Modern Buddy

Crank output vs. at the rear wheel power readings?

sc00ter wrote: ↑Thu Jun 27, 2024 12:23 pm Crank output vs. at the rear wheel power readings?

Let's take 24.5hp as their "at the crank" number. Without muddying the math too much, let's use the standard "15%" value to represent the drivetrain loss.

24.5 x (1.00 - .15) = 20.825

Close enough to Piaggio's "21hp" reported value.

Addendum: I know that 15% is not a authoritative value when accurately calculating power loss, but we lack the scoot and a dyno to nail that value down better. I'd argue that in this case, it helps to ID the measurement point of the reported power output and when we're dealing with such low horsepower values, further accuracy would be lost as a rounding error.

My guess is different companies using different dynos or different testing methods.

But it's more fun to hope that the Keeway will be a 25.5 horsepower 320 pound(dry) scooter than will smoke a Vespa 300 for $2,500 less.

It looks like Keeway is getting close to getting their scooter out in the US, the US website- https://www.keeway.com/us-en/products/sixties-300i

Two big things I see, the starting price of $3,978* and they still have it listed at 19kw(~25.5hp.) A small thing I saw was they added another color.

I just saw an article on the Keeyway Vieste 300 XDV, https://www.msn.com/en-us/autos/autos-l ... r-BB1pRHvs It looks like a pretty nice scooter, to my eye is looks like a Honda ADV 150/160 but with what looks like a Vespa clone engine. In the article it says the engine puts out 25.8hp.

I pulled up the Vieste 300 XDV(non USA model) and the Sixties 300i specs and all the engine specs match, Displacement, Bore x Stroke, Power, Max. torque, Compression ratio. That leads me to believe there is a possibility the Sixties 300i is actually putting out the ~25.5hp. There is a U.S.A. Viesta 300 that puts out 14kw(~19hp) but it's not the XDV model.

A quick search shows one dealer on Cycletrader has one for sale, or at least presale, at $5,299. I would go take a look but it's in Luling, TX and that's over 1,000 miles away.

EDIT: June 15th there is a dealer in Florida that has them in stock at $4,600.

And I complain about 100 miles for a purchase/service! That 1000 miles would NEVER happen for me! I still hold out hope that my only "listed" Keeway dealer gets a Sixties in stock. I really need to email them one day and ask.

I have a co-worker that traveled almost halfway across the country to buy his daughter a mint, no crash damage low miles sports car. A Nissan 350Z thing. Anyways, he does all this driving and hauls it back on a trailer only for her to cut it up and lower it so low it's almost undrivable. No air ride, just a ugly static drop with the dumb 45 degree wheels. I would have just got her a high miles branded title one from a corner car lot. Oh well, his money and time, not mine.

Keeway America has added 2 more dealers in my area. One is in NC and not far from my pinball arcade getaway. The other is on the way to my work! I might either stop on the way to work or slip out from work and verify this rumor.

So I stop in my local,recently announced, Keeway dealer and strange looks! No one had any idea what I was talking about. I showed them their name on the dealer list and still, nothing. So that dealer was a waste of time. But this is also a good thing. This is the same dealer who is a "Authorized Piaggio Service Center" that doesn't know how to use the P.A.D.S. diagnostic computer. All they did when I brought my Liberty in was rest the ECU. The problem I took it in for quickly came back. They then wanted to replace the ECU, fuel pump, injector and something else. Yeah right, you stupid clowns. Learn to use the computer!

If I find they sell the Sixties 300i at the dealer by my pinball spot I still might pass. The dealer is around 70 miles away from my home. I never found a paper service manual or even a thumb drive service manual for the Keeway either. Why are all the neat things a hassle?

sc00ter wrote: ↑Sat Aug 10, 2024 1:25 pmIf I find they sell the Sixties 300i at the dealer by my pinball spot I still might pass. The dealer is around 70 miles away from my home. I never found a paper service manual or even a thumb drive service manual for the Keeway either. Why are all the neat things a hassle?

For right now I just want to sit on one for 5 minutes to see if the riding position is decent. If it turns out to be comfortable I would still wait awhile to see what other owners think and to see how reliable they are. I'm waiting to hear from a US Royal Alloy owner who has over 10k on their scooter.

Oh, I still hope to see one in person and get to at least get to sit on one. A test ride would probably seal a sale with me, but that's if it fits me well. If I buy one (either a Royal Alloy or Sixties) it will be more for fun, weekend type riding. I'll keep the Buddy 125 for commuting no matter what. I still suffer pains from selling the powder blue Buddy 125 we used to have. That was the scooter my wife had the Tow-Pac installed on. Life isn't complete without the humble little Buddy in the garage.

I discovered that I have a Royal Enfield dealer in the area now. The Continental GT is dreamy! Heck, almost all of the Royal Enfields are nice looking! But if given a choice it will always be scooters first. I like motorcycles but love scoots.

I can now say that a Royal Alloy 300 will easily smoke a Buddy 125 in a drag race. The 300 pulls harder off the line and has a good lead by 20 feet and then it really starts pulling away.

A member of the local scooter club has one and got some TG body work from overseas-

That looks nice with the different panels! But what catches my eye the most? A REAR RACK!! You really need to get some info on this Royal Alloy for both of us who are interested in one. Please!

