all I can say is ouch...

kmrcstintn · Post by **kmrcstintn** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 6:55 am

http://www.streetfire.net/video/motor-s ... 049820.htm

Uncle Groucho · Post by **Uncle Groucho** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 10:03 am

The video isn't loading for me but reading those comments just reaffirms that there's no love between gearheads and scooterists.

amy · Post by **amy** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 1:20 pm

Here's what I see:
That scooter was tailgating the car in front of him. Then, he went to change lanes (I'm presuming to pass on the right, which is NOT the way to pass and drives me CRAZY when people do it) and didn't signal with his blinkers or use a hand signal.

The CAR was ALSO passing on the right to get around the slowed down traffic AND was speeding AND not paying attention to other vehicles. Even if the scoot HAD looked, from the angle he was at it would have been difficult to gauge just how fast the car was coming up.

We all know that looking straight on at a moving vehicle doesn't give you an accurate idea of its speed...its almost "static" as opposed to seeing one from the side where the view is more "dynamic".

Both made poor choices, but that scoot really needed to be more defensive in driving.

AWinn6889 · Post by **AWinn6889** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 2:45 pm

I bet he quickly regretted wearing shorts and flip flops that day!

Rudie · Post by **Rudie** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 3:13 pm

The first time I ever rode a scooter it slid out from under me when i made a left hand turn and hit a patch of gravel. I was wearing shorts and flip flops (I was on vacation). I had road rash in places i didn't think possible.

While it is awful that this happened. I appreciate seeing things like this to remind me to drive defensively and to think about next time I am tempted to wear shorts when I go riding.

Mousenut · Post by **Mousenut** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 3:22 pm

That could have been so much worse. I do have to give him credit for how he acted right after the hit. He looked as if he was concerned for the car driver and he got his scoot out of the way as soon as he could.

It looks like his luggage box pushed him forward some where if it wasn't there the scoot might have been knocked completely out from under him in one shot having him land on his feet (nubs). Not sure if the box helped or hurt him.

skully93 · Post by **skully93** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:08 pm

I think both people should be forced to take the bus for 1 year, no driving.

not sure what speed they were going, but it looked like a highway. the scooter was definitely too close and then used no signals. the driver was definitely speeding. comedy of errors, thankfully no one seemed seriously injured.

Tom · Post by **Tom** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 4:49 pm

Wow. That guy is quick on his feet though.

jijifer · Post by **jijifer** » Tue Apr 17, 2012 6:39 pm

there was plenty of room for the car to stop and you could see it the car accelerating. When you hit something from behind you're 99% of the time at fault and i'd say this guy was for sure.

still cringe when I see people scooting in flip flops and shorts

LunaP · Post by **LunaP** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 9:33 am

jijifer wrote:there was plenty of room for the car to stop and you could see it the car accelerating. When you hit something from behind you're 99% of the time at fault and i'd say this guy was for sure.

still cringe when I see people scooting in flip flops and shorts

This.

The scooter driver was being stupid, but I disagree that any of the blame lies on him for this accident- the car driver was STILL ACCELERATING when he hit the scooter! Just like me, regardless of if that guy had signaled and looked, I bet you he would have looked and seen no car, and as he merged over the car would have come speeding into sight.
(I rewatched the vid a few times, and looking really hard just as the driver's head comes into any sort of decent view, I think I can see him turning his head forward again from checking his blind spot a first time... then he checks it again mid-merge right before he gets hit, I assume because he sees the car in a mirror or hears its engine or his spider senses are tingling... but there's no way to be sure my eyes aren't playing tricks on me about the first check, its not fantastic quality video).

I do think he's dumb for wearing tennys loose enough to go flying off and shorts and a tee, though, on what looks like a highway. Thankfully, his topcase kept him from ending up under the car that hit him, and instead he slid off sideways and jumped right back up, and got right out of traffic immediately.

I'll defend him a little for passing on the right- although it doesn't look like this was a case where it was necessary for the scooter driver... although it's illegal technically, most everybody does it SOMETIMES, just like rolling stops through stop signs. But I'd also like to point out that for all we know he wasn't passing, but rather preparing to take a right exit or turn ahead. The car driver on the other hand, began revving and accelerating and passed at least 2 cars before hitting the scooter- he wasn't passing anyone in particular, he just wanted to hit the gas pedal and blast down the mostly empty right lane like a total dickhead.

lovemysan · Post by **lovemysan** » Wed Apr 18, 2012 2:19 pm

The car is driving too fast in this situation. Another 2 seconds and the car would have braked having caught up with slow moving traffic. The car driver is also at fault for not seeing that the scooter rider is changing lanes. In his defense the turn signals are tiny on the scooter and sunlight is bleaching them out. Clearly the car is under hard braking when it strikes the scooter. You can clearly hear the clutch is applied and the tires load up and squeal. Also, the scooter rider is applying the brakes before/when he is struck. Had he been at full throttle the impact would have been less severe. In this case the scooter rider merged in front of a fast moving car. Both persons made poor decisions.

Abbott · Post by **Abbott** » Thu Apr 19, 2012 3:56 am

Is it normal for people to just videotape their driving?

Wiggins · Post by **Wiggins** » Thu Apr 19, 2012 4:48 am

My first question would be where was this filmed? There seems to be a lot of slower traffic on the left (relative to traffic, not the striking car), and some of the vehicles look a little odd for something you would find stateside. It is possible that this happened in a place where the right lane is the fast lane.

If I were investigating this I would write it up as the scooter being the at fault driver. Both rider and driver are operating their rigs like idiots, but (assuming this happened stateside) the car has the right of way and it is the scooter rider's responsibility to make sure the lane is clear before crossing into it.

