Stella Accross the Country

Cunelson3 · Post by **Cunelson3** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 4:48 am

When I was in my teens and 20s, I took a few long-distance trips on my PX. I want to go accross the country again, this time on a Stella. I don't own one, so I will buy a 4T. I've heard some criticisms of the Stella. Are the Stella's reliable enough to make such a trip? I'll be going through some mountains, can they climb to 8K+ feet with a 200lb rider with gear? Do they need to be re-jetted? I understand the Stella has tubed tires. Can I get rims for tubeless tires?

Drum Pro · Post by **Drum Pro** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 3:27 pm

I know you can gettubeless rims and I think a Stella is able to be rode cross country but a re jet may be required when going up in elevation.

Witch · Post by **Witch** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 6:42 pm

Folks used to do that kind of stuff on old Vespas all the time. If you're up for it, I suspect the bike will be up for it. With the exception of possible re-jetting and some other minor stuff, I imagine.

Lokky · Post by **Lokky** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 7:35 pm

I don't own a 4t but I rode my kitted 2t to Amerivespa last year completely solo. Total of almost 2000 miles round trip, carrying a mountaineering backpack with camping gear and saddlebags. Lots of mountain riding in west Virginia and the bike performed great.

SYMbionic Duo · Post by **SYMbionic Duo** » Tue Jan 15, 2013 9:36 pm

Cross country shouldn't be a problem.

i did 400mi (800 round trip) Minneapolis to Chicago.

Steep grades will have you downshifting into 3rd to hold 30-35mph.

Don't expect to cruise at 55, 45-50 is more realistic.

A windshield will help with maintaining higher speeds.

Carry extra fuel. Finding fuel when on back roads in the middle of nowhere can be a challenge, depending on where you are.

Think about getting better / padded grips.

Have fun and take lots of pictures.

-duo

Maximus53 · Post by **Maximus53** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 4:46 pm

SYMbionic Duo wrote:Cross country shouldn't be a problem.

i did 400mi (800 round trip) Minneapolis to Chicago.

Steep grades will have you downshifting into 3rd to hold 30-35mph.

Don't expect to cruise at 55, 45-50 is more realistic.

A windshield will help with maintaining higher speeds.

Carry extra fuel. Finding fuel when on back roads in the middle of nowhere can be a challenge, depending on where you are.

Think about getting better / padded grips.

Have fun and take lots of pictures.

-duo

What type of windshiled did you add? I have been looking at the cupini mini windscreen at scooterworks.

Thanks!

Lokky · Post by **Lokky** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 5:42 pm

Maximus53 wrote:
What type of windshiled did you add? I have been looking at the cupini mini windscreen at scooterworks.

Thanks!

That's the one I had when I rode to Amerivespa.

It definitely helped reducing the amount of wind hitting my chest, preventing a big factor of exhaustion on such a long trip.

The biggest downside is that it redirected all the wind against my ears, making it painfully loud. This wasn't a big deal because I rode with earplugs anyway since my kitted 2T is pretty loud herself.

Also I was warned by my mechanic that a windshield can cause headset vibrations which can effect the wear of the front tire. Sure enough when I got back my tire was worn in a weird pattern although I do not know if that affected handling much (the rear tire was squared off so that was the biggest issue).

Also three things I found incredibly helpful:
1. An Airhawk cushion, this kept the blood flowing in my legs on those 16 hours of riding days.
2. A crampbuster throttle lever. Holding the throttle wide open was extremely painful for such long distances. Picked up a crampbuster halfway through and it really improved my ride.
3. Nitrogen filled tires. At WOT for such long distances our tiny 10" tires will wear quickly. Nitrogen keeps tire temperature lower than air and dramatically extends tire life. A few MB members rode on the cannonball last year and used a single set of tires because of nitrogen, other riders were changing tires every ~2 days. I actually had to deflate the rear tire to install a new pipe once I got to Amerivespa and had to fill it up with air, the tire was squared off by the end of the day whereas it looked like new on the way there.

magnato1 · Post by **magnato1** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:38 pm

Lokky wrote:
Maximus53 wrote:
What type of windshiled did you add? I have been looking at the cupini mini windscreen at scooterworks.

