Advice on Purchasing Black Jack Buddy '09. First Time!

gsg12 · Post by **gsg12** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 4:44 pm

Hey All,

I am new here to the message boards. First time poster.. as well as first time potential purchaser of a scooter. I have been doing research through out the summer regarding scooters, as well as perusing craigslist for potential purchases.

There is currently a 2009 Black Jack Buddy 150 for sale. Tires are brand new, scooter is cosmetically great (stored in garage), 6000 miles. Post is offering $1900.

I've done some research on current/recent past posts for Black Jacks, and it seems that $1900 seems a bit high for a scooter that has 6k miles. He is the original owner, and was purchased locally in our hometown. Santa Barbara is generally flat, so I'd assume with the lack of hills/climbs, there hasn't been much stress on the engine.

According to KBB, the trade in value is $1600, while suggested retail is $2400. Link: http://www.kbb.com/motorcycles/genuine/ ... me=scooter

As a first time scooter inquirer, how should I look into this? I know it is difficult to understand how many miles can be applied to an engine, but is there any concern when the mileage is around 6000? Any large servicing that should be expected?

I have seen similar models posted with 8-9K and were being sold around $1300-1500. Any advice would be greatly appreciated.. since you all here are the experienced ones!

I am meeting up with the seller this evening-- if there is any other advice/questions I may need to help understand the scooter, please let me know!

ed85379 · Post by **ed85379** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 4:52 pm

I'd say if it has new tires, and has been well treated, that is a good price. Ask him how often he did oil changes, of course. I change mine every 1000 miles.

Also, make sure that it has the Prima exhaust installed (can't tell from the photo), because without that, it isn't a *true* Blackjack.

I love mine. I am getting close to 6K miles myself, and it is still running beautifully. The only issue I have is that I've had to replace the center support bracket for the top-case twice now. Must be the incredibly bumpy Boston roads.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 5:03 pm

That price seems reasonable to me for a bike in good physical and mechanical condition (as your check of KBB confirmed). I personally don't think 6k is a problem. Around here I have never seen a BlackJack for sale in the $1300-$1500 range unless it had body damage.

gsg12 · Post by **gsg12** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 6:10 pm

Thank you both! It helps me a little more with my confidence. I'm excited to check it out.. and hopefully make it a new home!

I'll check on the prima exhaust. From reading other posts-- are those generally a little louder than a basic exhaust?

Cheers!

ed85379 · Post by **ed85379** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 6:39 pm

gsg12 wrote:Thank you both! It helps me a little more with my confidence. I'm excited to check it out.. and hopefully make it a new home!

I'll check on the prima exhaust. From reading other posts-- are those generally a little louder than a basic exhaust?

Cheers!

Louder yes, and deeper. Motorcyclists have told me it makes it sound like a "mini-Harley". It's chrome and looks more like a regular muffler, without the "shield" that the stock exhaust has on it. It also improves the power/speed, which is the point.

I also highly recommend getting a windshield if you want real speed. Since I installed mine, I now take it on the highway every day for my commute, and get it up to 75+ mph indicated. Love it.

RoaringTodd · Post by **RoaringTodd** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 6:45 pm

there is that "rarity" factor that bumps the price up a little. If it was the 125, I would say you had room to waggle. Not so much with a limited release like the Blackjack.

Doesn't hurt to ask for his "best price" though.

RT

PeteH · Post by **PeteH** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 6:52 pm

Check the tires. I don't know the brands well enough to determine from the photo, but it's hard as hell to find 10" tubeless whitewalls. So if indeed they're 'new', what brand and size are they? They could indeed be new (low miles), but perhaps because they're new/old stock, meaning they've been sitting/dryrotting for a while.

ed85379 · Post by **ed85379** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 6:54 pm

PeteH wrote:Check the tires - it's hard as hell to find 10" tubeless whitewalls, so if indeed they're 'new', what brand and size are they? They could indeed be new (low miles), but perhaps because they're new/old stock, meaning they've been sitting/dryrotting for a while.

Hard as what?

http://www.scooterworks.com/prima-white ... ts-366.php

My dealer just installed a brand new one of these onto my scooter a few weeks ago. Not exactly hard to come by.

Tocsik · Post by **Tocsik** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 6:57 pm

If it has been properly maintained and you get no other red flags, scoop that sucker up!

Since it was garaged and has aftermarket mirrors, a top case with matching helmet and the black rear rack, chances are it was babied!

