Buddy 150 Power Up

[az_slynch]

I've had an '08 Pamplona 150 for a few months now. I originally picked it up for a friend as a beater/loaner, but it had a salvage title and I didn't want my name affiliated with a sketchy scoot that a new rider was learning on...the liability was a bit unnerving.

So, I helped him buy a beater non-op '08 St. Tropez, debugged it and got it back to good running order.

Now, I'm turning my attention to the Pamplona. Keeping it, but I'm going to hot-rod it a bit. Not quite Voodoo stuff, but just to make it a bit different that my "dealer special" '09 St. Tropez.

Today, the wheels came off. Literally. Adios to the crispy old Shinkos, it'll be receiving a fresh pair of 100/90-10 Pirelli Angels this weekend.

Last day on whitewalls.

Clean, but crispy.

HoverBuddy. I have too many projects right now.

BTW, it wasn't nearly this clean to begin with. The bodywork has been replaced. Rear is off eBay, front is from ScooterLounge.

[az_slynch]

Initial parts list is:

• NCY 171cc big bore cylinder

• NCY Big Valve head

• NCY "A8" Camshaft

• Keihin CVK 26mm carburetor

• NCY CDI (recurved and unrestricted)

• Polini Maxi-Speed Variator kit

• Polini Maxi Speed clutch and clutch bell kit

• NCY Secondary Sliding Sheave Assembly Added later.

The engine has a bit over 12K miles on it, so I will go through it with critical eye before I start slapping parts on. It did run fine after setting the valves properly and fixing the stock carb, but I want to be sure it'll hold up to a bit more hot sauce.

[sc00ter]

I'm following this build!

[az_slynch]

I decided against white-lettering the Angels. The Pirelli logo doesn't follow the tire arc and the angel "A" is a bit too fussy to read easily. If I swap to Michelin Pilot Street tires at some point, I'll use the Tire Ink to dress 'em up.

Fresh kicks.

The variator arrived today. Looking forward to testing this clutch, as it can be adjusted without tearing down the rear pulley. I've worked with the NCY SuperTrans stuff in the past on a Vino, but preferred how the Polini setup worked for putting down engine power.

Parts cache.

I bought a used flywheel to have it lightened, but it seems it has a ding in the puller threads. May just have to bite the bullet and get a new flywheel. Not sure if it will work as well as the lightening on my friend's Zuma 50 and Angry Buddy did, but I like to idea of being able to spin the engine faster without having to get really light on the weights.

Used flywheel.

D'oh!

Waiting on some small parts from ScooterLounge, but nothing that would delay the rebuild. Engine has 12K on it, so I am considering splitting the block and checking everything before souping it up. I might settle for a borescope camera inspection to save time and money, but if anything looks fishy on the cam chain or guides, the engine gets a teardown.

Working out of town next week, but I did sort out the Zuma that was darkening my doorstep so I can get going on this or the Malaguti.

[nobade]

Looks like a fun project. I'm watching with interest!

[tenders]

Are you concerned that the flywheel thread ding will unbalance the flywheel - or are you more concerned about the integrity of the threads? I would think the threads would clean up well enough with a tap and maybe some JB Weld, though not many have a tap that size sitting around.

[az_slynch]

Are you concerned that the flywheel thread ding will unbalance the flywheel - or are you more concerned about the integrity of the threads? I would think the threads would clean up well enough with a tap and maybe some JB Weld, though not many have a tap that size sitting around.

I wasn't worried about balance, I was more worried about being able to thread a flywheel puller into it. And yes, an M27x1 left-hand thread is a tough tap to come by.

The good news is that I spent time with some picks and hobby files and cleaned the thread up until I could run a flywheel puller down and seat it fully. Next steps are to weigh it, compare it to the CVT assembly weight and get it turned down some.

[az_slynch]

Minor update. My usual resource for lightening scooter flywheels was unavailable, so I turned to my local machinist to see if he knows a local resource who could balance the flywheel after lightening it. We weighed the flywheel this morning to figure out how much to take off. Starting weight was 2.25lbs, or approximately 1020gr.

High tech here. I should've taken the picture straight-on to show the correct weight.