Thanks!
That's the one I had when I rode to Amerivespa.

It definitely helped reducing the amount of wind hitting my chest, preventing a big factor of exhaustion on such a long trip.

The biggest downside is that it redirected all the wind against my ears, making it painfully loud. This wasn't a big deal because I rode with earplugs anyway since my kitted 2T is pretty loud herself.

Also I was warned by my mechanic that a windshield can cause headset vibrations which can effect the wear of the front tire. Sure enough when I got back my tire was worn in a weird pattern although I do not know if that affected handling much (the rear tire was squared off so that was the biggest issue).

Also three things I found incredibly helpful:
1. An Airhawk cushion, this kept the blood flowing in my legs on those 16 hours of riding days.
2. A crampbuster throttle lever. Holding the throttle wide open was extremely painful for such long distances. Picked up a crampbuster halfway through and it really improved my ride.
3. Nitrogen filled tires. At WOT for such long distances our tiny 10" tires will wear quickly. Nitrogen keeps tire temperature lower than air and dramatically extends tire life. A few MB members rode on the cannonball last year and used a single set of tires because of nitrogen, other riders were changing tires every ~2 days. I actually had to deflate the rear tire to install a new pipe once I got to Amerivespa and had to fill it up with air, the tire was squared off by the end of the day whereas it looked like new on the way there.

Maximus,

Crew also has the Cupini mini windshield, in case you're looking for a second opinion.

Lokky,

I used to use nitrogen in my car tires, which I really liked. Hadn't even thought about it on the scooter, but it's a good idea. Do you have shops add it for you, or can you buy little nitrogen cartridges, like the CO2 quick fill cartridges that bicyclists use?

Lokky · Post by **Lokky** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 7:46 pm

Our club treasurer works at an air separation plant. He just fills a tank up with nitrogen and keeps it at the local shop for people to use.

magnato1 · Post by **magnato1** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 8:27 pm

Lokky wrote:Our club treasurer works at an air separation plant. He just fills a tank up with nitrogen and keeps it at the local shop for people to use.

Translation: take it to a tire shop, haha

PeteH · Post by **PeteH** » Wed Jan 16, 2013 9:36 pm

Nitrogen in tires baffles me a little. Not to necessarily dispute Lok's experience, but here's a couple things that hurt my head:

- compressed air is about 75-80% nitrogen to begin with, and the machines generate about 95%.
- unless said machine evacuates the tire first, you've got essentially 1 tire-volume's worth of 'normal' air before you start inflating. Filling a tire to 30psi is about two atmospheres / tire-volumes worth, so aren't you ending up with only about 90% nitrogen (a 10% bump over room air) at that point? (.80 + (2 x .95))/3

(please correct my assumptions if flawed)

Yeah, if it's free, why not, but I don't think I'd pay for the privilege.

fisher1 · Post by **fisher1** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:08 am

These guys are making their way from the Arctic Circle to Patagonia ..... their blogs are newest on top, so you need to sorta read from bottom -up.

They are riding Bajaj Chetaks, 4stroke 150's.

http://www.stepthrupanam.com/blog/blog/

stASH · Post by **stASH** » Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:05 pm

I like this part of their description of the Chetak:

The manual gearbox operated by a traditional grip-shifter allows the rider to change between 4 different levels of slowness, and the tiny 1.25 gallon fuel tank beneath the seat casts a conspicuous shadow over the bike’s excellent fuel efficiency.

magnato1 · Post by **magnato1** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:59 am

fisher1 wrote:These guys are making their way from the Arctic Circle to Patagonia ..... their blogs are newest on top, so you need to sorta read from bottom -up.

They are riding Bajaj Chetaks, 4stroke 150's.

http://www.stepthrupanam.com/blog/blog/

Perfect timing, I finished Underboning the World about a month ago, I've needed something new to read an inspire.

iamstuffed · Post by **iamstuffed** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:32 pm

magnato1 wrote:
fisher1 wrote:These guys are making their way from the Arctic Circle to Patagonia ..... their blogs are newest on top, so you need to sorta read from bottom -up.

They are riding Bajaj Chetaks, 4stroke 150's.

http://www.stepthrupanam.com/blog/blog/

Perfect timing, I finished Underboning the World about a month ago, I've needed something new to read an inspire.

