Saw a smart car in Tulsa today.

Elm Creek Smith · Post by **Elm Creek Smith** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 3:29 am

I was riding north on S 145th E Ave when a white smart passed me going the other way. It was cute, but all I could think was that I was getting almost three times the gas mileage and having more fun. My 2003 PT Cruiser gets close to the mileage the smart does and holds four people. My 2008 Chevy Colorado gets 20-24 mpg and can carry (not tow) my boat.

I think the smart may be a solution in search of a question.

ECS

alienmeatsack · Post by **alienmeatsack** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 3:40 am

I've seen a few of them lately.

And I wonder what the appeal is. I mean, it's not pretty looking for sure, it's tiny, and it's well... a clown car. lol. I keep expecting like 20 clowns to step out when they stop!

armacham · Post by **armacham** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 3:45 am

The problem is that they gimped the US versions in regards to the gas mileage. They put a non-turbo Mitsubishi engine in instead of the turbocharged mercedes benz powerplant, so it gets about 20% fewer miles per gallon. If you were to get the diesel version you could get upwards of 65-70 mpg, but they won't sell it here.

alienmeatsack · Post by **alienmeatsack** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 3:50 am

Of course not. Because America's power is in the hands of people who make their living off gas and oil.

Someone could invent a way to burn household garbage and get 300MPG, that produced beer, wine and water as emissions and the creators would be assassinated, buried and the project would disappear.

Gas and Oil has that much power.

I do my part to guzzle gas and pollute the environment so I don't get whacked.

pugbuddy · Post by **pugbuddy** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 4:19 am

Ain't it the truth.

I drove the Smart car when they had them out on Cherry Street and wasn't impressed. The lack of gas mileage sealed it for me--if I got a car, it would be the 2006 Scion XB or 2007 XD. No need for the Smart car.

alienmeatsack · Post by **alienmeatsack** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 4:23 am

Not to mention the very idea that a car could be more intelligent than me! I mean, hello! I am the smart one here. I don't need my car correcting me at parties or making me clean up my mess and sort my garbage correctly so it can be recycled. WTFudge is that all about anyway?

Post by **ericalm** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 7:49 am

I have seen 15 around LA so far, not counting those near the dealer.
Only seen 3 Mini Clubmen, though I know they're selling a lot of 'em.

I considered the Smart. One test drive convinced me it wasn't right for my needs. Given the specs, etc., I don't think it has much practical value for people outside urban areas. Even then, there are plenty of small cars on the market these days—just not quite that small.

Really, in LA you can sell anything that's new, novel and cute.

DrDiff · Post by **DrDiff** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 8:20 am

For me a Smart car is not practical. I need 4 seets when I have my sons.

That same reason is why a Scooter will not work for me either. Can't take a 7 year old and a 5 year old and their luggage and me on a Scooter.

charltons · Post by **charltons** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 12:06 pm

pugbuddy wrote:Ain't it the truth.

I drove the Smart car when they had them out on Cherry Street and wasn't impressed. The lack of gas mileage sealed it for me--if I got a car, it would be the 2006 Scion XB or 2007 XD. No need for the Smart car.

our scion xb has 2x the room and a little better gas mileage.

alienmeatsack · Post by **alienmeatsack** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 2:55 pm

Wouldn't it just make more sense anyway to find a good reliable normal car with decent mileage like you said, like the XB or whatever and go with that?

I understand repairs on hybrids and the smart cars is a real wallet killer. And you aren't really making much savings after you pay for the car anyway.

rajron · Post by **rajron** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 3:38 pm

I see them all around here – there is a dealer a few miles away so we took a look at them – right next to a scooter dealer (same owner).
Those cars are expensive – for such a small car!
Deceptively low MPG because they use the new EPA standard.
Whatever the case I will not be getting one anytime soon.

MikieTaps · Post by **MikieTaps** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 3:47 pm

My girlfriend was looking into getting one. They are all over Seattle. They are awesome for city cars because you can park them anywhere, you can parallel into pretty much any odd gap between cars, or even pull straight in or back straight in…I can totally see their appeal for big city usage.

dru_ · Post by **dru_** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 4:44 pm

Let me preface this with an old Flavor Flav line:

"Don't believe the hype".

Now, let's talk

I love cars, and I love scooters, each for their own reasons. I hated my last car, and I'm thrilled to be rid of it for a number of reasons.

My primary transportation is a Piaggio BV500. I have to other options, when the BV is down for maintenance or I just want a change of pace, I ride my Kymco People 250, if the weather sucks, or I have to take one of the kids to some event, then I revert to my car.

Until about 4 weeks ago, that car was a Chrysler Pacifica with a 6cyl that was 'rated' at 21mpg. In the 3 years I owned it, I never saw better than 19, and rarely better than 16. My wife's car is a Dodge Durango with a Hemi, it is rated for 13/16 and regularly gets 17/18.

FWIW, I get between 52-65 on the BV500, depending heavily on how I'm riding that day/week.

Which brings me to 4 weeks ago, when I replaced the Pacifica with a new Smart. Bear in mind, MPG was not a major factor in my decision. Size (fits in a garage bay with my 2 bicycles,2 scooters and a lawn mower), fun factor (go kart handling/convertible), and in 2-3 years it will become my oldest daughters first car.

