Stator Upgrade?

Racenut · Post by **Racenut** » Tue Sep 09, 2008 4:37 pm

I know this has been touched on before, but has anyone actually found an upgraded stator that actually increases the output of the electrical system?

I put the Silverstar H4 bulb in a while back. It seems to be just enough to cause the charging system to run weak. After a few weeks voltage gets low enough that it won't start, I had to kick it the other day along with the electric to get it going.

Swapped out the bulb back to stock and go for a ride and voltage comes back up and starting trouble goes away. I know others have pulled this off without trouble, maybe I'm just blessed with a weak stator. ONly other thing might be the digital dash, but seems like it would draw less power than analog but I haven't tested that yet.

Also considering trying to figure out how to wire up the headlight to the handlebar switch so I could just turn it off during daylight or for charging cycles. I don't ride at night much now, but as the days get shorter I'm sure it will be more frequent, and the Silverstar is so much better than the stock bulb.

charlie55 · Post by **charlie55** » Tue Sep 09, 2008 4:56 pm

Don't know if this fits the bill since it appears to be for the 4V.....

http://www.ncy-motor.com.tw/english/show.asp?pno=1768

Racenut · Post by **Racenut** » Tue Sep 09, 2008 5:06 pm

That might work, but I'm not going to learn Chinese just to find out

charlie55 · Post by **charlie55** » Tue Sep 09, 2008 5:28 pm

But geez, it's rechargeable. What more do you need to know?

babblefish · Post by **babblefish** » Tue Sep 09, 2008 6:49 pm

I have a Silverstar H4 bulb in my Blur with the digital dash plus I commute to work almost everyday going home at night and I haven't had any problem with my battery charge. But, I also have a higher capacity battery from stock that I bought at Sears. Also, on my daily commutes, my average speed is around 45 mph so I guess the battery gets a pretty good charge on a daily basis.

NOTE: If you're still using the underseat light, disconnect it and your problems may go away. Just unplug the connection at the relay. My Blur was having dead battery problems after sitting for a few days until I did this mod.

Racenut · Post by **Racenut** » Tue Sep 09, 2008 7:34 pm

Save me taking it apart and tracing wires.. which relay is that?

babblefish · Post by **babblefish** » Tue Sep 09, 2008 7:45 pm

Racenut wrote:Save me taking it apart and tracing wires.. which relay is that?

Look at this thread: viewtopic.php?t=5640&highlight=cdi

In the second picture, there is a relay with a blue connector - unplug that one.

Lostmycage · Post by **Lostmycage** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 5:10 am

babblefish,

You mentioned in a previous thread that you haven't noticed any improvement in the brightness of the Silverstar lamp. Have you switched back to the stock wattage, or do you still use the Silverstar?

Second, did you notice a difference in the battery's charge before and after the Silverstar upgrade; did you notice a difference in the battery after unplugging the pet-carrier light?

I'm very curious about this as I've put in the Silverstar on the Buddy and have not run across any starting/battery problems but I did notice a marked improvement in the light feild. I'm very tempted to install the Silverstar on the Blur when I'm digging around while installing the Nautilus horn (the meep-meep is kinda sad after starting out on a 150 Buddy), but if it doesn't do any good, I'm hesitant as that's $20 that can be repurposed towards something like larger jets and/or a better exhaust. Also, have you adjusted the headlight either before or after the Silverstar lamp? Last bit here: since you bought your Blur used, had the previous owner upgraded the lights to a higher wattage lamp without mentioning it to you when you bought it, thus not giving any real noticeable improvement in the light output?

I ask this because my Blur needs something extra, light-wise. The stock is ok, but I normally travel faster than the beam can show on the low setting = no reaction time. I ride with the high beam on at night and wow, what a difference.

I look forward to hearing your observations.

Racenut · Post by **Racenut** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 5:45 am

On mine the Silverstar is a very noticeable improvement in light output over the stock 35W bulb. That's why I'd like to be able to leave it in there.

I unplugged the relay just because... but I'm going to have to do some more testing with my meter and see if I can figure out what's up.

babblefish · Post by **babblefish** » Wed Sep 10, 2008 6:45 am

Lostmycage wrote:babblefish,

You mentioned in a previous thread that you haven't noticed any improvement in the brightness of the Silverstar lamp. Have you switched back to the stock wattage, or do you still use the Silverstar?