You should check out the blog of a guy riding his Honda Cub on a similar route.
http://hondavstheworld.com/

Crew · Post by **Crew** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 4:15 pm

Both of these links are filled with great reading. Makes me want to plan a trip myself. I could use an adventure about now. Thanks for posting them.

viney266 · Post by **viney266** » Fri Jan 18, 2013 8:14 pm

Just so you know, Your PX had tubes in the tires too. SIP makes some very nice tubeless rims if you do want to go that route, but the tubeless stuff works fine. That one is a classic arguement that can take pages.
The small windshield Lokky is running is the same one I have. It works great and you will actually see a small 3-5 MPH speed increase with it. I know it is hard to believe ,but several of us have tested it. So, it is worth that for the windshield and the less fatigue.
I would rejet the carb before climbing mountains. Honestly I would invest in a quiet aftermarket pipe and carb kit ( there are a few out there) for the 4T. The gains are good, especially on a long trip.
Hydrate lots, take more money than you think you will need, take pics, and have a blast!

Lokky · Post by **Lokky** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 10:34 pm

PeteH wrote:Nitrogen in tires baffles me a little. Not to necessarily dispute Lok's experience, but here's a couple things that hurt my head:

- compressed air is about 75-80% nitrogen to begin with, and the machines generate about 95%.
- unless said machine evacuates the tire first, you've got essentially 1 tire-volume's worth of 'normal' air before you start inflating. Filling a tire to 30psi is about two atmospheres / tire-volumes worth, so aren't you ending up with only about 90% nitrogen (a 10% bump over room air) at that point? (.80 + (2 x .95))/3

(please correct my assumptions if flawed)

Yeah, if it's free, why not, but I don't think I'd pay for the privilege.

Your math is off because 30 psi is 2 atmospheres over ambient pressure, not simply double.

Also while the nitrogen from a machine is ~95% pure, the one from a tank is 99.9999% pure. That last 5% makes a huge deal of difference.

Assuming you start with a deflated tube and you purge it a couple times you will obtain 99.99% nitrogen in it, which is what I ran with and it dramatically increased tire life. I do agree that getting nitrogen from a shop who uses a machine won't net results that are as good.

PeteH · Post by **PeteH** » Sun Jan 20, 2013 11:09 pm

Heh, I did mean two additional atmospheres. That's why I had two terms in the front part of the equation, one for the ambient pressure at 80% plus two more at 95%, divided by 3. I'm a tubeless guy, but i get your physical model starting with an empty tube. Perhaps Boyle's Law applied to mixed gases woogies up the percentages a little as well.

So My math, I think, is generally good, but as you say, 'lab' nitrogen and starting with an evacuated tube takes your component way up beyond normal consumer tire-filling. So I accept your premise of running almost pure nitrogen. I'd love to see some studies/stories that separate this level of nitrogen from the shop-generated snake oil.

viney266 · Post by **viney266** » Wed Jan 23, 2013 9:59 pm

We were using nitrogen in race tires at Daytona in the 80's ( roadracing motorcycles), and the official reason then was less water vapor from the air not raising the temp as much and the tire inflation staying more stable. Did it work? I dunno, but at 150+ WE WEREN'T GOING TO FIND OUT. tHEY did INFLATE WITH NITROGEN, PURGE THEN REINFLATE, AND IT WAS FROM A TANK (oops cap lock). I think it keeps air pressure more stable as things heat up. The rims and tires we used were tubeless FYI.

There was one of the car magazines that just did an article study on nitrogen in the tires. I also think consumer reports did something, though I am not always impressed with their reporting.

I can see it being more stable, and I can sure tell you ( as a long time tire jockey) that underinflation does more to wear a tire out than ANYTHING else. I am sure for people that never check their tires ( most folks) that the nitrogen may help at least in that regard. The rest of the claims? Jury is still out for me. Lets start another thread about this?

viewtopic.php?p=307295#307295

Spiffy · Post by **Spiffy** » Wed Feb 27, 2013 6:18 am

I took a totally stock 4T on a 2000 mile weekend trip... the only problem I had was the vapor lock system issue... get a vented (green) gas cap...