Can't Electric Start -- Bad Starter?

squash1978 · Post by **squash1978** » Sat Nov 23, 2013 4:15 am

A few weeks ago out of the blue my Buddy would not start with the electric starter. The day before it was fine but the next morning when I went to start it up all I heard was a click. At first, I figured it was my battery since it's 5+ years old and I have just been kick starting it the past few weeks.

I finally got around to ordering a new battery, charged it up, and installed it this evening but when I went to start it up all I got was the click from the starter relay. Before my new battery arrived, I started to suspect that the battery was not the problem because I tried to jump start my Buddy with my car battery and still was not able to get it start up with the electric starter.

This evening, I rigged up a test light using a small light bulb and a couple wires to see if perhaps I had an electrical problem with the starter relay or the starter motor itself. I followed the instructions outlined by Robbie in this thread:

viewtopic.php?t=25716

I was able to confirm flow where the positive cable attaches to the relay (input side?), the output side of the relay (while holding the brake lever and pushing the starter button), and to where the power cable attaches to the starter motor (again while pushing the starter button).

Having seemingly ruled out an electrical issue, is it safe to assume that I have a bad starter motor? Is there anything simple/obvious that I could be missing?

I was hoping to fix the issue myself but the more I troubleshoot it, the more likely it seems that I will have to take it to the shop. Thanks!

viney266 · Post by **viney266** » Sat Nov 23, 2013 5:10 am

I would not rule out the battery just yet, stop by your local bike/ scooter shop and get battery tested ( yes the new one) to be sure.

Then double check to make sure the solenoid/ relay isn't bad also. THEN head to the starter. Buddy electrical systems are pretty good and rarely show problems.

squash1978 · Post by **squash1978** » Sat Nov 23, 2013 6:35 am

I'm not super mechanically inclined so pardon my ignorance if I'm missing something but since I was able to verify that power was making it to the output side of the relay and also to the starter motor itself, doesn't that rule out the relay as the source of the problem?

OldGuy · Post by **OldGuy** » Sat Nov 23, 2013 7:36 am

Not really ruling out the battery yet. Even a weak battery can make electricity. But it takes a good battery to make enough current to turn the starter. Starters are energy hogs, and a weak battery won't supply enough current to turn the starter.

A weak battery is like a faucet that is only opened a little. There is pressure trying to push the water out but not much water flow (current). Open the faucet a lot and you get a lot of flow (current); that's what a good battery will give you.

agrogod · Post by **agrogod** » Sat Nov 23, 2013 11:15 am

Since he tried to jump it with a stronger car battery would that not rule out the battery as the problem? With all the weird occurrences many have had this year, it may just be another one of those weird problems.

squash1978 · Post by **squash1978** » Sat Nov 23, 2013 2:02 pm

That makes sense about the battery OldGuy. As agrogod pointed out I did try to jump start it with with a car battery without success. However, this was with the old battery in, so I don't know if that makes a difference. I will say that it was a bit challenging getting a good connection on the Buddy battery with the jumper cable clamps. The clamps are fairly big and there is not a lot of room in the battery compartment. Perhaps I should try jumping it with the new battery in?

TVB · Post by **TVB** » Sat Nov 23, 2013 2:40 pm

squash1978 wrote:That makes sense about the battery OldGuy. As agrogod pointed out I did try to jump start it with with a car battery without success. However, this was with the old battery in, so I don't know if that makes a difference. I will say that it was a bit challenging getting a good connection on the Buddy battery with the jumper cable clamps. The clamps are fairly big and there is not a lot of room in the battery compartment. Perhaps I should try jumping it with the new battery in?

It's worth a try, but a good car battery should be able to provide plenty of current to compensate for any "drag" from also being hooked up to a dead scooter battery. That's three batteries you've tried to start it with; I think it's time to move on to the next hypothesis.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Sat Nov 23, 2013 3:15 pm

You can always bypass the battery and relay with a jump start. From a good battery jump positive to the starter positive. Hook up the jumper neg to the battery. To test the starter touch the neg to neg on the starter. If the starter doesn't kick it's shot.

squash1978 · Post by **squash1978** » Sat Nov 23, 2013 3:59 pm

BuddyRaton wrote:You can always bypass the battery and relay with a jump start. From a good battery jump positive to the starter positive. Hook up the jumper neg to the battery. To test the starter touch the neg to neg on the starter. If the starter doesn't kick it's shot.

Thanks! I'll give that a try!

OldGuy · Post by **OldGuy** » Sun Nov 24, 2013 4:49 am

Somehow I overlooked that you jump started from a car. Others have said this, and I agree, that pretty much takes the battery off the list of suspects. Sorry if I lead you down the wrong path.

I wonder if the starter relay is going bad. It may click, but if the contacts are bad it won't pass enough current to turn the starter.

BuddyRaton has a great idea, to jumper past it. Just be careful and safe when you try please!

squash1978 · Post by **squash1978** » Wed Dec 18, 2013 9:24 pm

So just to follow-up on my original post, I finally got around to transporting my Buddy to the shop and it turns out the problem is my starter motor and I need a new one.

Sucks but it is what it is.

OldGuy · Post by **OldGuy** » Wed Dec 18, 2013 9:38 pm

Bummer on the starter, but good to know. Thanks for posting a follow-up.

TVB · Post by **TVB** » Wed Dec 18, 2013 10:44 pm

Look on the bright side: it's probably gonna be cheaper than the replacement starter I recently had put in my car.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Thu Dec 19, 2013 2:03 pm

Replacing the starter is a pretty easy job. The problem is that only the OEM will fit and that sucker is expensive (relatively), I also replaced the relay while I was in there...that part was cheap.

I know it is a cost but I'm glad it is only the starter and not something more serious!