No, I haven't - still using the Silverstar.

Second, did you notice a difference in the battery's charge before and after the Silverstar upgrade; did you notice a difference in the battery after unplugging the pet-carrier light?

No difference after the Silverstar upgrade. Definite difference after disconnecting the pet-carrier light. Battery no longer goes flat after sitting unused for five or more days. I did a lot of troubleshooting over a two week time period to track down the source of my electrical drain.

I'm very curious about this as I've put in the Silverstar on the Buddy and have not run across any starting/battery problems but I did notice a marked improvement in the light feild. I'm very tempted to install the Silverstar on the Blur when I'm digging around while installing the Nautilus horn (the meep-meep is kinda sad after starting out on a 150 Buddy), but if it doesn't do any good, I'm hesitant as that's $20 that can be repurposed towards something like larger jets and/or a better exhaust. Also, have you adjusted the headlight either before or after the Silverstar lamp? Last bit here: since you bought your Blur used, had the previous owner upgraded the lights to a higher wattage lamp without mentioning it to you when you bought it, thus not giving any real noticeable improvement in the light output?

I have not adjusted the headlight because the beam seems to be aligned correctly. The bulb I replaced was the original 35W unit. Maybe the Silverstar is brighter, but it doesn't look that much different to me - could be I've gotten used to seeing HID lights...or I'm just old and blind.
If you feel the Silverstar is not bright enough, there are brighter bulbs available, up to 100W, but these are 1) not cheap and 2) may overheat the housing and overtax the wiring. People have installed HID systems in their Blur with no problems (other than maybe blinding the heck out of oncoming traffic) and I've been thinking about going that route since I do a lot of night riding.

I ask this because my Blur needs something extra, light-wise. The stock is ok, but I normally travel faster than the beam can show on the low setting = no reaction time. I ride with the high beam on at night and wow, what a difference.

Sounds a little like my mouth and my brain - sometimes stupid things come out of my mouth before my brain has a chance to think about it = no reaction time.

I look forward to hearing your observations.

Racenut · Post by **Racenut** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 2:24 am

- AMPS means it's charging
+ AMPS means it's draining
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Engine Off - Key Off
Pet Carrier Light On 0.20A
PetCarrier Light Off 0.02A
Relay Unplugged 0.00A but would sometimes flicker to .01, the clock is still on

Engine Off - Key On
0.25A
Brake Light 1.6A

Engine On - Idle
Stock Headlight -1.25A - charging
Silverstar Headlight 0.6A - draining

Engine On 6000RPM
Stock Headlight -2.45A - charging
Silverstar Headlight -0.9 - barely charging

Voltage at Battery at 5000RPM
Stock 13.2V
Silverstar 12.4V

Silverstar uses .3 - .4A more on Highbeam

Observation... If I run with the running lights off and on low beam, there is a 0.1A charge to the battery at idle. Otherwise, at idle, the Silverstar is draining.

With normal lights on at 6000RPM, I have a a bit of a charge, but as soon as I lift, and especially use brakes or turn signals, I am draining at a higher rate than I was charging. For city riding, this seems to be too much as the battery gradually gets weaker and weaker.

I'm considering using the Silverstar and just making sure I keep it on low beam and running lights off unless riding at night. But forget to turn running lights on and I'm in trouble at night.

babblefish · Post by **babblefish** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 2:48 am

Racenut wrote:-snip- Engine Off - Key Off
Pet Carrier Light On 0.20A
PetCarrier Light Off 0.02A
Relay Unplugged 0.00A but would sometimes flicker to .01, the clock is still on
-snip-

That's close to the readings I was seeing. 0.02A doesn't sound like much, does it? At 24 hours it equals 0.48A. Still doesn't sound like much. After one week (7 days), the drain = 3.36A. The stock battery is rated for 6Ahr. That represents more than half the battery capacity. The starter won't crank the engine if the battery is halfway discharged.

After disconnecting the pet light I have had no starting problems even after letting the scooter sit for two weeks or five or more starts a day.

