2021 Rattler 200i Coming?

[jrsjr]

Because Covid-19 I have time to do things like peruse government databases and I happened to come across something that may interest you Rattler folks. Here is the list of Models covered by one entry in the EPA database for 2021 Genuine scooters:

Blur 200i, Formula T 200i, Rattler 200i, Urbano 200i

Whhatever it is, it uses exactly the same engine as the Blur 200i.

Am I just behind the times again? Did you all already know all about this or is it vaporware (like the Venture 150 that showed up in the EPA datase a few years ago) or what?

I'm interested to hear. Thanks!

[NorCalRattler]

I’m still kinda new here but.. would definitely consider getting one of these (if true) to have alongside my Rattler 110!

[jrsjr]

I’m still kinda new here but.. would definitely consider getting one of these (if true) to have alongside my Rattler 110!

It is an interesting idea, isn't it? That category (ADV scooters) is something Honda is exploring right now, too.

P.S. Belated Welcome to Modern Buddy, NorCalRattler! I'm sorry that I spend most of my Modern Buddy time and energy being the unwelcoming committee for spammers instead of the welcoming committee for legit new members. Anyway, we're glad you're here!

[NorCalRattler]

Thanks for the formal welcome. Glad to be hear, although my old buck ten platform doesn’t seem to have much discussion - still like reading about what everyone else is up to.

This is my first scooter, I come from a long list of motorcycles (Buell, Harley, Suzuki) but found this 2 stroke 110 for a hell of a deal and jumped on it, perfect for quick beer runs!

[wheelbender6]

I am familiar with the Blur 220i, but not the 200i.
-Which one was in the 2021 database?

[wheelbender6]

I did find a small amount of info related to the Blur 200i:

"The G-Max design was new from PGO for 2006. Overseas the G-Max is sold in 50, 125, 150, 200 and 220cc varieties."

http://www.motorscooterguide.net/Genuin ... -220i.html

https://bikereviews.weebly.com/pgo-g-max-200.html

[Dooglas]

Here is the list of Models covered by one entry in the EPA database for 2021 Genuine scooters:

Blur 200i, Formula T 200i, Rattler 200i, Urbano 200i

Wouldn't the return of the Blur also be a big deal? I have heard nothing about that either.

[jrsjr]

I am familiar with the Blur 220i, but not the 200i.
-Which one was in the 2021 database?

I know, right? Makes no sense. But here is the exact database entry for this vehicle straight out of the EPA database:

Model Year - 2021
Category - Highway Motorcycle - Ib (50-169cc)
Certificate No. - MGSCC.1693L7-007
Engine Family - MGSCC.1693L7
Permeation Family - MGSCPMETALSC
Manufacturer Name - Genuine Scooters, LLC
Engine OEM Manufacturer - Ningbo Longjia Motorcycle Co., Ltd.
Engine OEM Country - China
Vehicle OEM Manufacturer - Ningbo Longjia Motorcycle Co., Ltd.
Vehicle OEM Country - China
Small Volume Manufacturer Type - NA
Application Type - NEW
Sales Area - 50S+49S
Combustion Cycle - 4
No. of Cylinders - 1
Valve per Cylinder - 2
Fuel Type - GAS
Engine Displacment(s) - 169
Fuel System Type - TBI
Air/Fuel Feedback Sensor? - Y
No of Carburetors
Other Fuel System
Air Aspiration Type - NA
Other Air Aspiration Type
Air Injection Type - NA
Other Air Injection Type
Charge Air Cooler Y/N - N
Electronic Control - ECM
EGR - Y/N - N
Catalytic Converter - Y/N - N
Catalyst Type
Models Certified - Blur 200i, Formula T 200i, Rattler 200i, Urbano 200i
Exhaust Test Procedure - FTP_C
Emission Measurement Unit - G/KM
ABT Engine Family - N
Exhaust FEL - HC
Exhaust FEL - HC+NOx
Exhaust FEL - CO
EDV Type - NEW
EDV Model - Formula T
EDV VIN - L4HATELP9K6000005
EDV Engine Code - LJ1P61QMK
EDV Engine Displacement - cc - 169
EDV Rated Power - 8.5
Power Units - kW
EDV EIM - 210
EDV Rated RPM - 7500
EDV Road Load Force (N) - 117.
EDV Transmission Type - CV
EDV Transmission - No. Speeds - 1
EDV N/V Ratio - 83.0
DF Type - M
DF-HC - 1.000
DF-NOX - 1.162
DF-HC+NOX - 1.000
DF-CO - 1.000
Low Hour GHG CO2 - 59.5
Low Hour GHG CO2 Method - Tested result from the EDV(s) of the Engine Family
Low Hour GHG CH4 - 0.219
Low Hour GHG CH4 Method - Tested result from the EDV(s) of the Engine Family
Low Hour GHG N2O - 4.5
Low Hour GHG N2O Method
Certification Level - CO - 0.3
Certification Level - NOx
Certification Level - HC
Certification Level - HC+NOx
Permeation-Tank CBD Y/N
Permeation-Fuel Line CBD Y/N
Fuel Tank Material

