Consumer Report: Scooters

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Sun Nov 20, 2011 11:26 pm

I found two article by Consumer Report on scooters. As far as I can tell, between 1991 and 2011, only two articles were every written by the magazine. They aren't great articles but I thought folks on this board might be interested to take a peek.

I've posted one here. The other one is a bit large for an attachment so I'll find an alternative way.

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Sun Nov 20, 2011 11:31 pm

The other is from 2009 and can be downloaded by following this link:

http://ifile.it/2folipy

TVB · Post by **TVB** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:05 am

While I generally have a lot of respect for Consumer Reports when they evalulate products they understand, I look at these two articles and wonder why they bothered doing them. What's the point of comparing a Vespa, a Ruckus, and a PRC scooter (in the 50cc category)? Is someone actually going to look at just those three, and wonder which one has the shortest braking distance? And knocking the Vespa and Ruckus for not having side kickstands shows that they don't really understand the product.

The 125-150cc selection is at least a set of three comparable scooters but still too small a sample to be meaningful. And comparing just a Ninja and a Rebel for their motorcycle selections? As if these were two bikes some buyer might be choosing between?

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:08 am

Yeah, overall I didn't think they did a good job in comparison. Some finer points were useful to know though.

And really, what they should have done is research and write a much more in-depth article introducing readers to scooters, the various kinds, and what to consider when purchasing, etc. Oh well...!

There are some products that they just don't know how to do well in, and this includes Mac computers way back in the early 90's when they were so singularly focused on trying to match Macs to Windows it made no sense. Macs back then were certainly more suitable in certain work environments than Windows, etc.

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:15 am

lol looks like the SH150 beat Aprilia in the all important scooter category of NVH

desmolicious · Post by **desmolicious** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 3:29 am

TVB wrote: And knocking the Vespa and Ruckus for not having side kickstands shows that they don't really understand the product.

I have 2 Vespas w/o side stands and I would much prefer it if they did have them, just like most other scoots.
I put one on my GTS250, but hardly ever use it because it is that really stooopid spring loaded design. Why can't it be like the Buddy i.e. normal?

So I actually agree with CR in that regard.

peabody99 · Post by **peabody99** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 4:03 am

truth be told of my vespa had a trusty side stand, poor buddy might not get as much action. My GTS is nightmarish to get on and off a centerstand on even the slightest slope. Since I moved from the flat midwest to a city that seems to be on a huge hill, my Vespa riding has majorally decreased.

as far as Consumer Reports dissing scoots, I am sure since they do so many car ratings they don't want to miff their bread an butter "customers"-the auto industry. Yeah, yeah, I know consumers are supposed to be the consumers, but I am jaded.

TVB · Post by **TVB** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 12:50 pm

peabody99 wrote:as far as Consumer Reports dissing scoots, I am sure since they do so many car ratings they don't want to miff their bread an butter "customers"-the auto industry. Yeah, yeah, I know consumers are supposed to be the consumers, but I am jaded.

They didn't put scooters down; they just did a superficial job of evaluating a few of them. And unlike magazines which depend on advertising dollars from the industries they cover, CR does not. In fact, they tend to piss off manufacturers with negative reviews.

Ethan Allison · Post by **Ethan Allison** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:02 am

TVB wrote:And knocking the Vespa and Ruckus for not having side kickstands shows that they don't really understand the product.

Can you explain this? I like side stands so I'm a bit confused here.

Post by **ericalm** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 5:32 am

Modern Vespa with a kickstand is a Vespa waiting to wind up on its side. Don't need it, don't miss it.

TVB · Post by **TVB** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 2:53 pm

Ethan Allison wrote:
TVB wrote:And knocking the Vespa and Ruckus for not having side kickstands shows that they don't really understand the product.
Can you explain this? I like side stands so I'm a bit confused here.

