New Buddy won't start

OrgnkrOOts · Post by **OrgnkrOOts** » Sun Dec 15, 2013 10:05 pm

I bought my '09 Italia 150 a couple months ago.Since then my wife and I have put about 1600 miles on it. Last Wedsnday it gave me some problems starting for a couple minutes, but it started after a few trys. Later in the day it died while stopped at a red light. So Thursday I took it to a Genuine certified dealer to get the valves adjusted after the dealer advised me to do so. Took it home from the dealer and hung out for a few hours then tried to take off and it wouldnt start. It took 10 minutes before it did start. I called the dealer back, he told me to drop it off the next morning. I dropped it off, left it overnight, and he called the next day saying it was ready to be picked up. He said that it started fine for him and idled fine for about 30 minutes, and that he couldnt find anything wrong. Took it home it worked fine the remainder of the day. Today is a different story. It won't start at all. I've been trying all day. It chugs like its trying to start, but never actually does. Kick doesn't work either. I just walked in the house from trying again, this time it let out a huge backfire, but still didn't start. I plan on taking back to the dealer tomorrow, this time it will have to be towed. I do have roadside assistance so thats good. From what I've read this is abnormal behavior from a buddy. Does anyone have any advice that might be helpful?

michelle_7728 · Post by **michelle_7728** » Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:20 am

Wow, that stinks. No, this is not normal behaviour from a Buddy.

Have you added anything, like a BOB adaptor, alarm, heated grips, that could be draining the battery? I have all of the above on mine, but I put it on a battery tender on a regular basis with no issue. Mine are 125cc's.

OrgnkrOOts · Post by **OrgnkrOOts** » Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:25 am

No I haven't added anything except footpegs and a rear rack. You think it may be the battery? That wouldn't cause the backfire though would it?

scootERIK · Post by **scootERIK** » Mon Dec 16, 2013 3:50 am

Could be the stator.

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Mon Dec 16, 2013 7:23 am

i wonder if someone might comment about what might cause that "huge backfire" OP mentions? might it be a clue to what is amiss?

PeteH · Post by **PeteH** » Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:19 pm

If it 'chugs like it wants to start' and 'kick starting doesn't work', it ain't the battery.

Remember, the starts-then-dies was a symptom of vacuum lock. If it's an '09, it may have an unvented gas cap. Remove the cap and try to start it (on the center stand, of course). If you hear any sort of 'whoosh' of air when you remove the cap, you've found the problem. See your dealer for a vented cap, or search here for "drill AND gas AND cap".

OrgnkrOOts · Post by **OrgnkrOOts** » Mon Dec 16, 2013 3:37 pm

Thanks everyone. PeteH I'll try starting it without the gas cap to see what happens.

michelle_7728 · Post by **michelle_7728** » Tue Dec 17, 2013 9:08 am

I wonder if bad gas would cause that as well? Doesn't seem like bad gas would cause a backfire though...my one experience with bad gas was on the freeway with my MP3 500...it started cutting out real bad. I got off the freeway asap, and on to a side road, then gunned it a bit to get through the bad gas. No issues after that.

Also, I put Seafoam in each time I fill up.

I don't know if any of this will help...let us know what you end up finding out, as it might help someone else as well.

noisymilk · Post by **noisymilk** » Wed Dec 18, 2013 3:54 pm

Did you get any satisfaction from the dealer?

If not, I live in Mesa as well, and am relatively savvy.

Backfire could be caused by a bit of flooding.

Sounds like it could be either of the 2 issues I've had with mine over the years. When I was on my Canada trip, the sending coil of all things went out. (This is the thing on the stator that tells the ignition to fire at the appropriate place in rotation) It was intermittent.....so the engine would start and run fine for several days, then stutter sometimes, then start working again. It finally died on the way on the trip, and required replacing the stator. Easy enough to do.

Or, recently, my vacuum petcock died finally. (20k on the scoot) My engine was flooding with fuel all the way down into the cases. Oil and gas. Bad. But a simple 7 dollar part and 20 minutes of work. Flush the cases, new oil, runs like a top again.

So I guess the question is, what are your actual symptoms. IE, spins just fine but won't ignite (IE, good battery, but sending coil doesn't tell ingnition coil to fire), or sluggish starting and fuel in the oil, indicating over full bottom cases with fuel oil mixture, and too much the piston compression to allow stable running. (Might start, but stall when trying to let it settle to idle) This would also indicate as rough acceleration, rough idle. Basically, too much stuff under the piston to allow proper running. Big indicator would be fuel in oil (obviously).