When I had the Buddy 50's flywheel lightened, we took about 12% of the mass off the flywheel, so I opted to aim for a similar value. Dropping a quarter pound, or about 113 grams off the flywheel nets an 11% reduction in mass.

I understand that there are lightened GY6 flywheels available, but I prefer modding a PGO flywheel as it's welded to the hub rather than being riveted.

Hoping to have it back after Christmas. In the interim, I'll be pulling the engine this weekend to check the internals out.

[az_slynch]

Spent most of the weekend sick, but I did get to the task at hand: pulling the engine.

This job isn't so hard if you have a lift or a workshop. If not, one of those cheapie Amazon scissor lifts is just the ticket to pulling the engine in your shop or your front yard. I opted for the latter, as I have other stuff on the lift.

An essential step specific to the 150 and 170 is to disconnect the oil cooler lines. On the 150, they run up and over the center stand and will impede engine removal. To make life easier, drain the engine oil first.

Due to the location of the engine hanger, you will need to remove the air filter housing, rear inner fender (also frees the rear brake cable if properly installed), the carburetor and the intake manifold. The latter two will foul on the middle of the engine hanger and the presence of the center stand limits your wiggle room too.

Next steps will be to inspect the engine without totally tearing it down to determine if I should do so to refresh things like the cam chain and cam chain guides.

And now, pics or it didn't happen:

Gear oil looked good. Engine oil, not so much.

Everything except the oil cooler, shock and engine hanger are disconnected.

Cooler lines are a pain to remove. Use a 12mm spanner through the center stand.

Scissor lift makes removal easy!

Gotta remove the intake manifold.

Engine out!

[sc00ter]

Thanks for posting the how-to on engine removal! Whats funny about you posting this update is my wife was just fussing at me for not having any ongoing projects or more complicated interest. With the ebikes I can get in and out of them in around a hour. Not the most complicated things to mod. I have no idea what I'd get or what I want to do for a project.

My silly side looked for a P200E but prices have gotten crazy for nice ones. Granted I know what "You get what you pay for." means but still, I have a number in my head that I refuse to go over.

[az_slynch]

Thanks for posting the how-to on engine removal! Whats funny about you posting this update is my wife was just fussing at me for not having any ongoing projects or more complicated interest. With the ebikes I can get in and out of them in around a hour. Not the most complicated things to mod. I have no idea what I'd get or what I want to do for a project.

My silly side looked for a P200E but prices have gotten crazy for nice ones. Granted I know what "You get what you pay for." means but still, I have a number in my head that I refuse to go over.

Too bad your scoot is still under warranty; I stumbled across a "stupid" thing to do to the Sunset 125...still not Kaos-level stuff, but it's definitely got more potential than this setup. That said, this wasn't too crazy on price. I already had the cam, but the stack of parts was cheaper than the trashed-out Pamplona.

E-bikes are intriguing, but I want to go deeper on stuff. I'm dangerous with a soldering iron, I did invest in a battery lug welder and I've bought a few books / participated in crowdfunding for a few things. The speed/acceleration reminds me of a roller coaster. I think I'll have to really dig into chassis dynamics in order to really enjoy them.

For now, I see the writing on the wall for ICE. I figure I'll indulge in a few projects I wish I'd tried sooner.

You can get a decent project for non-stupid money if you make some connections. NSM on MV is a good start. Get familiar with the Bodgespotting and Deal O' The Day threads. There are still affordable survivors out there!

[az_slynch]

Pulled the top end today. Overall, not a bad job. Did need to use a shot mallet to tap the cylinder free. Biggest PITA was carefully removing the remnants of the cylinder base gasket.

It looks pretty healthy for an almost 13K mile engine. Cylinder walls looked great. No evidence of blow-by around the rings. Cam lobes and rocker arms looked decent. Cam chain guides were healthy and un-marred. Only two things bothered me:

• The cam chain seems like it has a lot of stretch in it.

• The piston pin had some odd wear and didn't slide out without a little persuasion.

