2010 Stella 4T with Body Damage for $1100- Worth it?

zmargoli · Post by **zmargoli** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:38 am

Hey all,

I'm looking to move from my buddy 50 to a Stella and have been keeping tabs on craigslist for deals, hoping to spend less than $2000.

I was shocked today to find a post for a 2010 with 520 miles for $1100, though the seller says it was knocked over twice and suffered damage to both "side panels" (pics still coming, not sure what he means.)

Assuming the insides are fine could this be a good deal? I suppose my main question would be how easy/expensive is it to do Stella body repair. If I could spend no more than $1000 to fix it up I'd count it worth it.

Whatcha think?

Drum Pro · Post by **Drum Pro** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 3:29 am

Less than that if you just replaced the cowels... If a pic was up then we might have a better idea of just how much damage there is. Keep in mind that a Stella is a totally different ride than a buddy and is a metal body frame so it's heavier and slower than a Buddy. Depening on how much damage it could be not worth it if the frame is bent.

zmargoli · Post by **zmargoli** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 3:34 am

Though I don't want to derail from my primary question, I'd actually like to ask a speed question since you brought it up. I'm aware the Stella/PX150 is generally a slower ride, though I assumed it would still be an upgrade in speed/power over a Buddy 50 (though not over say a 125/170i.)

My 50 is unrestricted. Anyone ridden a 50 and Stella who can speak to this? I ride in NYC and am mostly interested in having a little more acceleration power, and maintaining speed on bridges/with a passenger.

JohnKiniston · Post by **JohnKiniston** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 3:50 am

Do it! Do it!

If you look back in the forum history you'll see my cheap 4T Stella.

They are great bikes, And body damage just makes them look all the more 'Vintage' I've found

You can fix them with a hammer and bondo if you need, Or buy some used cowls off scoot.net and just swap them (Tho you will have to cut some air holes in the engine side one if you do that.)

Drum Pro · Post by **Drum Pro** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 4:22 am

it's faster than a 50cc and tops out a 55 mph...

zmargoli · Post by **zmargoli** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 1:13 pm

Update!

Saw some pics, the damage is definitely fine and cheap to fix.

However, I didn't realize it's not starting. He told me the full story, it was knocked over and slide down a hill about 15 ft. I get the sense though that this guy is just sick of owning the thing, and most likely whatever is keeping it from starting is minor.

That said, I don't want to purchase a scoot that won't start. When I go out to look, are there general things I should be looking for as the culprit? He thinks its a battery problem, which makes me wonder if he's even tried kick starting it. Spark plug? Bad gas?

One more update: he bought it new from a dealer, but it was the demo unit. Most of the miles are from the shop.

Stitch · Post by **Stitch** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:28 pm

Get the motor running, hammer out the dents if anything is bad enough to make it non functional. Use the "repair" fund you have to upgrade the engine/suspension. What could be more fun than a cheap, beat up looking Stella? If its ugly, throw some stickers on it, or rattlecan your color of choice.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:40 pm

Non running bike - $500 max unless it is something very special

zmargoli · Post by **zmargoli** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 2:56 pm

He also told me he has roadside assistance for 2 years and can call for them to take a look. I figure if they can get it running, all good. Though maybe there's a way he would agree to let me have a shop look at it....

headhunterfrank · Post by **headhunterfrank** » Tue Apr 30, 2013 9:12 pm

I get 62-63 MPH from my 4T Stella with no problem.

zmargoli · Post by **zmargoli** » Wed May 01, 2013 12:43 am

So my interest and questions around the mechanics seem to have prompted the seller to consider fixing it up before selling. He may, may not.

That said if he doesn't, and if he doesn't agree to let me get it checked out by a mechanic before buying, I'm curious for more opinions like BuddyRaton's on if a bike that won't run at all would be worth the cost.

The more I've read around this forum and about bike problems, the more I like the idea of investigating myself, learning to clean the carb, replacing the spark plug, going through the diagnostic process and getting it running myself. Though I'm technically inclined I would say, I have pretty much no experience with the nitty gritty of small motors beyond reattaching my buddy's loose speedo cable.

