Octane boost addative?

2wheelNsanity · Post by **2wheelNsanity** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:28 pm

I have been wondering for quit some time wether I am actually getting 91octane fuel when I fill up. I would imagine that the pump and hose hold at least a gallon of fuel, so when I get to the pump all I am putting in is what was in the hose/pump, more than likely 87octane. So, I bought some octane boost, wow what a difference. My scooter was alot more responsive and I even got her to top out at 75bmph(wind aided, 10mph). But the best result was the overall smoothness of the scooter. I know others say they haven't had much of a result from octane boosters, but I did. Just thought I would share this. Have fun and be safe.

Raiderfn311 · Post by **Raiderfn311** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:35 pm

I use one gas station and the hose that I use is "dedicated" to 93 octane. I, too, find my scooter runs better, responsiveness being one of the ways. Many have said that is complete crap, but hey, what do we care? Glad you had good results.

Skootz Kabootz · Post by **Skootz Kabootz** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:40 pm

Anything above regular octane gas is wasted in a low compression engine such as the Buddy or other scooters. Save yourself some money and don't bother.

pocphil wrote:
Laymans Guide to Octane

1 - OCTANE is the resistance to detonation. High compression engines cause fuel to pre-detonate - this is called KNOCK. It is dangerous to your motor.

2 - Scooters (all that I'm aware of) use notoriously LOW compression engines. 87 Octane has been shown to be fine. In high altitude areas I've even run 85 Octane in my race scooter and it did not knock one bit.

3 - HIGH OCTANE does not equal "Clean" or "Power" - Running a motor designed for 87 Octane fuel on 92 will actually make it run poorly, less power and worse mileage. The detergent additives are specified by the company selling the fuel and they are consistent from 86 - 94 octane.

4 - If your Jaguar, Snowblower, JetSki, Scooter, weedwacker etc. runs fine on 87 Octane without knocking or running on after you turn off the key, keep using it. Keep in mind modern vehicles are designed to run on a WORLD of different fuel qualities. The worst fuel you can pull from a pump in the US is going to be much better than the best fuel you can pull from a pump in India etc.

5 - Octane is not Octane. The numbers we use in the US are based on an average of 2 different testing methods. The number found In most countries (including all of Europe and Australia) the octane that would be shown on the pump is the Research Octane Number but in the United States and some other countries the headline number is the average of the RON and the Motor Octane Number. So, the gas we call 87 Octane R/M is actually written in most owners manuals as 92 or 93 Octane (RON).

If not specified assume the Octane number in the manual is a RON number. As most vehicles (scooters) are not manufactured in the US.

Here is our "real world" application data:

In 1999 the Ohio Department of Agriculture conducted a test of 1000 gas stations. 85% Of these stations were pumping non-premium octane fuel from their premium pumps. Audits of these stations were conducted and it was seen as a regular practice for stations to have "Regular" account for approximately 82% of their monthly sales. Yet it accounted for over 95% of the fuel they ordered from their supplier. Unless they were giving away thousands of gallons of 87 Octane fuel, it was quite obvious they were selling the 87 out of the higher octane pumps.

Remember too that octane is calculated differently in different countries. Hi-octane in the USA and hi-octane in Taiwan are not the same. Good ol' US regular gas will serve your scooter best.

Syd · Post by **Syd** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:40 pm

I think you will find anecdotal evidence for using any of the (generally) three octane levels sold in the US. Just be aware that what your Owner's manual calls 91 octane is not the 91 octane sold in the US. Octane numbers are calculated differently in the US than in Taiwan (or indeed, much of the world). What this means is that the 91 octane in Taiwan is essentially the same as 87 octane in the US.

Be that as it may, if you felt a difference and are willing to pay the price, go right ahead and dump that stuff in. Just don't use so much that you lean your fuel mix out too much.

2wheelNsanity · Post by **2wheelNsanity** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 5:48 pm

Ty for the advice, I figure the scoot has 3500 miles on it so I figured the injector may need a cleaning, but was suprised how different it felt.

Raiderfn311 · Post by **Raiderfn311** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:19 pm

Skootz Kabootz wrote:Anything above regular octane gas is wasted in a low compression engine such as the Buddy or other scooters. Save yourself some money and don't bother.

pocphil wrote:
Laymans Guide to Octane

1 - OCTANE is the resistance to detonation. High compression engines cause fuel to pre-detonate - this is called KNOCK. It is dangerous to your motor.

2 - Scooters (all that I'm aware of) use notoriously LOW compression engines. 87 Octane has been shown to be fine. In high altitude areas I've even run 85 Octane in my race scooter and it did not knock one bit.

3 - HIGH OCTANE does not equal "Clean" or "Power" - Running a motor designed for 87 Octane fuel on 92 will actually make it run poorly, less power and worse mileage. The detergent additives are specified by the company selling the fuel and they are consistent from 86 - 94 octane.

