[NBR] SYM Classic (Wolf) 150

Post by **ericalm** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 12:49 am

Last discussed on MB quite a long time ago, the SYM Classic 150 is finally landing in dealers—in the West, at least. As far as I know the company still has no East Coast distribution and the painfully buggy and obsolete http://sym-usa.com still lists the defunct Carter Bros. as their distributor.

Regardless, the first group landed at my local shop (NoHo Scooters) this week and I went over today to check it out. I also got to take one out on a short test ride. While I didn't really put it to the test, I got a pretty good impression of the ride.

Pros:
Looks and styling. This is really what a lot of first time and other buyers are looking for. Cafe style, clip-on handlebars, low seat.
Small but comfortable.
Light and nimble—like a scooter, ha.
Surprisingly quick. Probably faster off the line than my Stella 4T but I didn't really push it on my ride.
Very reminiscent of '70s small displacement Hondas.
OTD price at NoHo: $3200

Cons:
The badges look a bit cheap. I'd pull off what I could.
The red, white and black and white looks great. The only other color I saw was a not-quite racing green that I didn't much like (but to each their own). Hope some other color options are or will be available. I've seen blue and white and orange and white combos of the Taiwanese version of the Wolf.
It's a motorcycle, but probably not good for freeway riding. Still just a 150.

Overall: Not a thorough review but if the quality is equal to other SYMs, this could be a great little bike. Good for a second ride and may have a lot of appeal to first time buyers on the fence between a scooter and motorcycle.

EDIT: Pics!

(Not the stock setup for the US!)

I've seen some crappy (small) pics of a more bobber-style version with a single seat and side bags. Customization kits may be available…

jrsjr · Post by **jrsjr** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 1:02 am

Well, that was unexpected. Pretty cool they finally showed up, though. I hope they turn out to be reasonably reliable.

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 1:20 am

I've seen those on the website before. It does look like a nice little basic moto. I expect it would be a little light for my chunky self, however.

The resemblance to Honda stuff might not be accidental. I believe they used to build for Honda. I'm pretty sure they did work for the automotive division, at least.

Then there's the Symba, a deadpan copy of the Honda Cub, although product improved, from the looks of it.

What did you think of the build quality generally?

Post by **ericalm** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 2:15 am

Good, but it's really hard to tell until it's been around a while. It's solid; vibrates a bit at higher speeds but that's expected.

SYM did build bikes for Honda some years ago. The Symbas are well made but (and I say this as someone who rides a Stella!) I still prefer the original Honda Cubs/Passports.

In general, SYM makes very good, reliable bikes. I haven't heard of any big issues with anything they sell in the US other than their scooters are (arguably) on the ugly side. Other than that, some of the best made ones on the market. If I was looking to buy, I'd definitely consider the Classic 150.

irishtim · Post by **irishtim** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 2:24 am

POC tested one awhile back and loved it. Here's Merrit Waters (Mrs. POC Phil) on the Wolf Classic:

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 2:30 am

I love that look. What with this and the new Suzuki TU 250 (btw, Suzuki took an ax to their product line), there seems to be a resurgence of interest in smaller, standard bikes. I think it's great. Hope it continues.

Oh yeah, and the new Honda 250 as well.

Post by **ericalm** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 4:08 am

I wish I could say these models are the harbingers of a return to making cool small-displacement MCs, but I think the motorcycle industry is in some ways where the (US) auto industry was a couple years ago: bigger is better and more expensive. Even scooters have been suffering from displacement creep!

It's hard to imagine Harley or even Ducati going back to making 250cc or smaller bikes and just as hard to imagine those selling well in the US. So many of the 250s out there (like the Ninja or the Rebel) are considered "starter bikes" and I have to say, there's something to that. Many of the buyers quickly move on to something larger.

viney266 · Post by **viney266** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 4:35 am

Good lookin' ride. I"ll give it that...What I always wonder about is the quality of the metal and the tolerances...and yeah..I own a Stella ,too

But sure, I"d take that for a fun Sunday ride.

