What is new for 2013 from Genuine?

Len · Post by **Len** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 2:18 pm

Any ideas on what will be coming in the way of new scooters, improvements, or updates on scooters coming out of Genuine in this coming year?

Rumors?

Confirmed info?

skully93 · Post by **skully93** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 2:48 pm

Phil has said there would be some exciting things, but hasn't said a word what they might be

.

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 3:24 pm

*fingers crossed* 350cc Stella.

stASH · Post by **stASH** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 3:27 pm

Stitch wrote:*fingers crossed* 350cc Stella.

cue images of parts flying off of a Stella with that big of an engine bolted on.

ravenlore · Post by **ravenlore** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 4:08 pm

Stitch wrote:*fingers crossed* 350cc Stella.

I would settle for 200cc with cvt.

and by "settle" I mean "buy the first black one that shows up at my local shop"

Syd · Post by **Syd** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 4:33 pm

Peabody and I are anxiously awaiting this:

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 4:47 pm

Stitch wrote:*fingers crossed* 350cc Stella.

On the long list of things Genuine might do, that particular one must be near the bottom. Now, PGO is certainly capable of producing a bike in that class but, if you are truly interested in a 350 highway machine - go test ride a BV 350

. The price is even quite attractive.

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:33 pm

I can get a used helix, seca 2, p200e, and a moped for what the bv costs.

And pieces fall off my current Stella. I don't see why a 350 would be worse.
We can even modernize it. 350cc 4t, with a five speed, water cooled, fuel injected, and with a five gallon top tank. Maybe throw in some tubeless tires while you are at it. Taadaa! A commuter scooter.

az_slynch · Post by **az_slynch** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:12 pm

Stitch wrote:We can even modernize it. 350cc 4t, with a five speed, water cooled, fuel injected, and with a five gallon top tank. Maybe throw in some tubeless tires while you are at it. Taadaa! A commuter scooter.

Just get a P200E, swap in a 62mm stroker and kit it with a Pinasco 215 kit. You'll have 232ccs of grunt and enough torque to pull long gears. Might be worth looking at a 2T EFI kit to offset the thirst of that sort of setup. Tubeless is easy, rims are finally available. Get some 10" tires that have a speed rating higher than "J" (62mph) and a Stella fork and headset for real brakes.

Frankly, my biggest concern would be the capabilities of the chassis. I've had the P over 75 on an 8% downhill grade and it was a bit hairy to ride at that speed.

RoaringTodd · Post by **RoaringTodd** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:16 pm

Fingers crossed for a 200cc CVT Stella too...

az_slynch · Post by **az_slynch** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:29 pm

RoaringTodd wrote:Fingers crossed for a 200cc CVT Stella too...

The LML Star automatic is currently available as a 125 only. The engine is GY6-based, so maybe there will be a 150 and a 170-180cc variant. A 200 would probably required a lot of modification and don't know how well that would work. It seems as though the 125cc has a lot of extra chassis louvers and air-routing ductwork as-is. The extra heat generated by a 200 might not be managable for the chassis and it's extra cooling.

RoaringTodd · Post by **RoaringTodd** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:17 pm

az_slynch wrote:A 200 would probably required a lot of modification and don't know how well that would work. The extra heat generated by a 200 might not be managable for the chassis and it's extra cooling.

Has anyone called you a Scrooge lately? Its Christmas, and one can dream....

az_slynch · Post by **az_slynch** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 8:42 pm

RoaringTodd wrote: Has anyone called you a Scrooge lately? Its Christmas, and one can dream....

I've been called worse lately, but that's besides the point.

LML has delivered on the "vintage bike with a modern engine", and that's the wish that needed to be fulfilled. I can all-but-guarantee that this machine will perform more like a modern bike than the geared Stellas ever will and that even with a 150cc it will give a 200cc geared Stella a run for it's money. My old P-series 200 has been given a good race by a 125cc Buddy, so I think it's not too much of a stretch for GY6-engined Stella to perform in a similar manner.