[Syd]

If I may ask, which dB are you looking into, jrsjr? I look at th2 CARB list regularl, but there has been little activity since March, unsurprisingly.

[scootERIK]

I was really excited when I saw this post earlier. Now seeing that these 200i scooters are only going to be 169cc has me less excited. It would be nice to see Genuine sell some scooters with ~15 horsepower(these 169cc will be about 11.4hp.) But it's still nice to see Genuine adding more scooters to their lineup.

I would like to see some pictures of the Formula T and the Urbano.



Wild prediction- Genuine will change the name of the Buddy 170i to Buddy 200i.

[tenders]

I really don't understand the strategy behind misleading consumers about engine sizes. Buddy 50-125-150-170i, I get. But 200i for a 169cc? Why stop at 200 and not name it the 250 or 300? Or if you want 200 in the name, put in a 200cc engine. Either customers will know they're getting a smaller engine than is on the badge before they buy, or they'll discover it after they buy. The brand is diminished either way. And fooling the non-customer doesn't make any money, does it?

[jrsjr]

I really don't understand the strategy behind misleading consumers about engine sizes. Buddy 50-125-150-170i, I get. But 200i for a 169cc? Why stop at 200 and not name it the 250 or 300? Or if you want 200 in the name, put in a 200cc engine. Either customers will know they're getting a smaller engine than is on the badge before they buy, or they'll discover it after they buy. The brand is diminished either way. And fooling the non-customer doesn't make any money, does it?

Not to make excuses for this dishonest behavior, but this is such common practice (See Kymco) that I think Genuine had to do it to keep up with the Joneses. I mean, if they called it a 169 and Jane/Joe First-Time Scooter Buyer goes to their local Kymco dealer and sees a "200i" for sale for less money, what are they going to think? What I'm saying is, I don't think this is a game where strict honesty about engine displacement is going to carry the day when most consumers probably couldn't tell you what "displacement" means...

Just sayin'. Don't get mad.

[jrsjr]

If I may ask, which dB are you looking into, jrsjr? I look at th2 CARB list regularl, but there has been little activity since March, unsurprisingly.

Hey Syd, you're right, the CARB databases have been static. I think they closed up shop for the duration. The database I'm quoting is from the Federal EPA Annual Certification Data for Vehicles, Engines, and Equipment databases. I made the name clickable so you can go straight to it.

P.S. The EPA database had also been static for a long while. I had stopped checking until yesterday when I just happened to check in and noticed they had posted an "April" update.

[wheelbender6]

I really don't understand the strategy behind misleading consumers about engine sizes. Buddy 50-125-150-170i, I get. But 200i for a 169cc? Why stop at 200 and not name it the 250 or 300? Or if you want 200 in the name, put in a 200cc engine. Either customers will know they're getting a smaller engine than is on the badge before they buy, or they'll discover it after they buy. The brand is diminished either way. And fooling the non-customer doesn't make any money, does it?

