Scooters for highway

Ethan Allison · Post by **Ethan Allison** » Fri Nov 18, 2011 2:46 pm

There are scooter-themed variants to the MSF course that let you try out different shapes and sizes. As far as I know, they're pretty much designed for people like you that aren't sure what they want and have a relatively flexible budget.

Some larger dealers also allow test drives for people that have an appropriate license.

http://msf-usa.org/scooterschool.cfm

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Fri Nov 18, 2011 3:08 pm

I agree with Edwub that it's a matter of perspective. My draft horse of a MC often has me longing for something lighter and that includes just about every scoot other than a Burgman 650, which is a huge aerodynamic couch of a vehicle.

You can ride any scooter if you excercise judgment with the right hand. Some are just more limited than others. If you feel safer by starting off with something small, then by all means, do it. You're smarter than most in your self-restraint.

BootScootin'FireFighter · Fri Nov 18, 2011 9:20 pm

not sure of the laws in print, but I-66 inside the beltway is 2 lanes each way, no trucks allowed, and HOV only during peak times in peak direction. It's usually pretty crowded most of the daytime and evening anyway, so I'll jump on for a short hop. Other then that, I'll do 495 (Capital Beltway) just for a quick hop between Virginia and Maryland. Other then that or other bridges out of town, I avoid the Interstate highway system.

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Fri Nov 18, 2011 11:00 pm

Hmm...I haven't seen any scooter themed MSF courses around here but I'll look deeper!

I'm signing up for the MSF basic rider course in December!! I went out today to buy my first pair of non-dressy over-the-ankle shoes, a requirement to take the course. I do have boots but they're all dressy and I wouldn't want to scuff them up because of the course!

I'm excited!!

BootScootin'FireFighter · Sun Nov 20, 2011 6:55 pm

I'll throw out another suggestion. A Honda Big Ruckus 250. A friend I go riding with has one, and it's very highway capable, has a ton of carrying capacity, and seats the rider very comfortably like on a recumbent bike. There is room for behind seat bungee storage, a large topcase behind that, a hardcase saddlebag on each side, and a small bag on the front. He also has it set up with a GPS, Ram mount for a smartphone, and GoPro HD camera mounts on the front and back. They aren't in production and are rare to find, but I did see one in North Florida a couple of weeks ago. They pop up occassionally on Ebay. I'm holding out for one, a perfect touring scoot and very reliable. He commutes from VA to MD on it, including a long stretch on I-495. The seatback also comes down for a passenger seat, and the entire seat can be moved forward or back for short or tall people.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Sun Nov 20, 2011 7:01 pm

teabow1 wrote:Despite all of this, I might still end up first getting a 50cc first.

Starting off with a 50 is your call. My advice, however, is to go with a used 50 so you don't take a bath when you trade up. (unusual choice for someone interested in highway capability though - the Honda Metro is so slow that I would hesitate to ride it on city streets)

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 12:13 am

The Big Ruckus was a neat machine and yet another of Honda's ideas that didn't go over. I saw it as a scooter that attracted non-scooter folk but most of them were balked by the price. They few here must be highly sought after because the ones I see for sale command big prices.

I wonder how much of its internals it shares with the Reflex.

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 1:59 am

Dooglas wrote:
teabow1 wrote:Despite all of this, I might still end up first getting a 50cc first.
Starting off with a 50 is your call. My advice, however, is to go with a used 50 so you don't take a bath when you trade up. (unusual choice for someone interested in highway capability though - the Honda Metro is so slow that I would hesitate to ride it on city streets)

Well, it's faster than me on my bicycle! From what I have read, 50ccs should be operated in streets the way a bicycle should. That is, to the right of the lane as long as it is safe, and then at times when necessary, ride it in the middle of the lane like you're riding in traffic.

From what I can see so far, slower 50cc scooterists probably would do themselves some good by reading John Forrester's « Effective Cycling » which is a road sense way of bicycling on streets.

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:00 am

The big Honda Ruckus 250cc does look like a serious scooter! However, I do say that for me it's a tad ugly

Besides practicality, I do want my scooter to look nice for my tastes

KABarash · Post by **KABarash** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 3:12 pm

teabow1 wrote:The big Honda Ruckus 250cc does look like a serious scooter! However, I do say that for me it's a tad ugly Besides practicality, I do want my scooter to look nice for my tastes

It's ugliness is the allure to me, downright bizarre in a sense, but that's why I like it! The 'regular' Ruck is just too cute, bleck... looks like nothing more than a naked Met......

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 3:30 pm

KABarash, I see that you are using a Kryptonite cable, is that right? I just see the tips of the loop in the picture. How do you generally lock the scooter with the cable?

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 3:52 pm

If ever a scooter qualified for the term "automatic motorcycle", the Big Ruckus was it. No legshield, no internal storage to speak of. That makes it more like a regular motorcycle in my book. And it certainly isn't pretty. I'm conflicted every time I look at one. It only has a very few of the conveniences of a modern scooter and yet.........