My point is, don't worry about the engine size thats tagged on the bodywork; it's marketing hype. Forget what you know of Stella performance, because the automatic is a whole different animal. Just be jazzed that it's no longer a pipe dream and focus your dreams on it finding it's way here sooner than later.

Tazio · Post by **Tazio** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 9:45 pm

Now that I've got the Ural, I want a 1500cc Stella Gold Wing.

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:35 pm

Tazio wrote:Now that I've got the Ural, I want a 1500cc Stella Gold Wing.

Even better!

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:43 pm

az_slynch wrote:
Stitch wrote:We can even modernize it. 350cc 4t, with a five speed, water cooled, fuel injected, and with a five gallon top tank. Maybe throw in some tubeless tires while you are at it. Taadaa! A commuter scooter.
Just get a P200E, swap in a 62mm stroker and kit it with a Pinasco 215 kit. You'll have 232ccs of grunt and enough torque to pull long gears. Might be worth looking at a 2T EFI kit to offset the thirst of that sort of setup. Tubeless is easy, rims are finally available. Get some 10" tires that have a speed rating higher than "J" (62mph) and a Stella fork and headset for real brakes.

Frankly, my biggest concern would be the capabilities of the chassis. I've had the P over 75 on an 8% downhill grade and it was a bit hairy to ride at that speed.

You would need a slightly longer wheelbase, and maybe a little stronger frame. Maybe change the rake a little bit too. I would just like to see genuine stomp the old p200's.

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Sat Dec 15, 2012 3:55 am

a 220cc bubu would be sweet

you listening, pgo!

az_slynch · Post by **az_slynch** » Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:46 am

Stitch wrote:You would need a slightly longer wheelbase, and maybe a little stronger frame. Maybe change the rake a little bit too. I would just like to see genuine stomp the old p200's.

I promise that it doesn't take that much. I built Howardr's Stella after the big end failure. It's only 175cc, but it will stomp a stock P200 in acceleration and soon, top speed. The cylinder is a Malossi 166, the crank is a Mazzuchelli 60mm stroker and the exhaust is a SIP Road, but the rest of it is pretty stock.

I also built a 187cc Fireball, and it will whip a P200 on level ground. Add in an uphill grade and it was even worse on the P.

Both still run Autolube and a 20mm Carb. Dell'Orto #3 slide for the Malossi kit, the the rest was just jetting.

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:49 am

By stomp, I mean bone stock Stella vs p200.
I guess it is prolly such a small market in the US that it wouldn't be worth the research and retooling. Plus the EPA would probably kill it before it got off the boat.

RoaringTodd · Post by **RoaringTodd** » Wed Dec 19, 2012 11:58 am

I'm still holding out hope for a vintage styled automatic that can compete with the modern Vespas... and with 200 or more cc's.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:29 pm

RoaringTodd wrote:I'm still holding out hope for a vintage styled automatic that can compete with the modern Vespas... and with 200 or more cc's.

If you mean compete performance-wise - it ain't gonna happen. A water-cooled 200/250/300 Vespa puts out so much more power than the older design Stella 2T and 4T engines that they just aren't going to be in the same ballgame. If you mean who will buy what - everyone has their personal preferences, of course, and many things drive that.

Swordsman · Post by **Swordsman** » Wed Dec 19, 2012 6:39 pm

A Blur that isn't uncomfortable? And since we're "dreaming", for $3000?

(Disclaimer: I have zero personal experience on a Blur. Comment based solely on months of Internet research)

~SM

RoaringTodd · Post by **RoaringTodd** » Wed Dec 19, 2012 7:01 pm

Dooglas wrote:
RoaringTodd wrote:I'm still holding out hope for a vintage styled automatic that can compete with the modern Vespas... and with 200 or more cc's.
If you mean compete performance-wise - it ain't gonna happen. A water-cooled 200/250/300 Vespa puts out so much more power than the older design Stella 2T and 4T engines that they just aren't going to be in the same ballgame. If you mean who will buy what - everyone has their personal preferences, of course, and many things drive that.

In other words - repackage the Blur into a vintage style scooter.... with a flat seat.

Alexbv200 · Post by **Alexbv200** » Wed Dec 19, 2012 10:04 pm

Apart from new colors possibly after 1st Quarter 13 don't expect much.
2013 models (excelt Stella) have been around since early summer.

