Best scooter to get as a couple

bartekr · Post by **bartekr** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 5:46 am

Hi there. My fiance and I have had a 50cc Italia in NYC for the past year and love. We call it "the little scooter that could." Anyway, now my fiance and and I are moving to San Francisco.We need to upgrade given the crazy hills in SF, and hopefully get a scooter with a better suspension. My fiance has back problems and we're looking for a Buddy that has a better suspension so that she doesn't feel every hit of the road when the two of us are on it (which is most of the time).

Is there a Genuine Motor scooter that you'd recommend for 2 riders (combined weight of 300 lbs.

Thanks!
Bartek

brianwheelies · Post by **brianwheelies** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 6:16 am

If you want to keep the Italia, you could just get a rear shock. I put one on my Rattler 50 and it really helped with the beating I was taking with the stock shock.

k1dude · Post by **k1dude** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 6:28 am

For the hills of SFO, a 125+ is best for a single rider. If you include a passenger I would go with the 170i. There are also very good aftermarket (NCY & YSS) suspension upgrades available to smooth out your ride.

Edwub · Post by **Edwub** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 7:19 am

Although curious where in SF, I'd agree that the 170i is a good choice. I have some friends on a Vespa GT 250 that find that certain hills are borderline uncomfortable riding two-up. They used to have a 150 and traded up cause they didn't feel safe enough on some hills, didn't have the umph on a 150...
I think the advice above is spot on: 125 can work for single rider, but at least a 170 for couple. depends a bit where you are and where you're going. It's a sizable city

(and for a few areas (or cross-city commuting), a 50cc is out of the question)

I miss SF.

Edwub · Post by **Edwub** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 7:28 am

Note, from the Genuine FAQ:

"
Q: Can I ride my scooter with a passenger?
A: Genuine's various scooter models have a weight capacity ranging from 320 to 340 pounds. But you have to remember that the weight capacity factors not only the weight of the rider and the passenger, but EVERYTHING else the scooter is carrying.

In other words, the combined weight of you, the weight of your clothing, the fuel in the tank, the oil in the engine, cargo, your passenger, your passenger's clothing, your helmets, any accessories mounted on the scooter, the stuffed animal you tied to the handlebars, etc. must be equal to or less than the weight capacity of the scooter. [top]
"

Two-up with gear, laptops/bags/etc, weight adds up. You need to factor in usage and driving route. For my friends, a 150 couldn't cut it. They cross crossed the city frequently. For you guys, it might. Well, at least 170 has a bit of an edge and may be the perfect starting point. I do have anoher pair of friends that manage SF on a 125, though they don't recommend it they willingly make it work. Just depends on your needs and how you'll compomise your priorities

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 7:49 am

To me a Buddy is just too tight to ride two up except for short trips.

LunaP · Post by **LunaP** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:09 am

k1dude wrote:For the hills of SFO, a 125+ is best for a single rider. If you include a passenger I would go with the 170i. There are also very good aftermarket (NCY & YSS) suspension upgrades available to smooth out your ride.

I have a 170 and some back/chronic muscle tension problems. The 170's suspension feels very 'stiff' to me, and it does strike me hard, in, say, my lower back when we hit bumps and such. That being said- my boyfriend's Stella seems to have a goofy suspension- it's comfier when we hit a hard bump, but it bounces at the littlest thing.

However

I find, having ridden an extensive amount as cupcake on both scoots (due to my broken hand), here are the pros and cons:

-Stella has more seat room for cupcake butt
-Stella, IMO, is uncomfortable for cupcake feet with or without bolt-on footpegs. There are pros and cons to being with and without the footpegs, but I am also short legged, and both are very awkward.
-Stella is easier to get on because the cupcake seat area is level with the driver area of the seat.

-Buddy's bolt-on footpegs are kind of a pain for the driver (poke you in the calves while stopped), but totally worth it because they act as crash bars in low speed drops, and are just plain awesome for cupcakes. Without them, cupcake feet are still perfectly comfy- once they figure out where their feet are suppose to go (the silver foot spaces for cupcakes are very inconspicuous when on the scoot)
-Buddy doesn't have as much seat space
-Buddy cupcake seat is elevated slightly, which I don't prefer over the level seat, but some might.

Has your fiance considered buying a kidney belt? Helps your back when riding. I'm not sure what kind of back problems he/she has, but it may be worth checking out, I don't think they are that expensive.

