Buddy exloded :(

[jfrost2]

Not mine, but my dad's, and it didnt explode.

I just took his bike for the 200 mile oil change today, seemed to work fine in the test, but when we both went riding today, the thing starting shooting oil like a squirt gun, it got all over the bike and leaked out onto the road.

The bike was still running but had a funny gear mesh sound, probably from the lack of oil. It started up 2-3 times but then stopped for good. It wont hold an idle because of not enough oil to lube and turn the gears properly.

I layed down on the road to see what was wrong with his bike and it seems all the oil is spewing from the filter.

Anyone know what is wrong or could be wrong? Not tightened enough? Bad filter? Same dealer serviced my bike and mine works fine.

[5 bud7]

You have been on forum long enough to have read about filters vibrating loose and loosing oil. Cannot understand why you didn't turn it off when you saw oil sperting out? Also, why would you start motor 3 more times until it seized from lack of oil? This is a good lesson for everyone- if you see a leak or hear strange noises. stop the scooter and don't run again until repaired. Call the dealer and explaine what happened and take scooter back to him with guarentee in hand. this may be an expensive lesson.

[jfrost2]

It wasnt me riding, it was my father on his bike.

I didnt know what was going on at first, I just saw him pull over to the curb of the road, I road on thinking he might have had the "bad gas" problem where the bike shuts off from burning bad gas or a air bubble.

Finally I didnt see him come to where I was, so I rode back to him and then saw all the oil.

While riding behind him I did see oil on the road, but I thought it was from a car or another vehicle. I didnt connect the two until finally I saw the oil itself leak.

We started the engine 3 times to before we saw the oil itself drip, like I said, we thought it was bad gas. Then i bent over and told him the oil back there was from his bike.

[jmazza]

Argh. That sucks. Hope it goes well with the dealer.

[jfrost2]

I hate to bother them again so soon, especially since they dont fix bikes on Saturdays, but hopefully they can find and examine the problem and fix it under warranty for free

[jmazza]

hate to bother them? Ok, maybe you both could have minimized the damage report by not trying to run it more, but they just did the oil change and it's spewing oil!

I'd be banging on the owner's door RIGHT NOW!

[peabody99]

I think there might be some threads on post oil change problems-generally always mechanics fault whether dealer/professional or home. I am the worst with remembering these sort of things, but I think this has happened to people where 1)something was not screwed on tight enough or 2) something was screwed on too tight and broke, or 3) too much oil was put in (don't think that is the case here).

either way dealer needs to deal with this.

[jfrost2]

If the dealer cant fix it tomorrow (this saturday) I'm going to have to do it myself.

I know what the problem is now, the oil filter isnt torqued the point where it can hold the oil in, it's loose, if I can find a drill bit that fits I can tighten it, and if I can contact my dealer and ask what brand/grade of oil they used, I can go buy some and fill it myself.

[jmazza]

If the engine seized, you'll have a lot more to do than just fill it with oil.

If the filter is loose it's completely the dealer's fault. I wouldn't touch it because then you lose credibility with them when you go back to make your claim.

Just leave it as it is and at least tell them about it tomorrow. (At least that's what I'd do)

[jfrost2]

Ya, your right. I'll let them handle it, I just hate driving 1.5 hours there and back, and that's if theres no traffic on the highway, last time it took me 3 hours to get there.

[shark]

If the dealer cant fix it tomorrow (this saturday) I'm going to have to do it myself.

I know what the problem is now, the oil filter isnt torqued the point where it can hold the oil in, it's loose, if I can find a drill bit that fits I can tighten it, and if I can contact my dealer and ask what brand/grade of oil they used, I can go buy some and fill it myself.

If the dealer changed the oil...they have probably wasted the engine and have some work to do. Dont even bother trying to repair it. If you touch it you could become responsible. Dont hesitate to bother them tomorrow. Do it first thing!!

Do not use the slot type filters. They are not the oem recommended filter and many here have had tightening issues with those.. It's obvious their mechanic did not tighten the filter.

[jfrost2]

I worry what my father did to the bike, he told me he rode about a house down when he got the bike to start up first try, I dont blame him, I myself didnt think the oil back there was his. I thought he'd start up and catch up behind me.

But because he rode the bike around 100 feet without enough oil, the engine may really be damaged, we'll be lucky if there was enough oil to keep the gears "healthy", just not enough to keep them moving.

[gt1000]

I can't really understand all of what happened in this incident, other than the fact that, once again, an oil filter wasn't torqued properly so the bike started leaking oil.

For future reference, there are times when you should NOT try to start or ride your bike. While it may seem like common sense to most folks, it apparently is not, so here are two big reasons NOT to start or ride your bike.

