Buddy 125 engine conundrum

rkcoker · Post by **rkcoker** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:00 pm

I've had my Buddy try to stall twice while I'm moving at normal road speed. I don't want to start tearing into it without a clear idea what it is. It happens while the engine is warmed up and it seems to occur after riding for some time on rough roads. It hasn't happened while stopped and idling. Any sane

and sober

ideas will be greatly appreciated.

skully93 · Post by **skully93** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:18 pm

how many miles are on it? What types of conditions seem to cause it?

it would help to know those details. Also, stock? were you the original owner? is there maintenance?

Blah blah, you get the idea. Give the gear-heads as much info as possible and they'll dive right in and help.

rkcoker · Post by **rkcoker** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:40 pm

skully93 wrote:how many miles are on it? What types of conditions seem to cause it?

it would help to know those details. Also, stock? were you the original owner? is there maintenance?

Blah blah, you get the idea. Give the gear-heads as much info as possible and they'll dive right in and help.

Oh, my! Details, details! Anyway, It has just turned over 900 miles, I'm the original owner, bought it last February and yes, it is stock. I've had the dealer do the first oil and filter change plus all the checks at 250 miles. And as I wrote earlier the only conditions that are the same are bumpy, rough roads and the engine has been running for a while and it hasn't happened (yet) at a stop but while running down the road.

Chilly · Post by **Chilly** » Thu Jan 19, 2012 11:51 pm

vapor lock, drill gascap.

This link has a good picture, my holes are even smaller 1/64" I think
viewtopic.php?t=15318&highlight=vapor+l ... ap+picture

Raiderfn311 · Post by **Raiderfn311** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 12:50 am

Did the engine back-fire at all while it was stalling?

Post by **ericalm** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 4:18 am

Chilly wrote:vapor lock, drill gascap.

This link has a good picture, my holes are even smaller 1/64" I think
viewtopic.php?t=15318&highlight=vapor+l ... ap+picture

Most likely possibility at this point. Vent the cap first and see if it continues.

When it stalls, how hard is it to start again? Does it stall, start, then stall again soon after?

heyitsomid · Post by **heyitsomid** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 5:12 am

aren't you still under warranty? But yeah I was thinking fuel system issue.

rkcoker · Post by **rkcoker** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 5:12 am

No, it doesn't backfire. When it stalls, I try to give it more throttle but it keeps losing power until it quits. I have no problem using the electric start to get it running again.

agrogod · Post by **agrogod** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 9:57 am

If this is a vapor lock problem, and your Buddy has a vented gas cap, the vent holes may be gummed up. Same crap that goes through the fuel lines also goes through the vent holes (in vapor form). A simple inspection of the gas cap itself will give you your answer.

rkcoker · Post by **rkcoker** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:38 pm

heyitsomid wrote:aren't you still under warranty? But yeah I was thinking fuel system issue.

Yes, it's under warranty but my first instinct is to resolve the issue myself. I'll take it to the shop but I like knowing what the problem is before I do that. That's 45 years of technical troubleshooting ingrained in me.

Dooglas · Post by **Dooglas** » Fri Jan 20, 2012 4:34 pm

Yes, gas tank venting could be the issue but that one is fairly easy to verify. If the scooter stalls, remove and replace the gas cap. Restart the scooter. It should run normally for a few minutes - perhaps quite a few minutes depending on how full the tank is at the time. The fact that you say you can immediately restart the scooter when it stalls makes me wonder whether gas tank venting is actually the cause, but easy enough to test.

Raiderfn311 · Post by **Raiderfn311** » Sat Jan 21, 2012 12:35 am

I'm thinking this is not vapor-lock, just a hunch. Probably simple though. Sounds like there is some "junk" in the fuel line. Seafoam(there I said it) might help. Give it a good dose and let it idle for awhile. Then hop on and ride for few miles. It may take a few doses, so run through 3 or so tanks.

viney266 · Post by **viney266** » Sat Jan 21, 2012 2:07 am

Try the vented cap idea first. From there I'll bet its the petcock partially clogged or not flowing right. You could remove it and clean it or take it to be looked at under warranty.