Not sure if either of those items are a cause for alarm. The small end of the conrod looks great and the new pin slides through easy as you please. The engine wasn't rattling before, so maybe the cam chain still has some miles in it? I hope so, since replacing it means splitting the crankcase.

Time to start unboxing parts. I already see a few things I forgot to order (cam chain tensioner gasket, O-ring for intake manifold) and I'm sure there are other bits to bite me later.

And now, the pics:

Cam gallery looks decent.

Rockers aren't new, but don't have any odd wear.

Cam lobes don't have any odd wear.

Looks very rich.

[az_slynch]

More pics. My gut check says that this scoot went long on an oil change a time or two...

Plug agrees on running rich. This was probably related to the carb issue.

Piston's got a solid carbon coat

Bore is healthy with clear crosshatch.

Piston is clean. The pin looks odd.

Small end of conrod looks great!

Dunno about the cam chain. Seems a bit stretched.

[az_slynch]

Well, the garage door broke on Christmas Eve and no local shops had all the parts needed to fix it. All sorted as of this morning, so back to the Buddy!

After checking the lateral play in a new D.I.D. cam chain for another Honda, I decided the Buddy's cam chain was still serviceable and proceeded with de-gunking the block and installing the new top end.

Only real fiddly part was the oil ring. Be sure the spacer is on before installing the wiping rings and ensure it doesn't pop apart on compression. I set up the ring gaps per the Genuine service manual.

Getting the cam set up was a lot easier than an old horizontal Honda or a Yamaha Vino.

I still need a gasket for the cam tensioner and a seal for the intake manifold. Consider getting new rocker arms and tappet screws, but that might be overkill of my part. I could load the engine in the scoot for now and swap those parts when they come in...I'll make a decision later today.

Considering ordering Taida 14/39 gears for the rear end. It's a 9% upgear and could help the Pamplona hit an honest 70mph. That'll be a decision to make once the engine is broken in.

NCY 61mm cylinder installed.

NCY Big Valve Head for 61mm bore installed.

Cam gear oriented for TDC.

Crankshaft aligned with case pointer for TDC.

[az_slynch]

Started on the CVT teardown last night. The good news is that it was surprisingly clean inside. The clutch bell had no built-up dust and the clutch shoes looked good for the mileage. The driven sheaves were in decent condition as well, albeit a bit lacking in grease for the sliding sheave and guide pins.

The variator and fixed driving sheave looked good initially, but upon closer inspection, they have wear ridges on their faces. The belt showed a bit of fraying on the edges from running in high-range so often.

I'm going to add a fixed sheave to my Genuine parts order. I'm also considering getting the NCY rear sheave, as it has multiple ramp profiles and would make for better downshifting and acceleration out of corners. I'm already looking at two more weeks for parts, so this feels like an "in for a penny, in for a pound" situation.

I picked up a Forsa 280mm rear shock (part # 169-208) to replace the stock unit. The original was showing signs of asymmetric wear, which had me wondering if it had gotten bent one of the times that the scoot was dumped. I've read good things about the Forsa unit, so hopefully it works well in this application too.

CVT open.

Healthy clutch

Surprisingly clean clutch bell.

Ready for new parts!

Ridges on the variator.

Weird wear on the rear shock.

[az_slynch]

Currently waiting on parts from ScooterLounge and NCY Store. Hoping to pick back up with this next week.

Genuine doesn't sell to intake O-ring separately from the manifold. Measurements say it's a 27mm x 2mm O-ring, so I'll be sourcing that separately.

Here's that fancy rear shock. Wish I had options for the front fork still.

Forsa gas rear shock.

[az_slynch]

Parts came in earlier in the week, but work and personal commitments had me tied up until this evening. Back to the Buddy!

First task was to pull the camshaft support and install new rocker arms. I needed a 5mm bolt to remove the rocker shafts. The exhaust side required a bit more effort to extract; I ended up chucking it up in the drill and polishing it with 1000-grit paper before fitting the new rocker arm. Once the new rockers were fitted and coated with assembly lube, I refitted the cam support and torqued the head bolts to spec. The valves were set to .08 mm (.003 in) and the cam tensioner was temporarily fitted. I rolled the engine over a few times to check for any tight spots or binding. Thankfully, everything moved smoothly.