Lostmycage · Post by **Lostmycage** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 3:41 am

Looks like a stator upgrade might not be a bad thing after all. I think I just need to adjust the beam. The stock light is adequately bright, it just doesn't have the range I need. I think a good bit of that is dues to the shape of the reflective housing around the lamp.

Looks like I've got an evening project ahead of me.

Racenut · Post by **Racenut** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 3:59 am

I've played with adjusting.. it only does so much. A single 35W light just isn't enough at higher speeds.

Might look at HID 35W kits.

jim_0068 · Post by **jim_0068** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 4:02 am

not sure what your state laws are but I know in Illinois all motorcycles/scooters/etc have to have daytime lights

Lostmycage · Post by **Lostmycage** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 4:50 am

Racenut wrote:I've played with adjusting.. it only does so much. A single 35W light just isn't enough at higher speeds.

Might look at HID 35W kits.

Any chance you've found a place to get the 35W HID kits?

Racenut · Post by **Racenut** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 4:53 am

Seems there are a couple people here that found them on eBay. I have seen tons of them there. Trying to separate the good from the bad is the problem.

Lostmycage · Post by **Lostmycage** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 5:23 am

Yeah, I really should have added that bit about a good quality HID kit. I've found tons, but the electrics can be such a nightmare to track down if there's a problem and I don't want to introduce bad variables into the system.

Actually, I was kinda curious... How did you measure the Amp load? I'm assuming a multimeter, but where exactly did you connect it?

Racenut · Post by **Racenut** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 5:34 am

ha... disconnected the neg battery terminal and inline with that.

At first I just held it tight to the battery to start it. But once its warm, I just kick started it between tests.

Oh yeah.. scooter runs fine even with battery disconnected as long as it's already running

Lostmycage · Post by **Lostmycage** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 6:04 am

OK, so it's a simple as I thought. I like making sure, especially around electrical components. It's good to know that it'll run sans battery.

So, in an effort to cut down on the drain, has anyone attempted to swap out stock lamps for LEDs? I believe I've seen some "2 pole" LED's that could replace the brake/running light, which should boost the charging a bit. The turn signals seem like they'd be a non-issue as they aren't an all the time drain.

The offset in current from an LED setup on the brake/running light (the front "accent lights" are already LED, correct?) might help with the draw of something on the cheap side like the Silverstar. I'm gonna do a little digging on HID set-ups, as these seem to provide the most night time vision. I love riding at night, so this is a pretty good upgrade once all figured out.

Does this sound like I'm on the right course or completely off?

I guess the Buddy has an advantage with it's rear brake/running light setup in LEDs. I've not had any issues on it with the Silverstar headlamp and the Silverstar turn signal lamps. But I rode the hell out of that as well, so not really any downtime for the battery to drain.

Has anyone put in a bigger battery? Or would one even fit? I'm tempted to set up a battery tender just to be able to use a brighter headlamp, but the costs of a tender and brighter halogen get close enough to an HID kit that I'd probably lean towards the HID kit.

babblefish · Post by **babblefish** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 6:57 am

This thread: topic3259.html might be useful for battery information. In the the 6th post down, I mentioned buying a Sears 9-BS battery to replace my stock one. The stock battery is rated for 6AH while the 9-BS is 8AH. Size wise, it has the same dimensions, but is just a bit taller. Fits perfectly and the battery cover snaps back on. If you don't mind leaving the battery cover off, Sears has another battery (12-BS) with the same length and width, but is too tall for the cover to go back on although the seat closes fine. It is rated for 10AH. Both are the same price at $64.99
If you really want to push it, they have the 14-BS which is rated for 12AH, but is probably too tall at 5.75 inches (I haven't actually verified if it's too tall).
As a side note, my local Sears (San Bruno, CA) carries the Battery Tender.

9-BS: http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_02844025000P
12-BS: http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_02844016000P

Lostmycage · Post by **Lostmycage** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 12:54 pm

Thanks Babblefish, good info on the battery there.

Something occured to me just a moment ago.... has anyone pulled a current reading with or without the digital dash? I know this seems like a bit of a stretch, as it really shouldn't pull much power over stock - if any at all. In fact, it should be about the same, but it is a variable that some of you guys are running. I'll be following suite pretty soon.