4 - If your Jaguar, Snowblower, JetSki, Scooter, weedwacker etc. runs fine on 87 Octane without knocking or running on after you turn off the key, keep using it. Keep in mind modern vehicles are designed to run on a WORLD of different fuel qualities. The worst fuel you can pull from a pump in the US is going to be much better than the best fuel you can pull from a pump in India etc.

5 - Octane is not Octane. The numbers we use in the US are based on an average of 2 different testing methods. The number found In most countries (including all of Europe and Australia) the octane that would be shown on the pump is the Research Octane Number but in the United States and some other countries the headline number is the average of the RON and the Motor Octane Number. So, the gas we call 87 Octane R/M is actually written in most owners manuals as 92 or 93 Octane (RON).

If not specified assume the Octane number in the manual is a RON number. As most vehicles (scooters) are not manufactured in the US.

Here is our "real world" application data:

In 1999 the Ohio Department of Agriculture conducted a test of 1000 gas stations. 85% Of these stations were pumping non-premium octane fuel from their premium pumps. Audits of these stations were conducted and it was seen as a regular practice for stations to have "Regular" account for approximately 82% of their monthly sales. Yet it accounted for over 95% of the fuel they ordered from their supplier. Unless they were giving away thousands of gallons of 87 Octane fuel, it was quite obvious they were selling the 87 out of the higher octane pumps.
Remember too that octane is calculated differently in different countries. Hi-octane in the USA and hi-octane in Taiwan are not the same. Good ol' US regular gas will serve your scooter best.

Skootz, Jess over at MV says high octane can help knocks in Vespa engines. Are Vespa's higher compression? I really dont know. My enigine truly seems to run better on high octane. I tell you what though, starting today Ill sart usuing 87 and do so for a month and get back to ya. Save some $ in the process.

skully93 · Post by **skully93** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 7:48 pm

I tried higher octane gas in my zuma once, it ran like crap. It really does love the cheapest gas all day long.

Always kept the same in the Buddy at the request of my dealer.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 8:46 pm

WHY RED IS RED!

Syd · Post by **Syd** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 9:18 pm

BuddyRaton wrote:WHY RED IS RED!

Skootz Kabootz · Post by **Skootz Kabootz** » Thu Mar 29, 2012 9:34 pm

Syd wrote:
BuddyRaton wrote:WHY RED IS RED!

Yep. Saw it coming from the get go...

2wheelNsanity · Post by **2wheelNsanity** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 2:44 am

WHY BLUE IS BLUE?

Cheshire · Post by **Cheshire** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 3:28 am

I found this vid through random digital wandering, figured the scientific testing would be appreciated.

Excerpt from Fifth Gear:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VG3j0g88kXs

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 5:06 am

Skootz Kabootz wrote:
Syd wrote:
BuddyRaton wrote:WHY RED IS RED!

Yep. Saw it coming from the get go...

I try not to pull it out too often...but sometimes I just can't help myself!

And

still cracks me up!

Raiderfn311 · Post by **Raiderfn311** » Fri Mar 30, 2012 9:53 pm

Cheshire wrote:I found this vid through random digital wandering, figured the scientific testing would be appreciated.

Excerpt from Fifth Gear:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VG3j0g88kXs

Yeah, I figured as much. Its like the "elixers" sold back in the day. Cures everything for one night, then you wake up with a pounding headache. I just switched to 87 btw. I STILL use Stabil/Startron to treat ethanol to keep water out. Im pretty darn sure it works since I had MAJOR probs w/E10 before and none since. People(including myself) seem to love these "treatments". I love choosing oils too. I'll keep that pleasure. BTW, MOTUL 7100 is da best.

Beamster · Post by **Beamster** » Sat Mar 31, 2012 5:10 am

Octane boosters are a potential waste of money because the fuel composition changes often and the aftermarket can't keep up with it.
I was told this by a manufacturer that threw in the towel for the same reason.

High octane fuel runs hotter which can be a negative thing for an air cooled engine. The only thing you're buying is more resistance to detonation which you should not have in the first place with proper tuning provided that you have not boosted the compression.

2wheelNsanity · Post by **2wheelNsanity** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 6:17 pm

well I ran 2 tanks with octane boost and averaged 79 mpg. Then I ran 2 tanks without (just 87 octane regular) and averaged 89 mpg. I drove essentially the same route and made sure I didn't exceed 60bmph. So, it may be a little unscientific but I would have to agree with the others who feel that octane boost and high octane fuel is a waste of money in a Buddy.

Raiderfn311 · Post by **Raiderfn311** » Tue Apr 10, 2012 8:00 pm

Ive run 3 tanks of 87 and the scoot is running great. No more high octane for me. A myth has been busted all to shit. I will always use my ethanol treatment though, with a dose of Seafoam every few months.