Ironically, there are some Chinese street bikes displacing over 300cc, that are advertised as a 250. It makes them appear produce more hp per cc. Vitacci GTO 250 is one example.
https://new-bucket-txp.s3.amazonaws.com ... 50CC-2.jpg

[Dooglas]

So, these proposed models have little or nothing to do with the existing Rattler or Blur built by PGO. These appear to be 4 trims or finishes of a proposed 200 (169) scooter to be built by a Chinese manufacturer for Genuine. More like the Venture 50 that Genuine has been importing.

[jrsjr]

So, these proposed models have little or nothing to do with the existing Rattler or Blur built by PGO. These appear to be 4 trims or finishes of a proposed 200 (169) scooter to be built by a Chinese manufacturer for Genuine. More like the Venture 50 that Genuine has been importing.

Bear in mind, we are talking about a 2021 model and none of this may ever actually appear in a USA dealership. Witness the "Venture 150" which appeared in the EPA database a few years ago and which never appeared in the USA. Right now these are just line-items in a federal database. For all I know, this could just be part of Genuine's effort to suss out the community response to a prospective scooter.

[wheelbender6]

The bike reviews article said the G-max 200i will cruise at 110 km/hr (65mph), but they did not say if that was indicated or measured by GPS.
- I would be interested in a 200i if it will cruise at 65mph GPS. That would work on many of our 2 lane highways.

[jrsjr]

... Witness the "Venture 150" which appeared in the EPA database a few years ago and which never appeared in the USA.

Earlier I mentioned that scooter that never happened. It was a 2018 model year. Here is the EPA Database record for it:

Model Year - 2018
Category - Highway Motorcycle - Ib (50-169cc)
Certificate No. - JGSCC.1503K3-006
Engine Family - JGSCC.1503K3
Permeation Family - JGSCPMETALSC
Manufacturer Name - Genuine Scooters, LLC
Engine OEM Manufacturer - Ningbo Longjia Motorcycle Co., Ltd.
Engine OEM Country - China
Vehicle OEM Manufacturer - Ningbo Longjia Motorcycle Co., Ltd.
Vehicle OEM Country - China
Small Volume Manufacturer Type - NA
Application Type - NEW
Sales Area - 49S
Combustion Cycle - 4
No. of Cylinders - 1
Valve per Cylinder - 2
Fuel Type - GAS
Engine Displacment(s) - 150
Fuel System Type - CARB
Air/Fuel Feedback Sensor? - N
No of Carburetors - 1
Other Fuel System -
Air Aspiration Type - NA
Other Air Aspiration Type -
Air Injection Type - PAIR
Other Air Injection Type -
Charge Air Cooler Y/N - N
Electronic Control - OTH
EGR - Y/N - N
Catalytic Converter - Y/N - Y
Catalyst Type - TWC, single bed, open loop
Models Certified- Venture 150
Exhaust Test Procedure - FTP_C
Emission Measurement Unit - G/KM
ABT Engine Family - N
Exhaust FEL -
Exhaust FEL -
Exhaust FEL -
EDV Type - NEW
EDV Model - Venture 150
EDV VIN - L4HGCTK38G6000002
EDV Engine Code - LJ1P57QMJ
EDV Engine Displacement cc - 150
EDV Rated Power - 7.1
Power Units - kW
EDV EIM - 190
EDV Rated RPM - 7000
EDV Road Load Force (N)- 113.
EDV Transmission Type - CV
EDV Transmission No. Speeds - 1
EDV N/V Ratio - 82.34
DF Type - M
DF-HC - 1.000
DF-NOX - 1.253
DF-HC+NOX - 1.000
DF-CO - 1.000
Low Hour GHG CO2 - 57.3
Low Hour GHG CO2 Method - Tested result from the EDV(s) of the Engine Family
Low Hour GHG CH4 - 0.022
Low Hour GHG CH4 Method - Tested result from the EDV(s) of the Engine Family
Low Hour GHG N2O -
Low Hour GHG N2O Method - Derived results based on EPA GHG default factor
Certification Level - CO - 2.9
Certification Level - NOx
Certification Level - HC - 0.2
Certification Level - HC+NOx
Permeation-Tank CBD Y/N
Permeation-Fuel Line CBD Y/N
Fuel Tank Material

[RoaringTodd]

I love the ergos on my Roughhouse 50, and if it came out with the 200i version, itd be hard to say no to.