Syd · Post by **Syd** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 5:55 am

On Sept 1, someone identifying himself as Mike @ Lance Powersports posted:

For two pieces of Great news both within a few days of each other is good for both us and our network of dealers! We (Alliance Powersports) are officially the distributor for SYM for the entire United States!! Second ALL of our SYM scooters are now California legal!! Ride Safe. Mike @ Alliance Powersports.

As for looks, I agree that many of the models are somewhat style challenged, but the Mio is nice. It and the Fiddle could both use a 150.

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 12:38 pm

ericalm wrote:I wish I could say these models are the harbingers of a return to making cool small-displacement MCs, but I think the motorcycle industry is in some ways where the (US) auto industry was a couple years ago: bigger is better and more expensive. Even scooters have been suffering from displacement creep!

It's hard to imagine Harley or even Ducati going back to making 250cc or smaller bikes and just as hard to imagine those selling well in the US. So many of the 250s out there (like the Ninja or the Rebel) are considered "starter bikes" and I have to say, there's something to that. Many of the buyers quickly move on to something larger.

I expect you're right but at least the manufacturers are trying.
MC displacement passed the ridiculous mark a long time ago. We have street-legal sportbikes that crowd the 200 mph mark and cruisers have gotten ridiculous in their displacement, and then only for braggin' rights. The increases don't even result in better performance, especially when they're offset by huge increases in weight. Honda realized this when they dropped the 1800.

The problem continues to be that Americans, who, ironically, must rely on personal transportation more than any country in the world, class all things 2-wheeled as "powersports" rather than workaday transportation.

Since the recession doesn't show any signs of going away, it might barely be possible that the light may dawn on some and scooters and smaller motorcycles will begin to make sense.

Viewed from my (rural) perspective, I think the larger displacement, bigger-wheeled scooters are a better bet for many. These can compete well for commuters' business because they can offer the competent performance of a regular motorcycle with more convenience and creature comforts.

neotrotsky · Post by **neotrotsky** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 12:40 pm

Very Honda looking indeed, not that it's a bad thing. Too bad it is not a 250 single. Although I am not digging the alloy rims. Never been a fan of alloys in any fashion. Give me a standard bike with spoked wire wheels and I am a happy guy

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 12:44 pm

I like the look of spokes as well but they can be a pain to clean. Plus you're stuck with tube tires, although I wouldn't really worry about that on a smaller bike.

I guess my perspective is different because of my age. When I was younger, bikes had nothing BUT spokes and when cast wheels became popular, they were considered extremely stylish.

I can still remember how happy I was that my '80 GS450s had alloy wheels. Aluminum with gold highlights.

BTW, I just checked the Suzuki website and the GS500 seems to have been axed. I notice Kawasaki has already canned their 500 twin as well. Maybe small isn't "in" after all.

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 12:46 pm

Syd wrote:On Sept 1, someone identifying himself as Mike @ Lance Powersports posted:
For two pieces of Great news both within a few days of each other is good for both us and our network of dealers! We (Alliance Powersports) are officially the distributor for SYM for the entire United States!! Second ALL of our SYM scooters are now California legal!! Ride Safe. Mike @ Alliance Powersports.
As for looks, I agree that many of the models are somewhat style challenged, but the Mio is nice. It and the Fiddle could both use a 150.

I thought Kymco was smart to start producing the Like in a 200. Sat on a Fiddle yesterday. It could up-gun as well and still be pretty light & handy.

texepictetus · Post by **texepictetus** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 2:28 pm

Thanks for the update. I thought of posting yesterday to see if anyone had actually seen one in a shop. It is a little frustrating here on the East Coast. I've talked to some shops that would love to have the Wolf, and speak highly of Sym products, but are leary of the distribution channels here in the states. I fear the Mid-Atlantic won't see this little bike for a while.

Post by **ericalm** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 2:38 pm

neotrotsky wrote:Very Honda looking indeed, not that it's a bad thing. Too bad it is not a 250 single. Although I am not digging the alloy rims. Never been a fan of alloys in any fashion. Give me a standard bike with spoked wire wheels and I am a happy guy

The US version has spokes!