KABarash · Post by **KABarash** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 5:31 pm

teabow1 wrote:KABarash, I see that you are using a Kryptonite cable, is that right? I just see the tips of the loop in the picture. How do you generally lock the scooter with the cable?

Nope, no cable on my scoot, just Kerm swiping it for an afternoon cruise........

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 2:18 am

teabow1 wrote: From what I have read, 50ccs should be operated in streets the way a bicycle should. That is, to the right of the lane as long as it is safe, and then at times when necessary, ride it in the middle of the lane like you're riding in traffic.

Well, I disagree and I think most law enforcement officers would as well. A scooter is a street legal motor vehicle. It should actually be operated in a conventional lane just like a car. In most places it is illegal to ride one on the shoulder or in a bike lane. That is why it is important that you select a scooter that can be safely ridden in traffic in the conditions where you intend to ride.

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:12 am

I should clarify. When the 50cc can go the speed of traffic, then ride in traffic. Same for the bicycle. When it can't, ride on the right side of the right lane. This isn't the shoulder. This technique gives others a chance to pass when you can't keep up with traffic.

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:28 pm

I'm now looking between the Piaggio BV 300 and the Aprilia Sportcity 250. Any comments on comparison?

The Honda and Yamaha offerings (talking brand new) aren't good. Either too much scooter or too high in price. Eg, Honda has nothing between the SH150 and Silverwing. The SH150 isn't freeway suitable. The Silverwing is too much scooter and probably too high of a price.

omniphil · Post by **omniphil** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:47 pm

I have a blur 220, but want something a little more friendly for highway as I do alot of that.

I think I have decided on the Kymco Downtown 300i.

liquid cooled
almost twice the power of the blur
is only about 40lbs heavier (Most 300cc and up are even heavier)
and still gets the same 70 mpg (almost anyways)

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 4:44 pm

I haven't been able to find the MPG for the Aprilia SportCity 250 but some older figures state 49mpg. Now that's horrible! Anyhow, comparing the Sportcity 250 and the Piaggio BV 300, I think I'd go for BV300. It is actually lighter by 2 lbs weighing in at 328lbs (dry), gives better mileage at 70mpg, and has a bigger engine.

BV300 costs $5,000 while the Kymco Downtown 300i costs $5,600, a significant difference. And, the Downtown 300i weighs 367lbs (though I don't know if that's dry or wet since Kymco USA doesn't distinguish, but even if that's the wet weight, the dry weight can't weigh too much less I think). The Downtown has a bigger engine at 298.9cc whereas the BV300 is 278cc.

I wonder, given these differences, why choose the Downtown 300i over the BV300?

Here's a table of comparison of some models I've been looking at

omniphil · Post by **omniphil** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 6:08 pm

That's a great comparison chart!

The Kymco 300i has 29 hp and is capable of 90 real mph, that's pretty much what I want for freeway use. Something that can cruise easily at 70-75mph.
Oh, and windshield, its big on the downtown 300i, something you'd want for alot of freeway running. Large under seat storage too.

Gas tank size is important to me, my blur only has about 100 mile range which is not to good.

Do you have of those stats for the other scooters?

Maybe we can add more stats to this comparison, I like what you've done here...

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 6:39 pm

Ah okay, let me add more stats. I was only keeping track of those that I thought would be important for me but the other stats are useful too.

I'm a little suspicious of the mpg of the two Aprilia. I think I found them on the web and not at Aprilia's official website. The figures seem really low for the type of engine used.

I'll add more to the stats and post a new chart eventually.

By the way, I looked at the Vespa for something equivalent to 250cc or 300cc-ish. Expensive describes it. Vespa is not even worth considering for me at any cc level. I don't care so much about the styling to pay an additional $1,000 or whatever for it.

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 6:44 pm

Vespa has become the "luxury marque", if you will, of the Piaggio Group, probably because they stick to the metal monocoque construction. Cadillac to Piaggio's Chevrolet.

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 6:51 pm

Southerner wrote:Vespa has become the "luxury marque", if you will, of the Piaggio Group, probably because they stick to the metal monocoque construction. Cadillac to Piaggio's Chevrolet.

What about the Aprilia brand? Only from what I read and deconstruct from their marketing brochure, Aprilia seems to be geared towards the image of sporty and sport-enthusiast. Does that explain the really poor fuel economy? I checked on Fuelly just now and indeed, some of those Aprilia stats I have in that chart does seem to match. That's really poor fuel economy.

omniphil · Post by **omniphil** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 6:51 pm

Engine cc's don't tell the whole story is what I have seen. Some engines in the 250cc and larger category don't have the power and gas mileage as some other engines. So you have to get some extra specs other than just going by cc's alone.. Some engines are really old tech, and some are pretty modern..