6K is barely broken-in but would be a lot of miles for the rear tire. It looks like it has the original Maxxis whitewalls and those aren't available anymore. But, there's a chance the rear tire was replaced around 4K miles (that's about all they last).

The pic looks like it has the Prima exhaust but there's just a hint of a heat shield protruding on the other side and Prima's don't have a shield. On second thought, that's just the plastic around the reflector on the mudflap; not a heat shield. I would bet it's the Prima pipe. Even if it didn't have that pipe, it's a good deal.

BeefSupreme · Post by **BeefSupreme** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 6:58 pm

That picture it does look like it has the Prima exhaust installed. Also for the price note that you're ALSO getting a rear rack AND top case. That's close to $200 worth of add-ons. (i'm guessing they're planning on selling those with it being as they're pictured)

PeteH · Post by **PeteH** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 7:01 pm

ed85379 wrote:
PeteH wrote:Check the tires - it's hard as hell to find 10" tubeless whitewalls, so if indeed they're 'new', what brand and size are they? They could indeed be new (low miles), but perhaps because they're new/old stock, meaning they've been sitting/dryrotting for a while.
Hard as what?

http://www.scooterworks.com/prima-white ... ts-366.php

My dealer just installed a brand new one of these onto my scooter a few weeks ago. Not exactly hard to come by.

Sorry - should have been more specific. I need to go back and search, but I thought there have been issues with the Prima, and maybe the Maxxis before that, reported here. I really meant to say that it's hard to find top-branded whitewalls (Heidenau, Continental, Pirelli, etc.)

Tocsik · Post by **Tocsik** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 8:33 pm

PeteH wrote:
Sorry - should have been more specific. I need to go back and search, but I thought there have been issues with the Prima, and maybe the Maxxis before that, reported here. I really meant to say that it's hard to find top-branded whitewalls (Heidenau, Continental, Pirelli, etc.)

Yep, you're right on that. But, I've been much happier with my Michelin's than any other tire and several members (*cough* *cough* Eric) swear the Heidenaus are amaze-balls.
I think the Blackjack looks sweet with the whitewalls but the ride and handling quality are much more important than that!

gsg12 · Post by **gsg12** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 9:44 pm

You all rock! I'll let you know how it goes. Do a quick scan and see if there is anything else that is a red flag. Perhaps I can join this community as a buddy owner!

Cheers,
Garrett

NikVee · Post by **NikVee** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 9:57 pm

Just thought I'd poke my head in. I got a Blackjack about 5 or 6 weeks ago for 1950. There was about 2100 miles on it, and probably would have felt like a happy camper even if it had the mileage the one you're looking at does.

skully93 · Post by **skully93** » Tue Aug 13, 2013 10:17 pm

I don't much care for the red topcase, but other than that, if it's been treated well, it's not a bad deal. you might be able to get the CL price of asking a couple hundred less, unless they are super firm.

I also echo what others have said about tires. if they're new, ride them until they wear out, after that, go Michelin or HK! It dramatically changed the way it felt and the braking for me.

The italia has the Prima on it, and I personally enjoy the tone.

Good luck!

MYSCTR · Post by **MYSCTR** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 11:32 am

PeteH wrote:
ed85379 wrote:
PeteH wrote:Check the tires - it's hard as hell to find 10" tubeless whitewalls, so if indeed they're 'new', what brand and size are they? They could indeed be new (low miles), but perhaps because they're new/old stock, meaning they've been sitting/dryrotting for a while.
Hard as what?

http://www.scooterworks.com/prima-white ... ts-366.php

My dealer just installed a brand new one of these onto my scooter a few weeks ago. Not exactly hard to come by.
Sorry I thought there have been issues with the Prima, and maybe the Maxxis before that, reported here. I really meant to say that it's hard to find top-branded whitewalls (Heidenau, Continental, Pirelli, etc.)

The only thing wrong with the MAXXIS stock white wall tires is you can not get them. They are holding what they have for new scooters going out the door and we were not told how long that would be.

The PRIMA white wall tire that was to replace the Maxxis is a great tire and holds the road well - the only thing we found against these are they did not last long enough - maybe too soft a compound for the roads we ride on with the riding style we ride. So we moved on yet we love the Buddy with white walls.

For a Buddy Black Jack in good condition the $1,900 is a great price.