Raiderfn311 · Post by **Raiderfn311** » Sat Jan 21, 2012 2:33 am

viney266 wrote:Try the vented cap idea first. From there I'll bet its the petcock partially clogged or not flowing right. You could remove it and clean it or take it to be looked at under warranty.

Remove and clean. SOLID ADVICE. Viney you are good.

Edit-I tried to keep my petcock at bay. Damn thing kept on sneakin out spendin money.

agrogod · Post by **agrogod** » Sun Jan 22, 2012 1:09 am

Raiderfn311 wrote:
viney266 wrote:Try the vented cap idea first. From there I'll bet its the petcock partially clogged or not flowing right. You could remove it and clean it or take it to be looked at under warranty.
Remove and clean. SOLID ADVICE. Viney you are good.

Edit-I tried to keep my petcock at bay. Damn thing kept on sneakin out spendin money.

I hope it didn't catch anything

RoadRambler · Post by **RoadRambler** » Sun Jan 22, 2012 5:04 am

I've virtually no mechanical expertise, but the situation the OP described does sound like what my Buddy did and it turned out to be the vapor lock due to the NONvented gas cap. Switched out for vented gas cap, never had the problem again (at least not so far, knock wood!). But just as OP described, after riding a while and while cruising (not idling), it would slowly lose power, not respond to throttle, stall, re-start after about a minute or less, get me home ... then happen again a week or so later. Happened 2 or 3 times before I took it in for its first servicing, when they switched out the cap to give me a vented one.

It would be a quick thing to check if you have the vented cap or not, and add the vent or get a vented one if you don't. Plus the other things mentioned, like a good "Seafoaming" treatment.

Let us know what you find out!

rkcoker · Post by **rkcoker** » Sun Jan 22, 2012 5:16 am

RoadRambler, thanks alot. Sounds good. I appreciate everyones input.

skully93 · Post by **skully93** » Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:16 pm

Phew!

Today was my first taste of this issue. I had ridden to the bank, and decided to extend my ride for a bit of lunch. Ran it at @ 45mph up to a place, then on the way back...sputter sputter die... (thanks for dying on a 40-50 mph road and not a side street...grr..). I had read previous threads, so I opened up the gas for a minute. Started right back up, ran fine for a few. then, a couple miles later...sputter sputter die.

Vented one more time and got into the work garage. One thing to note is I do believe I overfilled it last time, but I showed very empty and filled up with barely more than a gallon. Next time I won't get so overzealous!

I may ask for a vented cap at service in a few weeks, but that seems like a bad solution.

PeteH · Post by **PeteH** » Wed Jan 25, 2012 9:26 pm

Actually, historically speaking, vented caps are absolutely correct for carbureted / gravity-fed / non-pressurized engines like El Buddo. My '73 VW likes its vented cap very much.

Non-vented pressurized caps are more appropriate for fuel-injected continuous-flow pressurized fuel systems with a constant-flow electric fuel pump. My old '77 Rabbit (fuel injected, electric CV pump) had trouble when the fuel loop was compromised.

Now I'm not sure why PGO and/or Genuine put sealed caps on the Buddy. Perhaps they were really meant for non-US FI PGOs, but a whole pile of folks here have had better luck with a vented cap.

rkcoker · Post by **rkcoker** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 12:46 am

Actually wanted to put this post to rest for me. Turns out my problem was the kill switch was defective. Had it replaced about 5 weeks ago and no further problems. Rough roads made the innards jiggle around and cause the engine to die.

skully93 · Post by **skully93** » Wed Mar 28, 2012 3:24 am

Well that figures!

I do think Genuine does a pretty good job of quality control. But, between shipping parts here and then assembly, you're bound to get a goofy part sometimes!

Glad it was fixed.

Keys · Post by **Keys** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 4:12 am

It sounds exactly like the problem I had with my Buddy and the incompetent local dealer I had never did find it...I did. The wiring harness was being pinched under the pet carrier and the wiring broke inside the insulation where it couldn't be seen. It would start fine and die when I'd hit bumps. then it got worse until it would die every time I'd sit on the seat. Ran fine until I sat down...when my weight pressed the carrier down and separated the wire. Have you dealer check harness routing and wire continuity. .especially to the coil.