Racenut · Post by **Racenut** » Thu Sep 11, 2008 3:46 pm

Lostmycage wrote:Something occured to me just a moment ago.... has anyone pulled a current reading with or without the digital dash? I know this seems like a bit of a stretch, as it really shouldn't pull much power over stock - if any at all. In fact, it should be about the same, but it is a variable that some of you guys are running. I'll be following suite pretty soon.

Engine Off - Key On
0.25A

I have the digital dash. I thought about this too, but decided .25A wasn't worth pulling the dash pod apart to find out. And at .25A for the digital, I'm thinking the analog probably uses more since it uses conventional light bulbs instead of LEDs. But that's just a guess at this point. Next time I have the dash apart, I'll plug in the analog just to see.

Lostmycage · Post by **Lostmycage** » Sun Sep 14, 2008 4:44 am

So... I actually have a little something to add here. In my various searchings for all things Blur, I came across some negative opinions of the voltage regulator. It seems that this can cause quite a few problems with the electrics of the scooter. I've also found (unsubstantiated as of yet personally) that the regulator from a SYM RV250 (stock, not aftermarket) fixes a lot of the variation in the electrics of the Blur/Gmax.

I'll do a little more digging around and maybe confirm with some voltage readings (with a little co-operation from my dealer, if she's got the parts to play with, of course). I don't advise doing anything just yet, unless you want to experiment.

Also, for lowering the current draw, has anyone tried replacing the stick lamps (aside from the head lamp) with LEDs? Less draw on those would theoretically help power something like the Silverstar or an HID kit.

Hope some of the above garbage inspires someone, hehe.

Racenut · Post by **Racenut** » Sun Sep 14, 2008 4:51 am

Interesting.. I'll wait to see what you come up with there.

As for LED's...

Blinker lights? Yeah, but then you have to replace the flasher or put load equalizers which basically use just as much or more power as the bulbs. And they aren't used enough to really be the problem here.

The front running lights are already LED.

The rear running/brakelight could be replaced, but the reviews I've seen of the 1157 LED replacements determine they are not as bright and do not put off a uniform light. So you're face with finding something custom. A custom LED tail light for a Harley Sportster? Sure.. no problem. A Blur? uh.. no.

The LED tail light on my wife's Buddy is really nice though. Very bright.

Lostmycage · Post by **Lostmycage** » Sun Sep 14, 2008 5:03 am

Yeah, I like and kinda miss the Buddy's rear light. It's nice, simple and looks very modern. Seems like the Blur was really meant to have they same or similar setup. Hrmm... I guess that's something else worth looking into.

Looks like I'm gonna be buggin' my dealer again for a wrecked Buddy assembly. I probably could take it out of our Buddy for a test. Guess it comes down to how "creative" I feel like feeling. More to come on that, but not at a fast pace, hehe.

At any rate, I'm committing myself to installing the rear brake light modulators on both bikes tomorrow as well as the Nautilus on the Blur. Weather's been crap lately on the days where I'd have actually had time to do anything. I really do need to start working on plans for our shed/garage, that way I'd have a place to hack and play when it's being uncooperative outside. Being a grown up is not as cool as it was back when I was a know-it-all teenager. I really miss knowing everything, that was swell!

Racenut · Post by **Racenut** » Tue Sep 23, 2008 8:52 pm

Just a bit of an update. After my amp draw tests and babblefish's tip on pulling the plug on the pet carrier light, I've been running the Silverstar bulb for over week now and no dead battery.

I unplugged the pet carrier light.
I turn off the "running lights" during the day.
I run with the headlight on low beam.

No problems so far.

babblefish · Post by **babblefish** » Wed Sep 24, 2008 12:45 am

The only thing I did to mine was to disconnect the pet carrier lamp. Other than the Silverstar headlight everything else is stock and I haven't had a dead battery yet. I also usually run with my high beam on during the day. And again, I sometimes use the electric start 5 or 6 times in a day. Basicaly, I don't think there's anything wrong with the stock electrical system in a Blur except for the pet carrier lamp thing.