I'm missing two bits still: the intake O-ring and a timing chain tensioner gasket. The gasket for the Buddy 125 and the 150 are not the same. The 125 gasket looks more like a Honda-style part, while the 150 gasket looks like a standard GY6 part.

I put a new seal on the valve cover and reinstalled it. Installed new intake and exhaust studs too.

The 14/39 gears I bought will not work in a Buddy. The toothed sections are too wide, though the rest of the features appear to be dimensionally similar. The Buddy rear axle spline is larger in diameter that a standard GY6 shaft too; more research is in order if I want an upgear. I suspect it is more like the final drive of my Kymco Yager than a garden-variety GY6. Since I was in there, I cleaned the gearbox out and fitted a fresh gasket.

I'll work on building the CVT up tomorrow evening after my other obligations.

Pics, of course:

New rocker arms.

Lubed and ready to install.

Stud installer tools are pretty handy.

Right tools for setting valves.

Clean gearbox.Gasket remnants were removed before reassembly.

[az_slynch]

Had time to work on the Buddy last night, so I got these items done:

• Torqued the final drive housing bolts to spec.

• Unpacked the NCY secondary sheave and set it up to use the more aggressive ramps.

• Installed the Polini clutch and blue torque spring on the NCY sheave. Left the clutch settings at factory 4500RPM engagement for now.

• Lubricated and assembled the Polini Maxi Speed variator.

• Installed the variator and driven sheave assembly with a fresh Bando belt and a new PGO fixed drive sheave,

• Installed the Polini Maxi Speed clutch bell, pushed the belt down the ensure it wasn't binding the variator and torqued both bolts to spec.

• Checked the CVT cover fit, cleaned up the guide pins and the kickstart shaft.

Hoping the tensioner gasket and intake O-ring arrive on or before Saturday. I'd like to reinstall the engine this coming weekend. Meanwhile, I'm going to do some math and figure out which main jet to start tuning with. Leaning towards a 105, since Treats didn't have a 102 when I ordered.

Setting up the NCY sheave. Aggressive ramp on the left, stock style ramp on the right. Roller pins have been removed and fitted in the aggressive ramp.

Installing the clutch and torque spring.

Assembling the variator.

CVT install complete. Rolled it over a few times with everything torqued to properly seat the belt.

[az_slynch]

The gaskets and seals may arrive tomorrow. They shipped from the St. Louis area last Tuesday and are taking the scenic route here. Now the wait will be for a replacement fan. A friend brought his two St. Tropez down for help today and one needed a fan replacement. Oddly, a crankcase bolt had worked loose and dabbed into the fan. I straightened the bolt with soft jaws and a shot mallet before reinstalling with Loctite 222. Wasn't going to start pulling my case bolts for that!

Flywheel is still waiting for machining and balancing. I'll just load the engine back in the scoot for now and swap it out later.

The second St. Tropez is staying over this week while I work out a few bugs. Only 2400 miles on the clock and it needed a carb rebuild, fuel system cleaning, new tap and new filter. Air box was full of baby walnuts, so some squirrel up in Phoenix is probably quite distressed about now. Biggest bummer was that the accelerator pump arm was snapped off. Subbed in my refurbed Pamplona 24mm carb, but the scoot is sluggish and struggles to hit 50. The rear sheave was sticking due to dried lubricant. Probably going to do some mild mods to the CVT during rebuild and give the carb a more critical look over.

Can't wait to hand it back faster, and then pit the Pamplona against it.

[az_slynch]

Second St. Tropez was sorted over lunchtime today. Did a budget CVT tune, with a NCY sliding sheave($37), black 1000RPM NCY torque spring ($15) and a set of 10gr NCY rollers ($20). Takeoff is much improved. I may need to tweak the accelerator pump arm a touch, but the scoot really scoots now!

Spent some time yesterday getting the cooling shrouds onto the new top end. The NCY head has an EGR casting that is unused, which doesn't align with the lower cooling shroud at all. I wound up using a pair of flush cuts and the hobby saw to trim the cowling to fit. Larger air gaps than I'd like, so I'll look into sealing solutions. Next time, I'd get a shroud that allows for that EGR boss, or grind it off so the PGO cowl fits.