Syd wrote:On Sept 1, someone identifying himself as Mike @ Lance Powersports posted:
For two pieces of Great news both within a few days of each other is good for both us and our network of dealers! We (Alliance Powersports) are officially the distributor for SYM for the entire United States!! Second ALL of our SYM scooters are now California legal!! Ride Safe. Mike @ Alliance Powersports.

Where was that posted?

birdmove · Post by **birdmove** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 5:59 pm

Talking of small motorcycles available in the US, there is also the Kymco Quannon 150. It's sold as a 125 elsewhere. It has apparently been dropped now for the US market. Due to that, dealers are selling them for $1995. One in Kona, on the Big Island of Hawaii, is selling them for that price with no freight and setup fees. I live on the islnad now about b125 miles away. The Kymcos, like all the SYMs, come with a nice two year warranty.

Here is a good review of the Quannon:

http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/760/5131/ ... -Ride.aspx

jrsjr · Post by **jrsjr** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 6:11 pm

birdmove wrote:Talking of small motorcycles available in the US, there is also the Kymco Quannon 150. It's sold as a 125 elsewhere. It has apparently been dropped now for the US market. Due to that, dealers are selling them for $1995. One in Kona, on the Big Island of Hawaii, is selling them for that price with no freight and setup fees.

Dude, that is a deal! Seriously.

birdmove · Post by **birdmove** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 7:26 pm

If you go to cycletrader.com and do a nationwide search for Kymco Quannon 150, you'll also find a dealer in Covina, Ca. selling them for $1995. Other dealers on the same search have them up to $3428 right now, so $1995 is a nice price.

I'm planning on driving to Kona in the next couple weeks to take a look at them. They have one red and one blue one left.

I have fun riding motorcycles and scoogters--and thats big and small ones.

jon (57 years old and riding since I was eight)

Post by **ericalm** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 8:36 pm

I made a horrible mistake riding the Classic 150. Had a dream last night I was riding one. My psychic wife keeps giving me this funny look like, "I KNOW WHAT YOU'RE THINKING AND THE ANSWER IS 'NO.'" I usually have scoots & motorcycles on the brain, but now a little more than usual and a little more motorcycles than usual, too.

Vroom.

jasondavis48108 · Post by **jasondavis48108** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 8:50 pm

this totally goes in the need category eric, how can she say no to a need

Post by **ericalm** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 8:58 pm

Ha. I'd be more likely to bring home a vintage Honda. I'm pretty set in the "new/modern" 150cc department so don't need something so reliable, pricey or warrantied.

jrsjr · Post by **jrsjr** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 10:18 pm

ericalm wrote:My psychic wife keeps giving me this funny look like, "I KNOW WHAT YOU'RE THINKING AND THE ANSWER IS 'NO.'"

I hate it when that happens!

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Sun Sep 25, 2011 10:49 pm

Kymco also sold a 250 twin cruiser-ish bike called a Venox. I guess it didn't sell.

http://www.kymcousa.com/showroom/mcs/venox250/

It had the "power cruiser" look to it. Pretty modern, it looked to be a 90 degree water-cooled V-twin.

Would have liked to have actually seen one.

birdmove · Post by **birdmove** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 12:25 am

The Venox, by the reports I read, was a fine motorcycle. It was also, I have heard, the Honda 250 Magna. It's likely that Kymco made the Magna for Honda.

http://www.epfguzzi.com/kymcobiz/motorc ... silver.jpg

Southerner wrote:Kymco also sold a 250 twin cruiser-ish bike called a Venox. I guess it didn't sell.

http://www.kymcousa.com/showroom/mcs/venox250/

It had the "power cruiser" look to it. Pretty modern, it looked to be a 90 degree water-cooled V-twin.

Would have liked to have actually seen one.

enzomatic · Post by **enzomatic** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 12:36 am

they produce a large variety of small displacement MCs in india too, genuine probably has the contacts to get one here if they wanted.