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:00 am

Here's a more updated list, now adding the Piaggio BV 350 along with some additional comments I've found around the internet.

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:05 am

This article:

http://www.cycleworld.com/2011/11/03/20 ... irst-ride/

notes the MSRP for the BV350 is going to be $5,400. That's not good. It's way more expensive than what I'd want. Can anyone corroborate on the price?

The BV 300 was at the perfect price. It also had the right mpg, right speed, and right weight.

k1dude · Post by **k1dude** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:34 am

teabow1, check Fuelly.com for actual gas mileage numbers. Hopefully someone has posted numbers for the scooters you're researching.

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 4:13 am

teabow1 wrote:This article:

http://www.cycleworld.com/2011/11/03/20 ... irst-ride/

notes the MSRP for the BV350 is going to be $5,400. That's not good. It's way more expensive than what I'd want. Can anyone corroborate on the price?

The BV 300 was at the perfect price. It also had the right mpg, right speed, and right weight.

That was a good article. It's really something when Sportbike World waxes effusive over a scooter. Top speed over 90 puts it in the same class as the BV500. I'll believe that 78.4 mpg when I see it, though.

jrsjr · Post by **jrsjr** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 4:58 am

teabow1 wrote:This article:

http://www.cycleworld.com/2011/11/03/20 ... irst-ride/

notes the MSRP for the BV350 is going to be $5,400.

That's actually very reasonable for what you get. It performs about as well as the big maxi-scooters from Honda and Suzuki for a lot less money. The big difference is that, in the USA at least, it does not come with ABS. If it came with ABS for under $6000, I'd consider it. They're going to sell a lot of BV350s at that price (assuming it's right) simply because it solves the Freeway/Interstate question that plagues scooter sales in the USA. (Can it go on the Interstate? Hell to the yes, it can!)

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 7:38 am

I'm sure it's reasonable. It's more than I want to pay for a scooter. The BV 300 fits my bill and requirements (weight, mpg, etc) perfectly but hear they're no longer in stock.

------
Update:

By the way, other scooters from the 250cc to 300cc can also do that freeway thing.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 8:31 am

If considering a Burgman 400 be sure to only consider 2007 and later models. The earlier ones required expensive maintance at short intervals

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 12:47 pm

[quote="BuddyRaton"]If considering a Burgman 400 be sure to only consider 2007 and later models. The earlier ones required expensive maintance at short intervals[/quote

They should also be available used in quantity.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 12:59 pm

I definatly want to give the BV 350 a test ride. The BV 300 at actual 278cc should be pretty much like a vespa 300. I've ridden a BV500 and liked it but I thought it was a little rough due to the one lung displacing 460 cc.

And why don't they just call it a 460 or 475. I don't have a problem with calling a 198 cc Vespa a P200 but the rounding up bit has just gotten out of hand.

teabow1 · Post by **teabow1** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 1:12 pm

Burgman seems like too much scooter for me -- as in big and bulky looking

You realise (or maybe you don't) when I first joined this board my question was whether I should get the 50cc Honda Metro (oh so cute!!) or the Genuine Buddy. See how now I've "inflated" to 250cc to 300cc-ish?

======

Regarding inflated cc's yes. I found that strange. Some Kymcos I think are advertised as 250cc when they're really much closer to 200cc (or maybe it's advertised as 300cc and they're much closer to 250cc and perform more like one too).

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:16 pm

teabow1 wrote:Burgman seems like too much scooter for me -- as in big and bulky looking

You realise (or maybe you don't) when I first joined this board my question was whether I should get the 50cc Honda Metro (oh so cute!!) or the Genuine Buddy. See how now I've "inflated" to 250cc to 300cc-ish?

======

Regarding inflated cc's yes. I found that strange. Some Kymcos I think are advertised as 250cc when they're really much closer to 200cc (or maybe it's advertised as 300cc and they're much closer to 250cc and perform more like one too).

Well your not the first to get "inflated" and I'm sure you will not be the last!

Burgman 400 and 650s are big scooters and can be a bit cumbersome around town. However they were designed and built to gobble up the super slabs! I have almost 40K on my Burgman 650 Ex. The low center of gravity makes it handle more like a sports bike than a cruiser MC.

Nope...they are not for everyone...but the ride is just incredible.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:18 pm

Oh yeah....the 650 is actually a 638 cc I guess percentage wise thats not too much of a push

ravenlore · Post by **ravenlore** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 2:23 pm

teabow1 wrote:Burgman seems like too much scooter for me -- as in big and bulky looking

You realise (or maybe you don't) when I first joined this board my question was whether I should get the 50cc Honda Metro (oh so cute!!) or the Genuine Buddy. See how now I've "inflated" to 250cc to 300cc-ish?

...

Actually it's a couple of the 200's that are only 163 or 175cc, depending on the model. They've done right by the new People GT though, with a proper 200cc engine (might even be 205)