Modified cooling shroud.

Loaded the engine back in the chassis this afternoon. Slotting the engine back into the mounting bracket required a bit of fettling with a breaker bar. The rubber mount on the CVT side has been peened into position, so any adjustment would have to happen on the stator side mount.

Engine reinstalled.

Mounted the Forsa shock and the intake manifold. The isolator spacer and the gasket have a smaller opening than the head. This might need to be opened up later or I need to find a more open manifold.

Forsa shock fitted

Tomorrow, I'm going to test the modded keyswitch on the Buddy 170i, the get right back on this project. I still need to install the oil cooler, install the wheels and muffler, install the correct jets in the carb (pending arrival), fit the carb and air box, fill the engine and gearbox oil, reinstall the battery and fuel it up.

Oil cooler cleaned and ready for a new filter

So close to first start! Then the fine tuning begins!

[sc00ter]

All this tuning talk made me send az-slynch a PM! Looking fast by the way!

[az_slynch]

Jets arrived this morning. I would have been annoyed about the delay, but I think it helped.

When I fitted the intake manifold, I commented that the intake gasket and spacer were smaller than the port on the cylinder head. Thinking about the problem a bit more, I suspected this could cause a performance issue if the inner diameter of the manifold was smaller in diameter than the carburetor venturi. I took some measurements and found the port diameter in the head was 28mm, vs 24mm for the stock manifold.

I did some parts hunting and ordered a 28mm intake manifold without the EGR connection. I also sourced a couple of gasket and spacer kits with a 28mm bore diameter. While the carb venturi is only 26mm, it should meter fuel more efficiently and offer improved throttle response. Those parts will arrive on Thursday.

I want to fire it up, but I'm also grateful to be slowed down. It's helping me catch those little details that will help me net the best outcome.

[az_slynch]

Just an update so y'all know I didn't just bail on the documentation. Waiting for a different set of 28mm intake gaskets and phenolic spacers for the Buddy. The ones I had ordered have a weird offset for the intake studs and didn't line up correctly. The correct ones should be in by the 20th.

NCY "teflon coated" manifold claims to be 28mm in diameter, but according to my Mitutoyo calipers, it's only 26mm at the base of the mounting flange. Rats! Without machining it to match, I suspect that's as good as it's going to get. At least it's less restrictive than the stocker. Teflon coating on an intake seems counterintuitive, but I'm not keen to damage the finish just to port match things perfectly. The other gotcha is that the rubber coupler for the carb is a good 15mm (a bit more than 1/2") longer than the stock manifold. Not sure if this will impact the carburetor install yet, but I'm sure it will at least complicate the air filter hose fitting. Might have to pull the filter casing every time I want to check on the carb, or I may need to make a set of brackets to move the filter casing backwards a bit. More food for thought when planning to hop up your Buddy...take notes and save yourself a headache!

Big thanks to sc00ter, who sent me a NCY/Prima exhaust to slip on this thing. I was avoiding the shiny Prima pipe for the scoot because of the attention it draws, but this NCY/Prima is low-key and close in appearance to a stock pipe. Looking forward to trying it out.

Just wading through that last 10% and looking over bits of the scoot that I'd previously ignored to while the shipping time away.

[sc00ter]

Glad that Box 'o Junk worked out for you. Should be able to resell the old shiny stainless Prima pretty easy. They sound great and look nice if you like flashy!

[az_slynch]

The correct 28mm intake spacer and gaskets have arrived. I thought I was ordering two, but the parcel showed up with ten, plus two cheesy aluminum bottles openers. If someone needs a spacer for a big intake manifold, PM me, I got u.

28mm gasket and isolator on top, stock 24mm parts on bottom.

I'd been screwing around with an '84 Riva 80 (CV80L) while waiting for the Buddy parts. I bought the scoot fifteen years ago and set it aside due to a lack of time and a worry about unobtainable parts. It had gotten tucked in an odd corner of my buddy's backyard. Stuff got piled behind it and his '89 Zuma and then the grass went feral, so they were forgotten about until we were cleaning up the place for him to freshen it up and rent it. Parts are no less uncommon today then they were back then, so I'm ordering parts and refurbishing what I can. This old Riva really puts it into perspective how far scoots have come and how nice it is to work on a Buddy!