Post by **ericalm** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 12:45 am

enzomatic wrote:they produce a large variety of small displacement MCs in india too, genuine probably has the contacts to get one here if they wanted.

True! I think LML makes some. I know Bajaj does and Honda builds and sells many models in India that aren't sold anywhere else.

Syd · Post by **Syd** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 3:22 am

ericalm wrote:
Syd wrote:On Sept 1, someone identifying himself as Mike @ Lance Powersports posted:
For two pieces of Great news both within a few days of each other is good for both us and our network of dealers! We (Alliance Powersports) are officially the distributor for SYM for the entire United States!! Second ALL of our SYM scooters are now California legal!! Ride Safe. Mike @ Alliance Powersports.
Where was that posted?

On the SYM Owners forum

Post by **ericalm** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 3:44 am

Syd wrote:
ericalm wrote:
Syd wrote:On Sept 1, someone identifying himself as Mike @ Lance Powersports posted:
Where was that posted?
On the SYM Owners forum

Oh, ha, I was searching for it on MB!

Well, good for SYM. Hope those scoots and parts start moving soon.

illnoise · Post by **illnoise** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 4:32 am

Bajaj's low-displacement bikes are allegedly bulletproof, but there's nothing retro, unless the late 90s are retro now. They do sell the Ninja in the Indian market now, which sort of just tells me if you're the sort of person that would look into bringing a Bajaj over, you're probably better off with a US market Ninja 250.

POCPhil's review of the Wolf Classic is here:

http://2strokebuzz.com/2009/08/13/’tween-wolf

Our ex-local-SYM rep lent me one to ride around for a day about a year ago. I was pretty impressed, it was built well, nice and maneuverable and comfortable, and a lot of fun to ride. I didn't push it very hard, I was riding around with a bunch of scooters, but for urban riding/commuting, it'd be absolutely great. I was worried they'd try to 'chopper it up' or make it all Ed-Hardy cafe-racer or something, but luckily they left it 100% dorky asian simple, which is what I loved about it.

My only complaint about SYM is that their old importer was pretty crappy, and I honestly am not totally comfortable with the new importer yet. Just seems like there's been a very rocky transition. They've been pretty communicative and friendly, so that's great, and I wish them the best because SYM is a great brand.

enzomatic · Post by **enzomatic** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 5:20 am

totally forgot about hero honda, I bet they have access to all the tooling to make some of those 70s machines there, that would be great to have imported. I'd rather have a small bore twin.

Lostmycage · Post by **Lostmycage** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 5:29 am

illnoise wrote: My only complaint about SYM is that their old importer was pretty crappy, and I honestly am not totally comfortable with the new importer yet. Just seems like there's been a very rocky transition. They've been pretty communicative and friendly, so that's great, and I wish them the best because SYM is a great brand.

I've got high hopes for SYM in the US. All of the examples that I've seen first had have been first rate. The prices were too aggressive and the dealer support (before the "blaze") wasn't top notch from all accounts that I heard. I hope their new US distributors have a better time of it. I really think that SYM could be a good contender for the everyday rider if they had the right representation in the US. I guess time will tell.

PeterC · Post by **PeterC** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 3:21 pm

The SYM Wolf looks like a winner for those of us who'd like a sporty little bike without the hassle of restoring an old Honda. Do I need one? No, I simply want one, and want is the engine that powers our economy.

jrsjr · Post by **jrsjr** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 3:29 pm

PeterC wrote: Do I need one? No, I simply want one, and want is the engine that powers our economy.

Well said, Fred!

viney266 · Post by **viney266** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 4:54 pm

Southerner wrote:I like the look of spokes as well but they can be a pain to clean. Plus you're stuck with tube tires, although I wouldn't really worry about that on a smaller bike.

I guess my perspective is different because of my age. When I was younger, bikes had nothing BUT spokes and when cast wheels became popular, they were considered extremely stylish.

I can still remember how happy I was that my '80 GS450s had alloy wheels. Aluminum with gold highlights.