Pink is already discontinued and no longer available.

2013 Stellas will be available only after May 2013.

mattgordon · Post by **mattgordon** » Thu Dec 20, 2012 4:36 am

Dooglas wrote:
RoaringTodd wrote:I'm still holding out hope for a vintage styled automatic that can compete with the modern Vespas... and with 200 or more cc's.
If you mean compete performance-wise - it ain't gonna happen. A water-cooled 200/250/300 Vespa puts out so much more power than the older design Stella 2T and 4T engines that they just aren't going to be in the same ballgame. If you mean who will buy what - everyone has their personal preferences, of course, and many things drive that.

I'm of the opinion that bigger, faster scooters and "vintage styling" aren't going to be found on the same scooter as products tend to evolve. From any manufacturer. Sure there will be vintage styling cues, but not vintage styling.

IMO that is why Vespa still offers legacy products (in some markets, not here) and newer, modern-er (?) Vespas for those wanting more performance.

viney266 · Post by **viney266** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:51 am

Syd wrote:Peabody and I are anxiously awaiting this:

^^^^ I put my deposit down over 2 years ago...STILL waiting.

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:25 pm

A 250 liquid-cooled Blur like they get overseas.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 4:53 pm

sc00ter wrote:A 250 liquid-cooled Blur like they get overseas.

Well, sure. A bigger PGO in the Genuine line has always been a possibility. Could be a 250. 350, or 500. The question, though, is whether people like Phil McCaleb see any signs that it would sell well. The 220 Blur certainly does not. Piaggio and Aprilia have discontinued their 500 scooters in the US and pinned their hopes on the 350 engine. I think it would take a real sales success to convince Genuine that it would be worth doing. The only real success in the US among larger scooters has been the 250/300 GTS Vespa. That is certainly a more powerful ride than the small frame scooters and has maintained some classic styling along with modern mechanical features - but is also fairly spendy. I would guess that the industry is carefully watching sales of the BV 350 in the US for signs of where to go next. The 350 has buckets of power, is mechanically innovative, and is less expensive than a Vespa GTS - but will it be a sales success?

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 5:41 pm

viney266 wrote:
Syd wrote:Peabody and I are anxiously awaiting this:

^^^^ I put my deposit down over 2 years ago...STILL waiting.

If the batman rainbow unicorn Stella ever hits the showroom floor, ill be in line with my checkbook or 3 kidneys (if I happen to be more than 2nd in line).

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 5:48 pm

In a podcast interview this spring, The Leader Dork said they were expecting a high percentage of sales to be new riders, and that they usually end up in the 50cc to 250cc range.
Honest guess, maybe a special model, and maybe some upgrades to the existing lineup (suspension and brakes a lá Psycho). And maybe an auto Stella.

az_slynch · Post by **az_slynch** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 6:22 pm

Stitch wrote:In a podcast interview this spring, The Leader Dork said they were expecting a high percentage of sales to be new riders, and that they usually end up in the 50cc to 250cc range.
Honest guess, maybe a special model, and maybe some upgrades to the existing lineup (suspension and brakes a lá Psycho). And maybe an auto Stella.

We could just be goofballs and hunt down a wrecked Blur 220i and graft the driveline into a new auto Stella to make a vintage-style sport-tourer. I can imagine the badging now: Stella 220 STi...

sc00ter · Post by **sc00ter** » Sat Dec 22, 2012 5:44 am

I fully understand Dooglas! No manufacturer wants to get stuck with a poor selling product. Or a importer either. Or a dealer! I really like the new Vespas, but the price is a tad steep for cheap transportation to me. Always loved the Kymco GrandVista but I had a People 250 for a short while, so I will just keep my distance. The thing is, all of us want a cheap price-but not poorly made China junk. One half wants rocket bike styling, the other half wants retro. The Buddy to me is like a VW Bug. It can be made into a little racer, sensible run-about (thats me), rat bike, cute, old school retro, etc. Being reliable helps also. But a liquid cooled 250 Blur...... That could sway me!