'84 Yamaha CV80L

[sc00ter]

A Beluga! I would have focused on the Zuma myself. All I remember about the Beluga is:

The carb was on the weird side.

Not that fast for a 2-stroke 80. I raced a Elite 80 though and pulled away!

I gave mine to a friends dad for a parts scoot. I think the guy passed on as I've never see his on the road anymore.

I gave away the panels to someone on the Beluga forum before giving up on it. That's a good resource site though.

I had a real deal paper Yamaha service manual but my garage roof leaked and soaked it. I was not happy.

That's a weird color. All I've seen is red. Mine was spray bombed black.

Keep us updated on saving the whale! I always loved the Beluga name instead of the USA's Riva name.

[az_slynch]

Well, bugger.

About three posts back, I commented about the NCY manifold being about 15mm longer than the stocker. I wondered if it was going to impact the installation and now I know it does.

The carburetor's accelerator pump fouls on the engine mount casting and prevents installation.

I had initially tried fitting the carb after installing the manifold with no luck. Then I removed the manifold and fitted the carb to it, but it still wouldn't fit. I thought for a moment that the engine angle might be too extreme due to the rear shock, so I unbolted the shock and used a jack to tilt the engine forward. The carb/manifold combo still won't fit on.

Carb/manifold length comparison.

I could look at a carburetor without an accelerator pump, or maybe add a riser to move it up higher. I suspect the latter would foul on the storage box. Another idea that comes to mind would be to ditch the rubber coupling, shorten the intake neck and use a bit of turbo hose to move the carb closer to the neck; I might be able to get 6-10mm back if executed properly.

This is decidedly becoming less plug 'n play, but I hope it's making the process clear to others thinking of souping up their Buddy.

[az_slynch]

Took the intake to my machinist on Tuesday. I'm having him turn the intake neck to take an additional 4mm off the body of the casting, then I'm having him turn the intake throat (the bit that fits into the rubber coupling) back about 8mm. The plan is to grind the locating ring off the inside of the rubber coupler in the intake side, shorten the coupler by 4mm on the intake side and then bond it to the intake using 3M 1300L High Performance Rubber Adhesive. This won't totally solve the intake spacing problem, but it will make the assembly more compact.

Let's tear it up!

When discussing the problem with my machinist, I noticed a second annoying problem: when set on a flat surface with the intake coupler removed, it becomes apparent that the Buddy intake is physically taller than the NCY one. The Buddy intake is dimensionally similar from the mounting flange on down but is at least 1/4" taller when viewed by looking down the intake bore.

Height difference.

I've ordered an intake riser with a 28mm bore (and height) to evaluate and see if I find the sweet spot for carb positioning. I suspect there will be more part butchering, but getting the intake tract right is important if I want the best performance from the top-end upgrades.

[az_slynch]

Got my parts back from the machinist. The intake was modded by turning 4mm off the back of the inlet side, then the boot mating surface was shortened by 8mm. I ground off the locating rib on the inside of the boot and made sure it sat snugly against the casting.

Height was addressed with a PRO BLD, aka Rolling Wrench 28mm ID spacer. Normal height is also 28mm, but is was sectioned in two with a band saw and the cuts were surfaced in a mill for two 13mm tall spacers.

Side profile.

Top profile.

Inlet side.

The fit-up will be a lot closer now, as seen in the photos. I need to get some 15mm longer intake bolts now (M6-65mm) and figure out a way to seal the cylinder shroud now. The 3M bonding agent was delayed in transit, so ETA is now Wednesday. Grump.

[az_slynch]

Well, nuts. Even with the riser and the shortened intake, it's still fouling on the engine mount. I even added the gasket and phenolic spacer to get a few more millimeters of height, but no dice. Tried closing the carb lid on the underseat bucket, and it's just touching the top of the carb.

Carb sits high, but still hits the engine hanger.