The Cabo 200i, is a very close comparison. If I ever needed a larger scooter, that one is on the top of my list.

[cummingsjc]

I love the ergos on my Roughhouse 50, and if it came out with the 200i version, itd be hard to say no to.

The Cabo 200i, is a very close comparison. If I ever needed a larger scooter, that one is on the top of my list.

I agree. I had an online chat with someone from Genuine in the past a couple of years ago and said that a Roughhouse 125cc would be a great bike and they agreed with me 😀 then told me it would never happen.😢 I've sworn up and down that I'd buy one if they ever brought one out.

[scootERIK]

Genuine added the Rattler 200i to their website. Looking at the pictures it looks like it shares the same motor as the Urbano 200i, and possibly it is an Urrbano 200i with different bodywork.

Really curious on how it rides and the price.


http://www.genuinescooters.com/rattler200i.html

[wheelbender6]

The Rattler 200i styling is growing on me. Its not classic styling, but it is not too much like a sport bike either.
We will soon find out if it has enough power to make me want to trade in my Buddy.

[scootERIK]

I got a chance to take a Rattler 200i out for a quick test ride the other day. This was a brand new scooter with less than 50 miles so I didn't ride it as hard as I would have liked, so no top speed runs or hard cornering(hopefully I can get a chance to ride a fully broken in 200i in the future.)

It's a really nice looking scooter and everything felt solid. It started right up and had a nice sound. It did take a lot more throttle to get moving compared to my Buddy 125, this might change once the belt and clutch get used more. It had good pickup even without going full throttle. I only took it up to 50 mph indicated but it felt really stable. 45 mph on slightly bumpy backroad was very comfortable. It felt good in the corners but I was going much slower than I would on my Buddy since the tires needed to be scuffed in more(and I didn't want to risk crashing a brand new scooter.) I really liked the digital tachometer, and the speedometer was easy to read. Brakes felt pretty good, but I didn't do any hard braking to really test them out. For the short ride I took the riding position was comfortable(except for the knob in the seat.) The handlebars are further back than the Buddy handlebars. There are a couple of places you can put your feet which should be nice on longer rides.

But there is one problem with the Rattler 200i- the knob in the seat, it hits you right in the butt/lower back. The guy who test rode the scooter before got bounced up and landed on the knob. I luckily didn't have that happen to me but that knob made it really hard to get comfortable. When you slide back to stretch your legs that knob sticks into you back. The knob is bolted in so it can be removed, but that leaves two holes in the seat you have to fill. I'm not exaggerating when I say that the seat is going to cost Genuine sales. The guy who had a test ride before be was seriously interested in buying but the seat put him off from buying. I hope they come out with a different seat.


The Rattler 200i test ride has made me curious how the Urbano 200i rides. It should have similar performance but without the knob in the seat.

The knob-

[JBeasty]

I couldn't resist this little scooter, so I got one yesterday - seat bump and all! I have the "hockey puck" removed and put a couple black plastic hole plugs in there till I figure out a better solution. With the puck removed you can slide back further, but you still contact the hard plastic recess that is left in it's place. It's much better, but I think some surgery will be needed. Why did they put this tumor there!! Aside from the seat, I have no complaints. This is my first scooter, so I have nothing to compare it to (other than my motorcycles) - but it's a blast to ride. Can't wait til it's fully broken in. I've been keeping it under 40 mph, and < 6000 rpm. It climbs right up all the steep hills in my neighborhood. The disc brakes are very good - possibly too good? This thing is so light it probably could get by with a drum in the back. Anyway, this is my first post - thought I would try to find a forum where I might find someone else who took on this little Beast. Or am I the lone Rattler 200i rider?
JB

[scootERIK]

am I the lone Rattler 200i rider?
JB

Maybe. You will have to let us know how it runs once you get the engine fully broken in and top speed and MPGs.