BTW, I just checked the Suzuki website and the GS500 seems to have been axed. I notice Kawasaki has already canned their 500 twin as well. Maybe small isn't "in" after all.

Suzuki axed the Gs500 because it could no longer meet emissions. Sad, great bike been around FOREVER...

Smaller bikes are just a mindset. When I owned a shop in Baltimore no one wanted ANYTHING under 600cc. But, go to Carlisle Pa where a few friends live, and you see scoots and under 250cc bikes all over town being used as fun cheap commuters!

PeterC · Post by **PeterC** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 5:20 pm

Megabikes do have a legitimate purpose. If I was planning on a cross-country tour on interstates, I'd definitely want a Harley or Victory or Goldwing. But for shorter rides and just plain fun, you can't beat a scooter or small motorcycle.

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Mon Sep 26, 2011 7:55 pm

PeterC wrote:Megabikes do have a legitimate purpose. If I was planning on a cross-country tour on interstates, I'd definitely want a Harley or Victory or Goldwing. But for shorter rides and just plain fun, you can't beat a scooter or small motorcycle.

I have to agree. Size (if we're logical, and much of the motorcycling public is not) is dependent on use.

Typical example: I turned in an application for what I hope will be my next job today in a nearby town. Went in mostly on a 4-lane divided U. S. highway. Speeds were about 65 to 75 at "rush hour" going in. I wouldn't attempt that on anything marginal. Just wouldn't feel safe.

Took an alternate route back home. This time mostly 2-lane county backroads. It was actually a few miles shorter but 45 mph was the highest speed limit, although people typically go up to about 60.

I shaved between 7 & 10 minutes off the trip but more importantly, I wouldn't hesitate to take that route with any medium to large scoot or a smaller motorcycle. No speeding traffic to compete with.

Keys · Post by **Keys** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 1:52 am

I must be so backwards. Did two trips from San Diego to Denver and back on a Yamaha RD250. Put 14,000 miles on a Buddy 125 in 12 months, including at least 6 over 300 mile trips. Took a Honda VT500F from Grand Junction, CO. to San Francisco and back. Truth is, when I began riding, a 450 was considered big. You honestly don't NEED a Leadwing or Hardley to do a trip. Just a wee bit more time...and a smaller bike makes it that much more an adventure.

--Keys

Post by **ericalm** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 2:53 am

Keys wrote:I must be so backwards. Did two trips from San Diego to Denver and back on a Yamaha RD250. Put 14,000 miles on a Buddy 125 in 12 months, including at least 6 over 300 mile trips. Took a Honda VT500F from Grand Junction, CO. to San Francisco and back. Truth is, when I began riding, a 450 was considered big. You honestly don't NEED a Leadwing or Hardley to do a trip. Just a wee bit more time...and a smaller bike makes it that much more an adventure.

--Keys

I can't really think of any trip I'd want to do that I couldn't do on a 500cc or 650cc.

viney266 · Post by **viney266** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 3:11 am

I remember the first year they had the AMA vintage meet. 1986 I think. Five of us rode out, all on 500-750 class bikes. I was on the biggest bike a 750 Yamaha seca. And when they made announcements they talked about this group that had sold their regular bikes and all bought goldwings JUST so they could be there...HAHAHAHA...WE came 150 miles further than the "goldwing " group. Only in America

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Tue Sep 27, 2011 11:37 am

ericalm wrote:
Keys wrote:I must be so backwards. Did two trips from San Diego to Denver and back on a Yamaha RD250. Put 14,000 miles on a Buddy 125 in 12 months, including at least 6 over 300 mile trips. Took a Honda VT500F from Grand Junction, CO. to San Francisco and back. Truth is, when I began riding, a 450 was considered big. You honestly don't NEED a Leadwing or Hardley to do a trip. Just a wee bit more time...and a smaller bike makes it that much more an adventure.

--Keys
I can't really think of any trip I'd want to do that I couldn't do on a 500cc or 650cc.

I would agree for the most part. I'd want something bigger if I were carrying a passenger, though. Even my 800 bogs somewhat with a full-sized passenger.