Ordered another riser for good measure. I think this is going to end up needing a 3D printed spacer for the carb cover. Not loving the fact that it'll need 75mm (~3in) bolts to hold the intake on, but I want to see this through now.Might get a new manifold too, so I can see if this can be plug 'n play with the riser and a carb cover spacer.

Perhaps I need a spacer. Or a hole saw.

Guess I could also grab a hole saw and turn the carb cover into a "shaker" hood!

[Point37]

Well, nuts. Even with the riser and the shortened intake, it's still fouling on the engine mount. I even added the gasket and phenolic spacer to get a few more millimeters of height, but no dice. Tried closing the carb lid on the underseat bucket, and it's just touching the top of the carb.

Ordered another riser for good measure. I think this is going to end up needing a 3D printed spacer for the carb cover. Not loving the fact that it'll need 75mm (~3in) bolts to hold the intake on, but I want to see this through now.Might get a new manifold too, so I can see if this can be plug 'n play with the riser and a carb cover spacer.

Guess I could also grab a hole saw and turn the carb cover into a "shaker" hood!

is there any way to raise the whole under seat bucket a little higher?...i'd probably just hole saw it then use some https://instamorph.com/ to make a domed cap for the hole and glue/rivet it onto the rest of the carb flap cover...it's not visible so it just has to be functional, not pretty

[jw_buddy_150]

I've got a 2008 buddy italia 150 and was considering something like you are doing. Did you consider doing the EFI upgrade instead of using a carb? I wonder if that might have alleviated the fitment issue with the new carb.

Also, do you find the speedometer on these buddy to be massively inaccurate? When mine reads 50 mph it's actually closer to 30 via Waze GPS.

Thanks.

[az_slynch]

is there any way to raise the whole under seat bucket a little higher?...i'd probably just hole saw it then use some https://instamorph.com/ to make a domed cap for the hole and glue/rivet it onto the rest of the carb flap cover...it's not visible so it just has to be functional, not pretty

Interesting option. The bit I need to clarify is whether or not InstaMorpha is a thermoplastic or a thermoset. If the former, it won't work so well, as the heat in the engine bay might soften it again.

I'm looking into getting a spacer ring modeled to fit between the bottom of the box and the lid. If that works out, I'll share the link.

For now, I'm looking at the manifold and the spacer again. I have a full-height riser (28mm) to try, as well as a plan to shorten the intake about 4mm more. I'll try both options before I settle on the final fix.

[Point37]

is there any way to raise the whole under seat bucket a little higher?...i'd probably just hole saw it then use some https://instamorph.com/ to make a domed cap for the hole and glue/rivet it onto the rest of the carb flap cover...it's not visible so it just has to be functional, not pretty

Interesting option. The bit I need to clarify is whether or not InstaMorpha is a thermoplastic or a thermoset. If the former, it won't work so well, as the heat in the engine bay might soften it again.

I'm looking into getting a spacer ring modeled to fit between the bottom of the box and the lid. If that works out, I'll share the link.

For now, I'm looking at the manifold and the spacer again. I have a full-height riser (28mm) to try, as well as a plan to shorten the intake about 4mm more. I'll try both options before I settle on the final fix.

i thought about that later on in the day...instamorph is a plastic that you put a bunch of pellets in boiling water and they soften and then you can mold them...the thing is it's reusable so if you heat them up again they will soften again...with the heat from the engine it probably is not the best idea for this situation...i use this stuff quite often to repair things easily that i don't need to look pretty

[az_slynch]

I've got a 2008 buddy italia 150 and was considering something like you are doing. Did you consider doing the EFI upgrade instead of using a carb? I wonder if that might have alleviated the fitment issue with the new carb.

Also, do you find the speedometer on these buddy to be massively inaccurate? When mine reads 50 mph it's actually closer to 30 via Waze GPS.

Thanks.

I hadn't looked at an EFI option. The PGO solution is undesirable, as it is an open-loop system with no oxygen sensor. Not quite suitable for use if you change the air and fuel requirements of the engine. Ecotrons offers a decent tunable EFI kit for small engines, which might work. Could also grab other bikes EFI parts and use a Microsquirt system to control them.

