Sized Speedo Cable HONDA ELITE *NBR

RoaringTodd · Post by **RoaringTodd** » Sat Apr 06, 2013 8:51 pm

Greetings -

In getting Lil' Abby ready for spring, I decided to take off her wheels and take them in to the shop to be replaced.

While they are off, it's a good time for me to replace the brakes. I've gotten the rear brakes off with no problem, however on the front, I could not get the speedo cable screw unscrewed from the brake housing. It seems to be sized and stuck on. I tried as much as I dared to, however the screw is dangerously close to be stripped.

Is there any "tribal knowledge" of how to remove a sized screw without stripping it? It has been sprayed with penetrating oil, heated with a mini torch, all to no avail.

Thanks in advance.

RT

charlie55 · Post by **charlie55** » Sat Apr 06, 2013 9:54 pm

Is this a "set" screw that goes in perpendicular to the cable and holds it in place? Also, is it a Phillips or regular slot?

I use an impact driver (the kind you smack with a hammer) in cases like these. Not only does it "translate" part of the impact into torque, but the blow tends to make the bit dig into the screw head thus lessening the tendency to strip out the slot(s).

One thing though, at least on early Hondas what looks like a Phillips head screw really isn't. It's basically a slotted screw with two slots set at 90 degrees to each other. They're real easy to strip with a Phillips screwdriver because the screwdriver ends in a point and doesn't seat all the way into the screw. Found this out on the CB. Workaround was to buy a cheap Phillips screwdriver and grind the point down so that the cross pattern fit flat in the screw head.

az_slynch · Post by **az_slynch** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 5:32 am

Charlie's right-on about the impact screwdriver. The speedometer cable retaining screw tends to seize up and need a bit of persuasion to get it loose. As you've seen it's a pretty soft alloy which requires a careful application of force.

One of my tricks for a screw head that is starting to shear is to stick a screwdriver or an apex from one of the multi-tip screwdrivers into the screw head, then take a small punch and a tap hammer and drive the warped metal back down around the bit. It'll make the metal pinch the screwdriver bit, so make sure the screwdriver is fully inserted before punching down the screw head. For a horizontal screw, you might need a spare pair of hands to pull this off.

Technique aside, you could just leave the screw as-is and just pull the front axle bolt out. The wheel will just drop out. There's a spacer on one side and the brake plate on the other. Pull the wheel free of the forks and you can just pull the brake plate out of the hub; no cable removal required.

RoaringTodd · Post by **RoaringTodd** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:46 am

I had no success in getting the screw off, even with a impact screwdriver.

Actually the impact screwdriver did strip the head a little. I think it was a combination of cheap tool from Harbor Freight, a lack of stable support for the brake shoe as I was hammering, and pent up frustration at that #$%&@! screw.

In the middle of my frustration induced fit in the garage, it popped in my mind - why not just unhook the speedo cable from the dash and pull it out. I took out the bottom plastic trim below the dash, and checked for a speedo cable. Lo and behold, it was right there, easy access, and a few turns to loosen the cable, it came apart. I then pulled the brake shoe and the speedo cable pulled out. Wish I had thought of that before. It does not seem to be too difficult to route the cable back up through the body panel to the dash. Seems a pretty simple solution.

Now I have the brake shoe out, but the speedo cable is still stuck in it. I will have to take it to my car mechanic and ask if he could extract the screw out.

Thanks guys for your help.

RT

easy · Post by **easy** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 3:02 pm

I spray PB blaster on stuck screws/nuts heat if possible. Then clockwise pressure before counterclockwise pressure to back it off

siobhan · Post by **siobhan** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 4:26 pm

You need a JIS screwdriver set.
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss? ... crewdriver

charlie55 · Post by **charlie55** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 6:01 pm

siobhan wrote:You need a JIS screwdriver set.
http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_noss? ... crewdriver

JIS = "Jeez, It's Stripped"?

Didn't know they were available. Close to the same thing as filing down a standard Phillips, but without all the trouble. Nice.

Todd, perhaps this is why the impact driver bit started to strip the screw (i.e., too pointy and did not seat all the way into the screw head)?

az_slynch · Post by **az_slynch** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 6:34 pm

JIS = Japan Industrial Standard

That'd be amusing if JIS was used, particularly since production of the Elite 80 moved to Mexico in the late '80s.

JIS can be a major headache, though. The previous owner of my Benly 90 wrecked several fasteners while trying to take it apart.

siobhan · Post by **siobhan** » Sun Apr 07, 2013 10:10 pm

az_slynch wrote:JIS = Japan Industrial Standard

That'd be amusing if JIS was used, particularly since production of the Elite 80 moved to Mexico in the late '80s.

JIS can be a major headache, though. The previous owner of my Benly 90 wrecked several fasteners while trying to take it apart.

I just did the brakes on my 1986 Elite 250 yesterday and yes, it's JIS. Right tool, no headache. Can't wait to try the new Bridgestone Molas tires!

Even if the Elite 80 was built in Mexico, it would make no sense for Honda to retool parts. It's gotta be using JIS. If I weren't so lazy, I'd go check mine but he's buried waaaaay back in the garage as I haven't ridden it in years.

az_slynch · Post by **az_slynch** » Mon Apr 08, 2013 2:36 am

siobhan wrote: Right tool, no headache.

The headache came from the previous owner using all the wrong tools to try and take a '64 Honda motor apart with crappy tools. The stuff he did get off the bike was stored in a bucket that was half full of sand. I'm still acquiring replacement parts so I can rebuild it, and early Benly 90 stuff is neither cheap or easy to find.

siobhan wrote:Even if the Elite 80 was built in Mexico, it would make no sense for Honda to retool parts. It's gotta be using JIS. If I weren't so lazy, I'd go check mine but he's buried waaaaay back in the garage as I haven't ridden it in years.

That's pretty bad when you have bikes that you no longer ride buried somewhere in your garage. I had my Elite in the riding rotation until I loaned it out to a local scooterist while I worked on her '72 Vespa Super. I eventually had to repo my Elite because the person always had an excuse for not returning it. When I did get it back, the poor bike looked like it had been ghost ridden down a few flights of stairs and could no longer turn over. The motor's apart on the bench while I buy parts and modify it; the piston, head and cylinder were all ruined. The brand new muffler was snapped off too!

It'll work out in the long run. Working on building up a 100cc conversion now. I want to bury the needle on the speedometer one of these days!

RoaringTodd · Post by **RoaringTodd** » Mon Apr 08, 2013 11:27 am

Thanks Siobham, (I enjoy your posts) I can understand the JIS tool being the right screwdriver for the job, however to me the screw felt as if it was sized. There was no movement at all. Would the JIS screwdriver have made a difference?

Charlie - possibly... Then again I had this impact screwdriver from HF that just didn't feel like it was working correctly. I had no instructions, and this was my first time using it. Took me a while to figure it out.

I will take the brake housing over to the mechanic today and see if he can get the screw out. Update to come.

(Anyone have an extra Elite Speedo Cable Screw?)

Sean - would love to see how you kit it to 100cc!

RT

RoaringTodd · Post by **RoaringTodd** » Mon Apr 08, 2013 6:40 pm

Screw is out.

All my mechanic did was take the brake housing, hit it two times with HIS impact screwdriver, and out it came.

It must have been the el cheapo tool I got from Harbor Freight or the hammerer.

I'm off to Home Depot to find a replacement screw.

Thanks all for your help!

RT.