The car was likely speeding, but the scooter was following too closely, failed to do a proper head check until after he was in the other lane, and did not signal when he changed lanes. At first I thought the car might have been distracted because his reaction time seemed slow, but I realized it seemed that way because I knew what was going to happen. The driver started to break just over a second after it became apparent that the scooter was changing lanes (and not shifting his lane position) with the collision happening at around 1.5 seconds. This is on the better side of people's normal reaction time, so he doesn't seem to be distracted.

Kyle

Scooterboi · Post by **Scooterboi** » Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:45 pm

Some points
- At the very begining there is an accident.
- It's hard to see (bigger shadows on right etc.) but if you look, the drivers are in the right seat of several vehicles, so the filming car is in the fast lane.
- the Scooter doesn't signal and starts looking AFTER he has initiated the lane change. He is already in the fast lane before he turns around enough to actually see the car. I have to believe that the scooter still didn't actually see the car, but then again (the way he's driving) he might just be that arrogant.
- The Car is accelerating regardless of the traffic, the accident, or anything else. He also just parks his car in the fast lane after the accident rather than pulling it over. I know this because the driver shows up at the end of the clip standing on the shoulder making a call.
- Countries that drive on the left are in the minority and asian countries with left drive are bordered by at least one right drive country - some like Malaysia and Thailand are surrounded.

IMHO the fault lies with the scooter, but the car was being oblivious too.

TobyDanger · Post by **TobyDanger** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:58 am

This video is a year or two old, you can probably search and find more info about it. It happened in Hong Kong (which does drive on the left), so the car was in the passing/fast lane. You can also see the scooterist brake when he finally realizes there is a car rapidly approaching behind him. Possibly the car would have even stopped in time, had the scooter not braked.

I feel badly for the scooter, but IMO poor situational awareness, poor lane planning and execution, poor emergency situation reactions, poor gear choices... Changing any one of those could have lead to a much better result. Glad he looks more or less ok.

Swordsman · Post by **Swordsman** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:35 pm

Yeah, watch the right edge of the screen just before the impact. You can see the trees slow noticeably. The driver was trying to stop, but the scooter was braking too (which is a bad idea when you just cut someone off).

So, you have a scooterist not looking before darting into the fast lane with no turn signal, and a car in the fast lane that can't brake in time.

Fault- scooterist.

Bet he buys some gear after that. Once the adrenaline wore off, he probably felt like he'd been hit by a car (BAZINGA!

)

~SM

pdxrita · Post by **pdxrita** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 2:58 pm

I'd agree that the scooterist is at fault, from a practical point of view, but maybe not from a legal point of view if this had happened in the states. If you rear end someone, you're almost always considered to be at fault.

The driver is clearly accelerating in the 20 seconds or so leading up to the crash. You can hear his engine shifting up. Maybe this is because he passed an accident scene earlier and was now coming back up to speed, or maybe it was because he was intentionally testing the limits of his vehicle? He was, after all, moving a lot faster than the adjacent traffic. This could be why he was filming. Now, if it were me driving, I think because I am a rider, I would have noticed the moves that the scooter was making and expected that he might shift lanes; being a rider has made me a better driver, I think. The driver did clearly brake hard before impact and that reaction probably saved the scooterists life, since the car stopped just short of running him over. IMO, bad behavior on the part of both of them, but the scooterist is the one who almost paid with his life.

NathanielSalzman · Post by **NathanielSalzman** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 5:37 pm

Abbott wrote:Is it normal for people to just videotape their driving?

I wonder that as well...

TobyDanger · Post by **TobyDanger** » Fri Apr 20, 2012 7:39 pm

NathanielSalzman wrote:
Abbott wrote:Is it normal for people to just videotape their driving?
I wonder that as well...

Some countries, Russia is a good example, are notorious for accident scams and fraud. Many drivers have dashboard cameras to protect themselves legally from scam artists.
Check out: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FRC7RO2tOJQ

There are a lot of other amazing videos from Russian cams.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dcMSTmoNd_0
Watch all the way to the end on this one for a different perspective:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=okvtSmOY-tQ

I usually have my GoPro on my bike when riding, 99% of the time it's boring commuter footage, but maybe something interesting will happen in front of me, or heaven forbid, if I'm ever involved in an accident, hopefully the footage will help prove that I wasn't at fault, or mysteriously disappear...

Wiggins · Post by **Wiggins** » Sat Apr 21, 2012 12:26 am

I have gone to a ton of accident calls in my career and the reason why a driver who rear ends someone is at fault most of the time is because the driver who rear ends someone generally does something to prevent them from stopping and creates fault (like texting while driving, following too closely, etc). In this case the driver was cut off by a careless scooter operator. He couldn't stop.

Contrary to popular belief there are no firm rules about who is at fault in accidents. Pedestrians can be at fault, the guy who rear ends somebody is not always at fault, and just because someone calls 911 first does not make them right (my personal favorite!).

Kyle

Jana · Post by **Jana** » Mon Apr 30, 2012 10:29 pm

Holy cow....

I'm still scratching my head at the end of the replay when the driver gets out of his car, and doesn't go check on the scooterrider, but immediately checks his front bumper for damage. Granted, the rider is mobile (lucky him), but still.....

Seems like both were at fault, but remember that being right doesn't matter squat if you're dead.

Thanks for posting this, just as a reminder to us all to be careful, wear proper clothing, and remember that the rest of the drivers on the road either don't see you, or they're aiming for you!