Since then, I've put 1500 miles on the Smart, as much to break it in, as because it is fun to drive. I see alot of comments above are from people that have not spent more than the 5 minute controlled 'road show' demo day drives, so what I have to say may ruffle some feathers on the assumptions. I've also driven the Euro Spec 450 car with it's 'other' engine on US roads.

First, let's talk about what the Smart is NOT. It is not a Mini Cooper, which has a backseat, but it's worthless if the driver is over 6' tall (I am). It is not a pure MPG vehicle either. It's intended market is urban commuter, and there is no other vehicle currently shipping in the US that is a direct competitor.

So, let's talk about the car itself. Since taking delivery, I have driven all over the city of Atlanta, which is not noted for being a slow driving city, nor is it particularly kind to small vehicles. In the area I live, one of the local districts reports that the AVERAGE gross vehicle weight on it's roads is over 6000lbs. Folks, that's 20 Buddies. The average speed on GA-400, an interstate quality highway from the northern burbs into the city is 80+mph. (this is why I ride a BV500 instead of smaller, better options). In addition, I have taken the car through the North GA Mountains, across Fort Mountain and up the highway to Nashville, TN on interstates.

Having driven the older 450 car, I'll say right away, that the old 'more efficient deisel' that folks love to tout would not be up to the task. With a lower top speed and slower acceleration, the loss in efficiency is balanced by being ready for US roads. In the 451 car that I'm driving now, I've seen 90mph on the highway with no loss of stability. I've maintained 65 mph across Monteagle on I-24 in TN. I've run across the mountains of North GA keeping with traffic on roads that are very tight and twisty, and I've run around in an Urban setting where parking is tricky on a good day. It handles all of the above gracefully, and without feeling nearly as small as it is.

But what about that gas milage? over the course of the first 1500 miles I have seen a max of 62mpg (I was consciously working to drive with MPG in mind, and a minimum of 32mpg (I was flogging the car through some of the most fun roads in north atlanta at rates of speed that would give some sports cars some concerns

(I did mention that I used to autocross cars before I had kids right ?)). At the end of the day though, over 1500 miles, running primarily without the air conditioner since it *is* a cabrio and the top has been down more than it has been up, I have averaged 48mpg. That is well above the advertised numbers and well above the numbers I've seen in most reviews.

So, while it may not be for everyone, I don't think the above are giving it a fair shake.

Find another convertible, new, under $20k OTD (mine was 18.3k with some extras on it), with MPG above 35. Now take the same criteria, but give it an extra $10K and you are still sitting there with a very limited selection.

The hard top, you can find alternatives, but even they are quite limited, and have very different market targets, so most don't even offer some of the amenities like a 6 disc changer, leather seats, heated seats, fog lamps or other niceties available to the Smart customer.

Which is really my point. Right now, the Smart is in a niche market with few real competitors. That will change in the coming years, but for the next 12-18 months, there aren't any serious challengers, even in Europe, where the Smart has maintained a more upscale differentiation from the small Opel's, while BMW, Audi and VW have competed with a different target market in the same genre.

dru_ · Post by **dru_** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 4:58 pm

Forgot the all important pictures

http://www.twowheeljunction.com/blogs/d ... on_conver/

alienmeatsack · Post by **alienmeatsack** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 5:59 pm

dru - Nice write up from an owner's perspective!

babblefish · Post by **babblefish** » Wed Jun 11, 2008 7:35 pm

There are lots of Smart cars around here in San Francisco. Just makes a lot of sense in such a compact city. I'd love to get one for bad weather, heavy duty shopping sprees, etc. In case any one hasn't seen one:

How about a Smart electric?

Or the soon-to-be-in-America Think City:

MarsR · Post by **MarsR** » Thu Jun 12, 2008 2:54 am

Hey dru, thanks for the write-up. That's great. We have one of those in my neighborhood. I can see me and my wife in one of those, now that the kids all have their own wheels.

AxeYrCat · Post by **AxeYrCat** » Thu Jun 12, 2008 2:20 pm

alienmeatsack wrote:Someone could invent a way to burn household garbage and get 300MPG, that produced beer, wine and water as emissions and the creators would be assassinated, buried and the project would disappear.

I want that chiseled into a block of granite and put on public display somewhere.

I really like the SMART, and I'd love to have one as a commuter car...

I just really hate the transmission.

I am told by friends who own them (in Texas, of all places) that you very quickly get used to it, but I don't know if I could deal with it on the day-to-day.

dru_ · Post by **dru_** » Thu Jun 12, 2008 3:00 pm

AxeYrCat wrote: I just really hate the transmission.

This was my biggest hangup, but at this point, I actually really like it.

What I've found is that for most driving, I paddle shift, unless I'm on the highway or busy with my hands (eg, opening my water bottle for a drink). I bump the shifter over into auto mode in those cases.

In paddle mode, I don't find the transmission annoying, because the shift points make sense. But in auto mode, it's still a manual transmission, to it shifts like a manual, but does so at kinda wonky shift points (usually too low)

x-mojito50mod · Post by **x-mojito50mod** » Thu Jun 12, 2008 8:40 pm

I also like these, though they're not out quite yet...
http://www.toyota.co.uk/bv/1024downloads/IQGeneva.pdf