If you look close he also has a large storage bag installed where the glovebox used to be, it's the black thing in the picture. It's about the size of a 10" tire.

Here's a better picture of the bag-

I am very curious what is going on with the RA 300- is it selling out so fast dealers can't keep them in stock, or are the dealers not getting any to sell, or are dealers just not ordering them? I did a nation wide search on cycletrader . com and there are only three available from one dealer in Ohio.

My semi-local dealer only ever had 1 in stock to my knowledge, and once it sold that was it. No, make that 2. A white one when they first got released and a burgundy/off-white after the white one sold. I know they said colorful things about the air-cooled 150 version, so maybe they avoided ordering more because of that models reliability? I half considered a RA before getting the PCX and I didn't see any in-stock even remotely close to me. A few left-over 150's but no 300's. I don't know any dealers that would give me a honest answer to that question concerning a 300. I do know my local Genuine dealer avoids stocking certain other brands because the manufacturer tries to charge him $500 or more PER scooter to ship them, even if he orders more than one (SYM was the brand he gave the example of.) I've never seen the Royal Alloy 300 in person so aside from the one I inquired about, but never did go see, I've yet to still see one in person. I did see the 150 in person though.

i'd be curious how reliable they are over time...could be a good option vs a 300cc vespa as far as pricing goes ~$6k vs $9.5k...i really dislike the look of the stationary front wheel fender though...if the rack can hold more than the buddy it may be something i look at

Point37 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 10, 2025 3:52 pm i'd be curious how reliable they are over time...

I know of one with over ~6,000 miles and someone did the scooter Cannonball on one but that doesn't tell us how they will do over the long haul. I do over 10k a year so I need a durable and reliable scooter. If I knew the 300 could do over 50k without needing a rebuild I would probably have gotten one already.

I am confident the rear rack of the RA is stronger than the Buddy.

scootERIK wrote: ↑Mon Mar 10, 2025 4:26 pm

Point37 wrote: ↑Mon Mar 10, 2025 3:52 pm i'd be curious how reliable they are over time...

I know of one with over ~6,000 miles and someone did the scooter Cannonball on one but that doesn't tell us how they will do over the long haul. I do over 10k a year so I need a durable and reliable scooter. If I knew the 300 could do over 50k without needing a rebuild I would probably have gotten one already.

I am confident the rear rack of the RA is stronger than the Buddy.

thanks, good to know...i just don't know enough about the RA line...i also don't ride enough to justify making a jump to another scooter at the moment...i figured about the rear rack...the buddy capacity is pitiful so i figured anything else would be better...not sure why they haven't redesigned that aspect of the scooter to fix this issue

Royal Alloy is the trade name for the scoot, it's made in China by Hanway. They acquired the chassis design from Scomadi, a British firm that was trying to bring the classic Lambretta shape into the 21st century. Scomadi contracted Hanway to build the scooters, shenanigans happened, there was a court case and now we have Royal Alloy to show for it.

az_slynch wrote: ↑Thu Mar 13, 2025 11:54 pm Royal Alloy is the trade name for the scoot, it's made in China by Hanway. They acquired the chassis design from Scomadi, a British firm that was trying to bring the classic Lambretta shape into the 21st century. Scomadi contracted Hanway to build the scooters, shenanigans happened, there was a court case and now we have Royal Alloy to show for it.

great info...thanks!...so may not be as reliable as the Taiwanese Genuine/PGO brand?

The RA 300's have a strong following in Europe. I've watched a bunch of reviews (Tony's Garage is the best!) and they (RA 300's) seem to be very reliable. My reason for passing was initial lack of on scoot storage (since rectified) and lack of reliable servicing should I need it. Shame as a 300cc scooter sounds MUCH more fun than my current 160cc scooter, but this is how it played out for me.

As I get older I find myself dreading doing some servicing. I would rather just pay someone nowadays. That being said I would like another hobby scoot (not a daily) so you never know. The good thing about a RA over a modern GTS is the RA is MUCH simpler. It uses a regular OBD 2 scanner, no chipped key nonsense and the motor is very popular and supported. Plus I think the RA looks great for a modern Lammy clone.

sc00ter wrote: ↑Sat Mar 15, 2025 1:52 pm The RA 300's have a strong following in Europe. I've watched a bunch of reviews (Tony's Garage is the best!) and they (RA 300's) seem to be very reliable. My reason for passing was initial lack of on scoot storage (since rectified) and lack of reliable servicing should I need it. Shame as a 300cc scooter sounds MUCH more fun than my current 160cc scooter, but this is how it played out for me.

As I get older I find myself dreading doing some servicing. I would rather just pay someone nowadays. That being said I would like another hobby scoot (not a daily) so you never know. The good thing about a RA over a modern GTS is the RA is MUCH simpler. It uses a regular OBD 2 scanner, no chipped key nonsense and the motor is very popular and supported. Plus I think the RA looks great for a modern Lammy clone.

thanks...if i end up finding one of these used i may end up trading up...i like simple, supported, easy to maintain, reliable and lower cost...also why i picked up the genuine buddy 125...wanted a vespa 300 but couldn't find a well priced used one at the time and i couldn't justify the cost of a new one vs just getting a motorcycle