For this one, I just want to distill it down to a simple recipe. Converting to EFI isn't something that the casual home-gamer may want to deal with.

The challenges I've encountered are all self-inflicted; I didn't consider the casting of the NCY big-valve head before starting the build, or I would have noticed the unused EGR casting that caused fitment problems for the cooling shroud. I could have bought a shroud with a provision for the EGR stub. With the intake, I expected the Buddy to use the same manifold as a GY6 and I have since learned otherwise. I suppose you could use the stock intake, but it limits your venturi size to 24mm when a 26mm would be more suitable for the new displacement and it has a big step between the manifold bore and the head (24mm vs 28mm) to screw up airflow characteristics.

I should have it solved within the week. After chatting with a friend on the aviation industry, I decided to change the bonding agent for the intake manifold from 3M 1300L to 3M 847. I'll revise the intake length this weekend and see if the carb fits without the full-height spacer. If not, I'll just run the scoot with the carb cover off until I get a lid spacer made.

I also wish I'd messed with a Buddy a few years back. It seems that while there are still a lot of good parts out there, there are some that have gone out of circulation (like PGO stroker cranks).

[az_slynch]

Carb finally fits. Had a chance to check it after work this evening.

Finally fits!

After discussion with my machinist, we took 3mm more of the intake throat and 6mm off of the rubber coupling on the manifold side. Fits snugly to the manifold throat now. Just waiting for the 3M 847 adhesive to arrive.

Still using the 12mm modified spacer and the 28mm phenolic spacer + gasket. Can't make the NCY taller and it is still needed. The accelerator pump clears the engine mount by a hair or so.

Bit snug, IMHO.

Debating if I want to relieve the mount slightly with a sanding drum, but I'll hold on that until the manifold is bonded and all fitment is triple-checked; I still need to determine if the air intake boot will mate up to the carb.

Carb still barely touches the underseat lid. I may try dropping some kind of seal in there to make a gap. I want to have it running before messing with cosmetics.

Getting close to running, but getting antsy on time. I have three weekends to get it done before SuperSunday in LA and I'd like to take it.

[az_slynch]

Manifold has been bonded. Carb's refitted. Intake tract has been installed. I'm probably going to space the air box mounts out by about 3mm so it doesn't strain the nitrile bond on the manifold.

Little strain on the nitrile bond. That stuff is hella messy to apply!

Other little gotcha is that the 26mm carb's fuel inlet doesn't go straight into the side of the body. Instead, it bends 90° and kicks up at about 45° to meet the line. This might create a dip in the fuel line that I need to resolve. I'm wondering how hard it would be to strip down both carb bodies, warm them in an oven and swap the fuel inlet pipes.

Had to scoot the breather hose back on the valve cover a little to make it fit. Don't like how the fuel line wants to wrap over it either.

Oil cooler has been reinstalled, lines are plumbed and it's ready for oil. Need to fill the gearbox too, but the startup is very close now. Just need to avoid cutting corners and smooth out these small wrinkles...

Oil cooler reinstalled.

At least the shiny new rack fit nicely!

Proper rack installed.

[az_slynch]

Intake strain resolved. I used two M5x5mm aluminum spacers to move the air filter outboard. Intake alignment is much happier. Oil is in the engine. Putting gearbox oil in after work, then fitting the battery and exhaust.

Air filter spacer installed.

Filter still has ample clearance.

No more strain on the nitrile bond.

[az_slynch]

Engine and gear oil are filled to spec. I put the NCY pipe on. Needs gas and a battery.

Looked in the tank, there's some black goo to clean out. Probably should have done that earlier in the build. Don't want fuelling issues.

Adding 110cc of Royal Purple 75-140.

Hello, lovely low-key exhaust...

[Neil82]

Looking good! It has been a fun build thread to follow.

[sc00ter]

Nice build! Take it your'e going for a sleeper? I still miss my Buddy 125 but learned that a lady ended up with it. She started on a Italica 50cc and traded up to my old Buddy 125. Thanks for rescuing a neglected Buddy and getting it back on the road!