Also... if you can afford an aftermarket shock, go for it. I really like my 170i

As a side note... I am 220, and I am not exactly sure what my boyfriend weighs, but it isn't 80lbs. We do fine. Don't WOT and push the scoot too much going at or over the weight limit.

If you need a gentler scoot with a bigger weight limit, though, you may just need to look into a bigger scoot altogether.

Keys · Post by **Keys** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 8:40 am

My sweetheart and I have put as many as 250 miles on my SYM HD200 in a day...

--Keys

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 9:12 am

LunaP wrote:I have a 170 and some back/chronic muscle tension problems. The 170's suspension feels very 'stiff' to me, and it does strike me hard, in, say, my lower back when we hit bumps and such. That being said- my boyfriend's Stella seems to have a goofy suspension- it's comfier when we hit a hard bump, but it bounces at the littlest thing.

That is always the trade off. Tight suspension you feel everything...but handling is great! A soft cushy ride is nice but you give up performance. Kinda like comparing the ride in a Town Car to a Corvette.

I have two scooters with completley different suspension systems that ride completly differently. My 68 SS180 is completley stock. It is the Lincon Town Car...powerful, soft suspension, great for riding 2 up. The other is my 67 GT Rat. I have completly modified the suspension, adjustable damper and shocks etc. VERY stiff suspension and you feel every little crack in the asphalt...but..it is an absolute uber primo blast to ride dive bombing curves on the Blue Ridge Parkway...totally useless for 2 up...(especially with the small frame seat.)

So the trick is always to find what is going to be best for YOU. There are plenty of options and modifications that can be made. I would suggest test riding as many different models and makes as possible until you find the right one...and you will know it when you ride it!

Keep us updated!

brianwheelies · Post by **brianwheelies** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 11:02 am

BuddyRaton wrote: That is always the trade off. Tight suspension you feel everything...but handling is great! A soft cushy ride is nice but you give up performance. Kinda like comparing the ride in a Town Car to a Corvette.

Quality suspension components bridge the gap and abolish the trade-off. Unfortunately they are seldom found on production bikes.

atlantaM3 · Post by **atlantaM3** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:13 pm

I have a 170i and SC250. Even around the hills here in north ga the 170 isn't really happy just with me on it. 2 up it is slooooowwwww going up hills. we don't ride the 170 two-up anymore on anything but flat ground/low hills.

Given the topography of where you are going, I would really recommend you look at a bigger scoot like a 250.

peabody99 · Post by **peabody99** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:27 pm

yes, consider a 250 or each get 125-150's

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:39 pm

brianwheelies wrote:
BuddyRaton wrote: That is always the trade off. Tight suspension you feel everything...but handling is great! A soft cushy ride is nice but you give up performance. Kinda like comparing the ride in a Town Car to a Corvette.
Quality suspension components bridge the gap and abolish the trade-off. Unfortunately they are seldom found on production bikes.

I agree that there are some excellent aftermarket options. However it is difficult and expensive to abolish the tradeoff. Going full hydraulic disc with Malossi RS24 on my 64GL has run about 3K....I think...and thats just the front.

pattio · Post by **pattio** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:54 pm

bartekr wrote:Hi there. My fiance and I have had a 50cc Italia in NYC for the past year and love. We call it "the little scooter that could." Anyway, now my fiance and and I are moving to San Francisco.We need to upgrade given the crazy hills in SF, and hopefully get a scooter with a better suspension. My fiance has back problems and we're looking for a Buddy that has a better suspension so that she doesn't feel every hit of the road when the two of us are on it (which is most of the time).

Is there a Genuine Motor scooter that you'd recommend for 2 riders (combined weight of 300 lbs.

Thanks!
Bartek

Congrats to you for mixing it up in NYC traffic. My hat is off to people who own and operate just about any vehicle in that environment. With regard to upgrading from a Buddy, with the goals of having more power and more comfort for two: on the one hand that's easy to answer- yes, there are plenty of scooters on the market with more power and better comfort for two-up riding. On the other hand- sadly, none of these scooters are Genuine brand.

All you have to do to get more power and a bigger bike is buy a bigger bike. The key thing is your relationship with your local dealer. I would suggest postponing the purchase decision until after you are on the ground in SF. Pay a visit to each of the dealers, and look around town to see whose bikes are represented. Look for decals and license plate frames, on scooters parked in your area. A friendly dealer ready to drop anything to help you out with the scooters he sells might deserve your business, even if there's a bigger-brand dealer around the corner. The important thing is that you need local support and brand comes secondary to that.