1. Oil leak: If you suspect an oil leak, shut the bike down immediately and do not attempt a restart until you've checked your oil level and you've found and fixed the leak. If you run the engine with insufficient oil, the engine will seize. If this happens while you're riding you will experience one of the scariest moments of your life. If the leak is slower and the engine doesn't seize, you're still leaking oil near your rear tire. That can immediately result in the 2nd scariest moment of your life. Oil can leak from a few places, typically the filter, the drain plug, a poorly fitted or missing dipstick or a cracked crankcase. If you ever have an oil leak, never try to restart your engine before checking the dipstick for oil level. If it's low, you need a tow. Unless you have oil with you.

2. Gas leak: If you suspect a gas leak shut down immediately. On a bike with carbs, fuel flows under low pressure so you can check your fuel line and possibly find and fix the leak. If you can't find the leak, do not restart the bike. If you're leaking fuel at speed bad things (like fire) can happen. Remember, your muffler is hot. If your bike has FI this is even more critical because fuel is delivered under high pressure and can literally spray all over everything. Bike fires happen and the results are seldom pretty.

Be safe out there people.

[Dibber]

You can buy oil filter sockets that will fit on a socket wrench and it would be a good idea to start checking the oil filter tightness before you ride and definately before you leave the shop after they have changed the oil. Most oil filters should be hand tighten, but on the Buddy you need to really tighten them down thus the use of the socket and wrench. The socket can be purchased by Motorsports Scooter. I would buy the hex and slotted socket they are not expensive at all.

[jfrost2]

Doesnt matter anymore, his bike is dead, the entire engine is powder and grinded up.

The bike's out of commission for a week or two as genuine is shipping metro scooter a new engine under warranty. This means re-breaking it in and redoing the first service. I'll be doing the service myself though just because by record, the bike itself already had the first service done by the dealer, so our warranty is still intact.

[ericalm]

Good to know Genuine and Metro are taking care of this.

The oil filter tightening problem is well known on this forum. I just don't know how many times it has to happen.

For those doing filter changes at home: It's probably worth it to spend a few extra dollars for a Piaggio-branded filter with a hex head. It's easier to tighten.

I saw a really cool new tool for this on ModernVespa but can't find it now. It was like a big metal asterisk with a cut out for the filter head in the middle. Just slips right over and makes it much easier to tighten.

Also check out this tool from Motorsport, which also sells a socket head for some filters.

And this tool from Jettin, which handles your filter and your drain plug.

[jfrost2]

Atleast I still got my buddy and she works fine! Just finished the turn signal splicing mod.

[jmazza]

I saw a really cool new tool for this on ModernVespa but can't find it now. It was like a big metal asterisk with a cut out for the filter head in the middle. Just slips right over and makes it much easier to tighten.

http://www.oopsclunkthud.com/

I think that's what you're talking about, right Eric?

[ericalm]

That's the one!

Of course, you're not going to get precise torque settings with it. But it's better than a strap wrench or channel locks.

[jfrost2]

When doing the oil change and tightening the filter, do you really need any special tools?

Also, do you have to over tighten it, or do you just keep turning until it is tight enough from arm strength? Same for the drain bolt.

[voodoosix]

i remember reading here that the Buddy needs the filter tightened to 16 ft/lbs of torque.

you'd more than likely need the socket end filter and a ratchet to get it that tight. you could get the slotted one that tight but you couldnt check it with a torque wrench.

[illnoise]

I'll be doing the service myself though just because by record, the bike itself already had the first service done by the dealer, so our warranty is still intact.

I think the first service includes adjusting the valves and other stuff that are more complicated than just an oil change. I'd let the dealer do it. They might not have a great track record, but at least when *they* screw up, they're accountable for it. And I'd think it would be free, considering the circumstances.

Bb.

[JettaKnight]

Not mine, but my dad's, and it didnt explode.

I just took his bike for the 200 mile oil change today, seemed to work fine in the test, but when we both went riding today, the thing starting shooting oil like a squirt gun, it got all over the bike and leaked out onto the road.

The bike was still running but had a funny gear mesh sound, probably from the lack of oil. It started up 2-3 times but then stopped for good. It wont hold an idle because of not enough oil to lube and turn the gears properly.

I layed down on the road to see what was wrong with his bike and it seems all the oil is spewing from the filter.

Anyone know what is wrong or could be wrong? Not tightened enough? Bad filter? Same dealer serviced my bike and mine works fine.

Been there, have the receipt to prove it.

My advice, use a torque wrench on the filter. 'Hand tight' is fine for autos, not for one cylinder engines. Since it seized up, there is at least moderate damage and should be rebuilt or replaced. Mine had top end bearing damage (Not proved yet).

Wait, I just reread your post, A dealer did this? Then it would be their fault and they should pay for the new engine.