Christophers · Post by **Christophers** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 12:04 pm

MYSCTR wrote:
For a Buddy Black Jack in good condition the $1,900 is a great price.

I completely agree.

Tocsik · Post by **Tocsik** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 5:52 pm

gsg12 - did you end up buying that BJ?

RoaringTodd · Post by **RoaringTodd** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 6:13 pm

Tocsik wrote:gsg12 - did you end up buying that BJ?

Double Ententre!

gsg12 · Post by **gsg12** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 6:31 pm

[quote="Tocsik"]gsg12 - did you end up buying that BJ?[/quote]

I got an awesome BJ. It was a quick exchange, but I came up quite happily. Negotiated down to 1800, threw in a handful of goodies like three helmets, gloves, oil change supplies. Serviced every 1000K, had to sell it because he had a horrible case of vertigo a year ago-- get's dizzy when wearing the helmet. Garaged since purchase, tires look great. Body is immaculate! Zipped that thing home like a kid with a bag of candy. This thing jams!

Nice to have the additional red case, but may take it off. All I need to do is add some flames to the sides and my helmet, and we're good.

Thanks for all your help!

gsg12 · Post by **gsg12** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 6:32 pm

Prima exhaust and tires.

gsg12 · Post by **gsg12** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 6:33 pm

aaand the front view of the BJ (SFW)

Tocsik · Post by **Tocsik** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 7:12 pm

Congrats! I'm jealous!

guzziknight · Post by **guzziknight** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 8:47 pm

Awesome!! We bought ours a few months ago, but it didn't have the Prima exhaust. I wonder if the dealership swapped it out...

gsg12 · Post by **gsg12** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 9:24 pm

I'm now part of the family!

Tocsik · Post by **Tocsik** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 9:37 pm

Welcome!

ed85379 · Post by **ed85379** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 9:49 pm

guzziknight wrote:Awesome!! We bought ours a few months ago, but it didn't have the Prima exhaust. I wonder if the dealership swapped it out...

They come from the factory with the stock Buddy exhaust, because the Prima exhaust is not technically street legal in many states, for whatever stupid reason (emissions, I believe). But it comes with the Prima exhaust boxed, and it is up to the dealer to install it before they sell it, if the buyer wants it.

If your dealer didn't at least give you the boxed exhaust, and they charged you for a BlackJack, then they were ripping you off.

MYSCTR · Post by **MYSCTR** » Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:20 pm

Whoop!

First order of business after removing the top case and adding flames... BLACK OUT KIT!

Look Out!

Congrats!

guzziknight · Post by **guzziknight** » Thu Aug 15, 2013 9:15 am

ed85379 wrote:
guzziknight wrote:Awesome!! We bought ours a few months ago, but it didn't have the Prima exhaust. I wonder if the dealership swapped it out...
They come from the factory with the stock Buddy exhaust, because the Prima exhaust is not technically street legal in many states, for whatever stupid reason (emissions, I believe). But it comes with the Prima exhaust boxed, and it is up to the dealer to install it before they sell it, if the buyer wants it.

If your dealer didn't at least give you the boxed exhaust, and they charged you for a BlackJack, then they were ripping you off.

We bought it used from a Genuine dealer, so either they took it in that way, or changed it out while servicing it.

Wolfhound · Post by **Wolfhound** » Thu Aug 15, 2013 10:13 am

You got an excellent deal!! Congrats!! Personally I would keep the top case or swap it for a black one. You would be surprised at all the stuff you can
store in one.

BeefSupreme · Post by **BeefSupreme** » Thu Aug 15, 2013 3:13 pm

Congrats, that's an awesome looking scoot!
I'd spray paint that topcase flat black but leave a strip of tape on it to let the red show through.

Wolfhound · Post by **Wolfhound** » Thu Aug 15, 2013 3:32 pm

BeefSupreme has the best idea yet as to the top case. The red strip would compliment the red seat piping and tire rims. A win-win situation!!

Tocsik · Post by **Tocsik** » Thu Aug 15, 2013 3:40 pm

Wolfhound wrote:BeefSupreme has the best idea yet as to the top case. The red strip would compliment the red seat piping and tire rims. A win-win situation!!

+!.
A great opportunity to try PlastiDip. Use the flat black to match the BlackJack scheme.

Another option is to use black reflective tape to make a checkerboard pattern on the top case. That way, it's black-and-red checkerboard but gives you extra reflective visibility at night.