With regard to the idea of needing 'better suspension', I can also assure you that just about any scooter larger and heavier than a Buddy will have a softer, relatively plusher suspension feel. That includes a lot of scooters, because the Buddy is a lightweight. The Buddy works as well as it does, with that hard-working engine-that-could quality, because it is a harmonious little package.

Something else to point out about scooter suspension, speaking as someone who is also not unfamiliar with back pain, is that you have to recognize that scooters will always have specific handling and suspension issues because of the use of the engine/transmission as the swingarm. That whole engine/transmission/swingarm assembly takes any hard hits that the rear wheel can find, and then the rear suspension, such as it is, weakly tries to modulate it from your butt's experience. No vehicle of this design will ever soak up hard hits the way a motorcycle's rear suspension can.

Aside from my real-world advice to shop dealer-first in your new town, I sure wish, as you do, that there was a step-up Genuine product for the customer ready to move on from the Buddy. I marvel when I think about that moment in the summer of '08 when there was a very real possibility of Tha Man Phil pulling off the most astonishing international powersport judo and influencing the production of a PGO product that would go head-to-head with the Vespa GT range... good gracious it almost happened. But it didn't. Keeping on with the 'small' stuff, and doing it well, is how the big G keeps it going- and lives to fight another day.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 2:59 pm

peabody99 wrote:yes, consider a 250 or each get 125-150's

You forgot to mention the Genuine 300 Cruiser!

k1dude · Post by **k1dude** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 6:43 pm

My recommendation for the 170i was keeping it in the Genuine line-up. Of course, any scooter in the 200+ range that can handle 2 on it's seat will perform better than a 170. 250 Vespa's come to mind if you can afford one.

For the hills of SFO, I personally would NOT want to be on a Stella. The last thing I'd want is for the shifter to not engage while on a steep start. Also you'd probably have to be practically standing on the foot brake to keep it from sliding backwards. And no matter what scooter you have, there are some hills in SFO that I'd avoid like the plague. They're just too damn steep. Especially riding with 2.

LunaP · Post by **LunaP** » Mon Nov 21, 2011 7:26 pm

k1dude wrote:My recommendation for the 170i was keeping it in the Genuine line-up. Of course, any scooter in the 200+ range that can handle 2 on it's seat will perform better than a 170. 250 Vespa's come to mind if you can afford one.

For the hills of SFO, I personally would NOT want to be on a Stella. The last thing I'd want is for the shifter to not engage while on a steep start. Also you'd probably have to be practically standing on the foot brake to keep it from sliding backwards. And no matter what scooter you have, there are some hills in SFO that I'd avoid like the plague. They're just too damn steep. Especially riding with 2.

Also, she doesn't take hills very well two-up. Forgot to point this out. I agree with Pattio, get to SF and look at bigger bikes.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 2:10 am

If the assignment is two up riding in SF, I'd say a 250 or 300 GTS Vespa is really the right choice. If that is not going to work, I would consider two scooters - two 125 Buddys would be a fine choice IMO. Don't rule out the Vespa too quickly though. The 250 GTS isn't as expensive as you might think. Those that are still left around as new stock have been going in the $4-5K range. Really not all that much more than a 170 Buddy.

Post by **ericalm** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:21 am

In the Genuine family? I'd say Stella 4T or Blur 220i. The suspension on the Stella might need an upgrade to meet your needs.

GTS is a good option, too but honestly, for in-city riding you could do well with a LX 150. My wife and I do just fine 2-up on mine all over the city. For 2-up, I actually prefer the long, flat seat of the LX to the split-level GTS. (Another reason I suggested the Stella.)

k1dude · Post by **k1dude** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:28 am

ericalm wrote:In the Genuine family? I'd say Stella 4T or Blur 220i. The suspension on the Stella might need an upgrade to meet your needs.

GTS is a good option, too but honestly, for in-city riding you could do well with a LX 150. My wife and I do just fine 2-up on mine all over the city. For 2-up, I actually prefer the long, flat seat of the LX to the split-level GTS. (Another reason I suggested the Stella.)

I thought no one likes riding 2-up on the 220 because of the seat? A Stella wouldn't be good on the hills of SFO. Not enough power for 2-up and shifting/braking at lights going up steep hills isn't ideal.

I doubt the LX 150 has the guts for 2-up on the steep hills in SFO.

Edwub · Post by **Edwub** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 3:40 am

Correct, it didn't for my aforementioned friends (traded in their LX for the 250).