Like I said, I'm in Mesa. Look me up if you need help.

michelle_7728 · Post by **michelle_7728** » Wed Dec 18, 2013 4:51 pm

Nice offer, milk! You sound like you really know your stuff.

easy · Post by **easy** » Thu Dec 19, 2013 12:40 am

Only fill the gas tank to the metal ring that's inside the tank. Topping off the tank can get fuel in evap system and cause starting issues

OrgnkrOOts · Post by **OrgnkrOOts** » Fri Dec 20, 2013 1:46 am

Ok, so I got it back from the dealer yesterday. They replaced the stator and its been running great since I got it back! Thanks for the offer Milk, I might take you up on that in the future

And thanks everyone for your all your help!

RexM · Post by **RexM** » Fri Dec 20, 2013 5:13 pm

OrgnkrOOts wrote:Ok, so I got it back from the dealer yesterday. They replaced the stator and its been running great since I got it back!

That's great news

Out of curiousity, was Performance Scooter the dealer in question? Were they cool about the whole thing in the end? Just wondering how your opinion of them is shaking out with regard to the thread about Phoenix area dealers.

I don't have a horse in the race with regard to them, but my take is that I can look past a missed diagnosis—it happens—if the shop is willing to keep making an effort and gets it right after a few tries. Of course their attitude during the process plays a big role.

Hope you have lots of trouble free riding in your future!

OrgnkrOOts · Post by **OrgnkrOOts** » Fri Dec 20, 2013 5:43 pm

Yeah that was the shop. One of the guys there kept telling me and my wife that they didn't get paid for warranty work, that Genuine didn't like to hold up there obligation on warranties, and also that he didn't want to even carry the brand. They also mentioned that I didn't buy my scooter at their shop. I was under the impression that I could take it to any certified dealer and get it worked on. I wasn't really sure what to make of all this, it didn't sound quite right to me. But in the end they fixed my Buddy and its working well, so I am happy.

Syd · Post by **Syd** » Fri Dec 20, 2013 7:47 pm

OrgnkrOOts wrote:Yeah that was the shop. One of the guys there kept telling me and my wife that they didn't get paid for warranty work, that Genuine didn't like to hold up there obligation on warranties, and also that he didn't want to even carry the brand. They also mentioned that I didn't buy my scooter at their shop. I was under the impression that I could take it to any certified dealer and get it worked on. I wasn't really sure what to make of all this, it didn't sound quite right to me. But in the end they fixed my Buddy and its working well, so I am happy.

Too bad the guy's such a tool. His problems aren't your problems, sheesh.

Who towed your Buddy? When my scoot got wrecked I happened upon AZ Motorcycle Towing. that's all she does, and she's got the coolest rig: The whole apparatus comes out of the bed of the pickup; the bike gets rolled on and tucked in place; and the whole kit lifts up, forward, and down snug into the bed again. Sweet.

OrgnkrOOts · Post by **OrgnkrOOts** » Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:05 pm

I can't recall the name of the company but it wasn't specifically for motorcycles. They got to my place pretty quick though

pattio · Post by **pattio** » Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:10 pm

OP, I'm glad you got your problem taken care of, and I hope you will find a way to do some future business with the shop that helped you. They took a hit based on trying for your future business, even if they could have been smoother about letting you know. Generally as a dealer you get partial credit against future parts orders as your 'payment' for the kind of warranty repair you describe. It's sad and common to get bikes from defunct sellers who assured someone that it was flying on a magic warranty carpet. It's important to be smooth with the potential customer, though, in the hopes you can make a paying customer out of them.

OrgnkrOOts · Post by **OrgnkrOOts** » Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:49 pm

Pattio, I do plan on going to them for future work as of now. They have been ok with me before this with oil changes and I'm hoping this experience was just a one time thing. My warranty will run out eventually and I will have to pay for repairs when it does. I will gladly continue to use their services if I am happy with things. I admit, I don't know what goes on behind the scenes. But I do have a warranty, and I don't feel I should lose that because of conflict between dealer and Genuine. But at the moment I am just happy to be back on the road, and we will just have to see how things go from here on out!