My point was that a center stand is more stable and safer, making a kickstand unnecessary. I rarely use mine, and one of the times I did, the scooter rolled, tipped over, and broke the brake handle off. So a scooter without a kickstand is not (IMHO) an inferior one.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 4:25 pm

And, if there is anyone who is dying to add a sidestand to a Vespa, they can certainly do that. I am with TVB, I see the reason for using the centerstand and prefer that configuration.

babblefish · Post by **babblefish** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 10:38 pm

Maybe Vespa left off the sidestand for safety reasons - they didn't want people starting their scooters with them on their sidestands.

viney266 · Post by **viney266** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 10:58 pm

TVB wrote:While I generally have a lot of respect for Consumer Reports when they evalulate products they understand, I look at these two articles and wonder why they bothered doing them. What's the point of comparing a Vespa, a Ruckus, and a PRC scooter (in the 50cc category)? Is someone actually going to look at just those three, and wonder which one has the shortest braking distance? And knocking the Vespa and Ruckus for not having side kickstands shows that they don't really understand the product.

The 125-150cc selection is at least a set of three comparable scooters but still too small a sample to be meaningful. And comparing just a Ninja and a Rebel for their motorcycle selections? As if these were two bikes some buyer might be choosing between?

^^^ Agreed... I have seen several examples of that. When they are out of their "specialty" they can look at some foolish comparisions. Just because they don't know any better.

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 11:00 pm

ericalm wrote:Modern Vespa with a kickstand is a Vespa waiting to wind up on its side. Don't need it, don't miss it.

I was reading elsewhere that a kickstand can be very useful, especially when parking on hills. The ability to lean on one side can mitigate the incline of the hill.

TVB · Post by **TVB** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 1:12 am

teabow1 wrote:I was reading elsewhere that a kickstand can be very useful, especially when parking on hills. The ability to lean on one side can mitigate the incline of the hill.

Perhaps, but the kickstand is simultaneously more likely to fold up on sloped ground. It's safer to turn the scooter so it's facing directly uphill and use the center stand.

I will acknowledge one situation in which I found it helpful. My campsite was wet from the previous days' rain, and the center stand was starting to sink into the ground. Putting out the kickstand served as a backup means of support, and the next morning I found the tip of the kickstand resting gently on the damp ground.

(On the other hand, if I'd used just the kickstand, my scoot certainly would've fallen over during the night.)

Post by **ericalm** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 1:56 am

teabow1 wrote:
ericalm wrote:Modern Vespa with a kickstand is a Vespa waiting to wind up on its side. Don't need it, don't miss it.
I was reading elsewhere that a kickstand can be very useful, especially when parking on hills. The ability to lean on one side can mitigate the incline of the hill.

What I see a lot in SF when I go there is all the scooters/bikes, kickstands or not, parked at the tops and bottoms of the hills.

If I didn't trust my scooter on a centerstand on a hill, I sure as heck wouldn't be confident leaving it on the sidestand. I might be better able to balance it, but it's I wouldn't leave it like that. The number of people whose scooters have fallen over due to wind, gravity, the rider accidentally throttling, etc. when it was on a sidestand far outnumbers those which were on their center stands. Often, the rider will post, "I just set it on the sidestand to run into the store/house/for a minute…" Etc.

Motorcycles are a bit different. Because of their tall wheels and higher center of gravity, they're a lot more stable on a kickstand. The added weight of a bigger bike also helps. (My first bike ever was a freakin' GoldWing 1100 with a center stand. Impossible to get it on & off that thing even on a flat surface. On the moon.)

The sinking center stand can be alleviated by a puck such as the one you get on completing the MSF. Good for a side stand, too if you decide to use one.

I've often read that all sidestands in the US must be wired to an immobilizer preventing you from starting the bike in a sidestand. The Buddy's isn't and it's passed all the DOT testing, etc., so the "law" that's often quoted could just be another 2-wheel myth. ::shrug::

babblefish · Post by **babblefish** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:42 am

ericalm wrote:
teabow1 wrote:
ericalm wrote:Modern Vespa with a kickstand is a Vespa waiting to wind up on its side. Don't need it, don't miss it.
I was reading elsewhere that a kickstand can be very useful, especially when parking on hills. The ability to lean on one side can mitigate the incline of the hill.
What I see a lot in SF when I go there is all the scooters/bikes, kickstands or not, parked at the tops and bottoms of the hills.
<snip>

They didn't start off at the bottom, they slid there...

Since I live in SF, I have first hand experience with parking on hills. On the really steep hills, parking with the kickstand on the uphill side, the scooter/motorcycle will be standing straight up and down. Not too stable this way. With the kickstand on the downhill side, it's leaned so far over that it wants to flip over the kickstand. There were times when my motorcycle was just balancing on the kickstand and I could easily pivot the wheels off the ground. Scary!