[JBeasty]

...and the seat sorted. I would post pics, but I haven't figured that out yet.

[JBeasty]

Trying to figure out how to post pics...
Here's one of the seat with the puck removed with temporary plugs in the holes.

[JBeasty]

I now have the seat taken apart, and the puck mount removed. I have lots more pics of the process, if anyone is interested.
Here is the offending mount on the seat pan that pokes you in the butt:

Here is with the mount removed (cut off):

[JBeasty]

Got the hole plugged up:

[JBeasty]

Took it to an Upholstery shop and had it recovered:




Success! Went for a 25 mile ride in comfort. I now have the whole seat to move around on. This is how they should have sold this scooter to begin with. Maybe someone with Genuine will see this and take note.

[scootERIK]

That looks way more comfortable then how it came, nice work.

[JBeasty]

That looks way more comfortable then how it came, nice work.

Thanks! It wasn't very expensive either.

[JBeasty]

Got a wind screen and phone holder for Christmas. Took a chance on a Puig 'Traffic' screen and lucked out. Now I can do a top speed run using the phone's GPS (need to do the first oil change first).

[JBeasty]

First performance report. I did my first engine oil change and gear oil change at 200 miles yesterday. Took it for a ride today and had it briefly going 62 mph on a level road (per phone GPS). It'll go faster I think, I'll push it more when I've got more miles on it. I didn't check what the bikes speedo was reading at 62, but it was about 3-4 MPH faster than actual speed at 30. Filled up today at 230 miles, and I'm getting 79mpg. Maybe it'll improve as it continues to break-in. The windscreen made a significant improvement in this cold weather.

[jrsjr]

Hot Damn! That's what I'm talking about, right there!!!
Great Job, JBeasty!
Thanks for the report(s).

[JBeasty]

Took it on the highway for the first time today, and had it pegged doing 66 mph (on level, phone gps). RPM's were 8500+. I think that's probably about it. Aside from screaming the engine, the semi dirt tires are a bit sketchy at that speed. It's a lot happier doing 50-55.

[JBeasty]

Filled up the tank today, 82 mpg. Still only have ~325miles on it.

[scootERIK]

THEY FIXED THE SEAT!!!* I might have to go take one of these out for another test ride once this new seat is out. Also, I wonder if dealers will be able to get these so they can upgrade the Rattlers will the old seat.

*I am hoping they didn't just make the cover go over the holes for the knob, I can't find any pictures of the bottom of the new seat to see if they fixed it properly.

[Kaos]

I had to go look up the specs on this thing, as I didn't realize Genuine was releasing a Rattler 200i! I was a bit disappointed to see they're fudging their numbers a bit. When I see 200i I expect it to be around 200cc. 168cc doesn't seem like a 200 to me, this APPEARS to be the same engine they put in the Buddy 170i. Not that thats a bad thing, but it would have been nice to see the branding reflect that... Anyway... Carry on, rant over

[JBeasty]

THEY FIXED THE SEAT!!!* I might have to go take one of these out for another test ride once this new seat is out. Also, I wonder if dealers will be able to get these so they can upgrade the Rattlers will the old seat.

*I am hoping they didn't just make the cover go over the holes for the knob, I can't find any pictures of the bottom of the new seat to see if they fixed it properly.

I saw that!
Geez, I've been off here for a long time. Still zipping around on this thing and enjoying it. I take it on the highway most rides now. Just a few miles/exits to get where I'm going. It does just fine doing 60-65 for short distances, even on slight upgrades. The tires aren't great at that speed though. Thinking of getting a more street bias tires.