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 2:28 pm

ericalm wrote:In the Genuine family? I'd say Stella 4T or Blur 220i. The suspension on the Stella might need an upgrade to meet your needs.

GTS is a good option, too but honestly, for in-city riding you could do well with a LX 150. My wife and I do just fine 2-up on mine all over the city. For 2-up, I actually prefer the long, flat seat of the LX to the split-level GTS. (Another reason I suggested the Stella.)

I agree. I have been on the back of a GT200 and GTS 250. Absolutly the worst scooters for riding bit......pillion. The foot peg position sucks and the last time I was on the back of a GT all I could see was NOLAN

Post by **ericalm** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 7:38 pm

k1dude wrote:I doubt the LX 150 has the guts for 2-up on the steep hills in SFO.

It does! Especially the new injected ones. In the city it'll do just fine.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Tue Nov 22, 2011 8:13 pm

BuddyRaton wrote: I have been on the back of a GT200 and GTS 250. Absolutly the worst scooters for riding bit......pillion.

You have ridden two up on a Buddy and you think a large frame Vespa is the worst scooter you can think of for two up riding? Hmmm? Each rider has their own preferences, of course, but the Buddy is not particularly comfortable for two up riding by any standard I can think of. Regarding the Vespas, it is certainly true that the GT seat is flatter and the GTS seat more sculpted. They do interchange however. I'd say the comfort of the seat and the utility of the passenger foot pegs is mostly a function of the size and geometry of the riders. In other words, anyone who is serious about this question ought to try the seating positions of some likely choices.

viney266 · Post by **viney266** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 1:41 am

brianwheelies wrote:
Quality suspension components bridge the gap and abolish the trade-off. Unfortunately they are seldom found on production bikes.

x2 ^^^^...why I'm such a fan of upgraded suspension. Turns an okay bike great!

I like the new 170, or a 150 "leftover" if you can find one!

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 4:38 am

Dooglas wrote:
BuddyRaton wrote: I have been on the back of a GT200 and GTS 250. Absolutly the worst scooters for riding bit......pillion.
You have ridden two up on a Buddy and you think a large frame Vespa is the worst scooter you can think of for two up riding? Hmmm? Each rider has their own preferences, of course, but the Buddy is not particularly comfortable for two up riding by any standard I can think of. Regarding the Vespas, it is certainly true that the GT seat is flatter and the GTS seat more sculpted. They do interchange however. I'd say the comfort of the seat and the utility of the passenger foot pegs is mostly a function of the size and geometry of the riders. In other words, anyone who is serious about this question ought to try the seating positions of some likely choices.

What I said was riding pillion. As a PASSENGER the Buddy...for me...is much more comfortable than the GT. Those little flip out footpegs are just in a really bad spot. I don't think either the Buddy or the GT or GTS is comfortable for the passenger. As I stated in an earlier post in this thread...to me a Buddy is just too tight to ride two up except for short trips.

To the OP...I still think the trick is to find what is going to be best for YOU. There are plenty of options and modifications that can be made. I would suggest test riding as many different models and makes as possible until you find the right one...and you will know it when you ride it!

peabody99 · Post by **peabody99** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 5:38 am

I am interested in the GTS 250 pillion comments. I agree the foot pegs are all messed up and awkward for the pillion passenger. The ride is smooth but the position awkward. But I disagree it is more uncomfortable than 2 up on a buddy. COME ON!

Interesting input-the most comfortable bike 2 up for us was my spouses People s200 (which is actually a 163). Very comfortable position and suspension. If they make these anymore, consider it when you are looking. It should be fine on the hills. He now has the People s250. The position is fine, but the suspension not good. Seriously back jarring back there. All that said we complain, but have you seen those poor girls on the back of sport bikes? they are sitting on a 5 inch by 5 inch square with 1/2 inch of foam, with knees totally bent behind them.

First, I hope they one day get their own bike or if not meet a real man or women who cares for their comfort

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 6:07 am

The seating on the Buddy with a top box and pad is more comfortable to me. I will admit...I can't stand the Buddy with someone behind me...just not enough room. Yeay the GT has a smoother ride but I cramp up with those foot pegs.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Wed Nov 23, 2011 4:52 pm

BuddyRaton wrote:ThYeay the GT has a smoother ride but I cramp up with those foot pegs.

What is your size and weight? Not being obnoxious, just noting that I think this is at least partially a function of the size of the passenger, the length of their legs, etc.

Modern Buddy

Best scooter to get as a couple

Best scooter to get as a couple

Re: Best scooter to get as a couple