Keys · Post by **Keys** » Wed Sep 28, 2011 1:39 am

Southerner wrote:I would agree for the most part. I'd want something bigger if I were carrying a passenger, though. Even my 800 bogs somewhat with a full-sized passenger.

Slow down. Leave more time. Let the trip be more about the journey and less about the destination.

My sweetheart and I travel two-up all over Arizona from less than 2000 ft. elevation to over 7000 ft. elevation on an SYM HD200. Does fine. Over 9000 miles and no issues ever. Top speed; about 75 with both of us, cruises at 65 nicely. Just relax.

--Keys

thehypercube · Post by **thehypercube** » Sat Oct 08, 2011 11:00 pm

In case anyone is itching to see this in person in SF, I just called SF Moto and they have one on the floor. It has a deposit on it, but you can physically check it out. Since they sold this one, I'm sure they'll do their best to get another on the floor as soon as they can. I am not sure if it is the red/white or green version.

Post by **ericalm** » Sat Oct 08, 2011 11:09 pm

SF Moto's already sold a red/white one!

First owner in NoCal (from their Facebook)

PeterC · Post by **PeterC** » Sat Oct 08, 2011 11:44 pm

Lookin' good (both the bike and the lucky owner)!

thehypercube · Post by **thehypercube** » Sun Oct 09, 2011 6:27 am

ericalm wrote:SF Moto's already sold a red/white one!

That's some pretty good Google-fu, unless you know the owner already? Wonder how tall she is to give me a better idea about the size of the bike... I can't even afford this right now why am I continuing to look as if i can

Post by **ericalm** » Sun Oct 09, 2011 6:44 am

thehypercube wrote:
ericalm wrote:SF Moto's already sold a red/white one!
That's some pretty good Google-fu, unless you know the owner already? Wonder how tall she is to give me a better idea about the size of the bike... I can't even afford this right now why am I continuing to look as if i can

SF Moto posted this on their Facebook.

The bike is pretty small!

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Sun Oct 09, 2011 7:12 am

well that is a small motorcycle, ain't it?

thanks, but i'll opt for a ducati monster, instead

kinda does remind me of symba. i can't think of a reason why i'd want one with so many good scooters around. and motorcycles, too. that don't resmble mopeds, that is

Post by **ericalm** » Sun Oct 09, 2011 7:26 am

JHScoot wrote:well that is a small motorcycle, ain't it?

thanks, but i'll opt for a ducati monster, instead

kinda does remind me of symba. i can't think of a reason why i'd want one with so many good scooters around. and motorcycles, too. that don't resmble mopeds, that is

Odd distinctions. What difference does it make if it's a scooter or motorcycle if it's well made and fun to ride?

Hope you're ready to drop an additional $5K for that Ducati.

JHScoot · Post by **JHScoot** » Sun Oct 09, 2011 9:45 am

i don't know it seems many motorcyclists and scooterists make the distinction, as well. i will be taking the msf course by years end most likely and it may warm me up to cycles. but as of right now i had the opportunity to hop on a Rebel 250 and never having rode a mc before i found the seating position unpleasant. its because i have grown to be very fond of the foot forward seating positions on scooters. sometimes its fun to pretend i am sitting on a chair rolling down the street. because thats what riding a scoot feels like to me

mc's are shifty, straddle position, no leg shield. and i tend not to like "retro" bikes too much. retro scooters, yeah

oh well, msf here i come and it might change my biased view. but i swear i am tempted to take the course on my scooter!

Southerner · Post by **Southerner** » Sun Oct 09, 2011 12:05 pm

Although I do consider it to small for me, I'd like the opportunity to look one over and see how well SYM executes a MC. Their scoots look really good so I expect the Wolf should have a quality feel as well.

Maybe if this takes off, they'll be tempted to build a 350cc twin in a retro-Honda style. That begins to be in the "big-enough" category while still not huge by any means.

I have a feeling that if the economy picks up, Kymco is gonna eat SYM's lunch here in the east because of that whole Carter Bros. debacle.