend. I like the engine's torque and it rides decently in spite of those mediocre Dunlops. It's still better built than Genuine's half-baked Stel-tato by a country mile. Between the two, it's a shame that the model Genuine entered the market with has fallen so far in the last few years and build quality has slumped to PRC levels. I'm just not feeling the love right now.

To anyone who suffered through that, I am sorry. When one of your two "dream" scoots turns into a turkey, it's a bit of a buzzkill. :cry:
At what point does a hobby become an addiction? I'm uncertain, but after the twelfth scooter, it sorta feels like the latter...

Seriously...I've lost count...

Seven mopeds ...that's still manageable...
avescoots1134
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Post by avescoots1134 »

Ouch!
ArgonV
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Post by ArgonV »

Man that stinks... It has got to be a defect from the mfg. Every now and then mine will jump out of second right after I've shifted. I think I need to adjust the cables a lil in the selector box.

I'm pretty rough on the throttle and quick on the gear change as I'm pulling a hack. Should I take it more easy? I've got 1400 miles on my 2013 4t so far...
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Stilts
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Post by Stilts »

Seems to be a running issue with the 2013 models, sadly.
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Drum Pro
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Post by Drum Pro »

I hear ya and I'm sorry for your troubles. If I could, I think I would have bought a 2005 PX. They've got to be better built than any Stella......
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Stitch
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Post by Stitch »

Wasn't that px a 2t? Apples and oranges.
"Stella" is Latin for "use threadlocker on all fasteners"
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Post by Drum Pro »

Stitch wrote:Wasn't that px a 2t? Apples and oranges.
Yep an doubly worse I live in Ca. So getting a brand new 2t is a pain....
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srbbnd
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Post by srbbnd »

Ohhhhhh that sucks man. I had a problem with it going full throttle when I was trying to slow down a few times, needle pin was getting stuck at full throttle, thought I was going to die, had to turn the key to get it to shut off/kill switch did not shut it down. Never had it changing gears though. Good luck, hopefully Genuine and your dealer figure out what is going on in a timely fashion.
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BuddyRaton
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Post by BuddyRaton »

Sorry to hear it Az..I know that is one of your favorite bikes. I know you want to tear that thing apart but use the warranty!

I know that sound and it just sucks. Keep us updated what you find out what happened.
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az_slynch
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Post by az_slynch »

Stopped by my friendly neighborhood dealer to check on my 4T. She's on a lift and Genuine's apparently authorized a full teardown. Not much to see yet, but the shift box was off so I took a look at it.

Interestingly, the 3rd gear alignment of the shift arm is flush with the case mating surface. This is consistent with an '83-on PX series EFL or "Lusso" gearbox. The housing is styled like the older PX with the plastic insert for the neutral indicator light. I'm wondering if LML hybridized the two shift boxes to keep the indicator but actuate a Lusso gearbox. Neutral and 2nd gear positioning on the two gearboxes have the same location from the mating surface, so it likely wasn't jumping out of second due to improper shifter positioning.

Tuesday when they tear down the motor, I've asked to take a peek. I'm pretty sure it's a Lusso derivative now, but I'd like to get tooth counts on all the gears so I can start figuring out better gearbox tuning, take some measurements on the cylinder stud spacing / oilway location and take measurements of the camshaft. Might as well start planning for the future...

#1400!
At what point does a hobby become an addiction? I'm uncertain, but after the twelfth scooter, it sorta feels like the latter...

Seriously...I've lost count...

Seven mopeds ...that's still manageable...
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az_slynch
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Post by az_slynch »

So, I checked in on the engine earlier in the week. Still not split, but hot damn, there was a lot of axial play in the output shaft. I could turn it about 20 degrees without moving the clutch. Was a big clue, but I didn't connect the dots until I got a call from the shop today.

They split the case today. Initial reports of damage include a gnarly cruciform, chewed up inner gear faces, and the intermediate shaft was making a ratling noise...

So, the tapping noise wasn't the cam drive. The cush drive got mashed into oblivion. This is a known thing on a 2T, but I've never encountered one. I assume that the shock of losing drive and having it abruptly reengaged multiple times was the culprit.

Going to go see the sum of the parts tomorrow. Still doing tooth counts. Want the cush drive split open now, I'm wondering if it has the double springs like a P200 or if they're single springs like a 125/150.
At what point does a hobby become an addiction? I'm uncertain, but after the twelfth scooter, it sorta feels like the latter...

Seriously...I've lost count...

Seven mopeds ...that's still manageable...
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