That said if there's risk of something major/expensive being the real culprit that I'd be unable to spot with my untrained mechanics senses, and I pay more than I could sell it back for, that's a situation I'd like to avoid.

Thoughts?

Robbie · Post by **Robbie** » Wed May 01, 2013 2:03 am

OK, physical damage aside.........If it was laying on its side, the carburetor likely leaked fuel into the crankcase.....no big deal, change the oil and filter before proceeding.
Since it was on its side, look for battery acid leakage onto the left side under the cowl.....acid will eat any metal.....ithe damage will be white and crusty.
If all looks OK, the odds are, after sitting this long, the battery signed off anyways.....plan on replacement.

This is a dirt simple carburetor.....simple to remove, simple to disassemble, simple to clean and reassemble.......it looks like a carb off a 1968 Honda and is a Kiehin....same manufacturer Honda uses.

That really is all it should need mechanically......this, assuming it wasn't punted by a bus and shot down the ravine.....look closely for surprises.

1100.00 eh? I think the 500.00 offer would be too extreme......why not ask the owner what he really wants to make it go away?
He might blow you off your wallet.
But, if he holds firm....try and make a good mental estimate, parts/labor and share that number...IE, battery, 75.00.....carb clean, 100.00 plus gaskets (usually re-usable but you don't have to say that), oil/filter (wheel pull required, time is money) 75.00......yada yada and whatever else you can find.
He has already discounted deeply for the physical damage.

Good luck!
Rob

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Wed May 01, 2013 2:44 am

It could be a lot of things and may be something simple...the problem is you don't know. Yeah might be carb...might be a twisted crank.

I never buy a non runner for more than I can part it out for.

zmargoli · Post by **zmargoli** » Wed May 01, 2013 3:22 am

Hmmm... I'm eyeing a couple 2005's at around $2K each, one with 300 miles, one with 1700 and some performance work done on it already (sito+ exhaust included.) Perhaps though they are older one of those is a safer buy eh?

I assumed a 2010 with some scratches and some sort of 15 minute quick fix to get it running would be the better deal, but given that it's impossible to know.....

Drum Pro · Post by **Drum Pro** » Wed May 01, 2013 4:15 am

I'd see about one of those '05 2t.. Safer bet since you don't know how extensive the damage is. As long as one of them has been looked after, the Stella is a good bike but it's the tendancy for people to mod the engines that cause the most trouble. If left stock they last longer unless your a mechanic and really know what your doing. Even then you gotta be prepaired to blow up a engine or two. That gos double for the 2t's

zmargoli · Post by **zmargoli** » Wed May 01, 2013 8:19 pm

Drum Pro wrote:I'd see about one of those '05 2t.. Safer bet since you don't know how extensive the damage is. As long as one of them has been looked after, the Stella is a good bike but it's the tendancy for people to mod the engines that cause the most trouble. If left stock they last longer unless your a mechanic and really know what your doing. Even then you gotta be prepaired to blow up a engine or two. That gos double for the 2t's

Didn't know the performance work could cause trouble. Looking more closely all that was done mechanically to the one with work on it was the addition of Sito+ exhaust. This would hurt the longevity of that scoot if installed unprofessionally?

Drum Pro · Post by **Drum Pro** » Thu May 02, 2013 4:01 am

zmargoli wrote:
Drum Pro wrote:I'd see about one of those '05 2t.. Safer bet since you don't know how extensive the damage is. As long as one of them has been looked after, the Stella is a good bike but it's the tendancy for people to mod the engines that cause the most trouble. If left stock they last longer unless your a mechanic and really know what your doing. Even then you gotta be prepaired to blow up a engine or two. That gos double for the 2t's
Didn't know the performance work could cause trouble. Looking more closely all that was done mechanically to the one with work on it was the addition of Sito+ exhaust. This would hurt the longevity of that scoot if installed unprofessionally?

Changing the pipe is one thing which may require re-jetting. When I say "mod", people tend to change the engine to get the scoot to go faster and end up pushing it beyond it's limits so the engine fails. There are more mods for a 2t than a 4t. But if it's just a pipe I wouldn't worry about it....

zmargoli · Post by **zmargoli** » Fri May 03, 2013 4:15 am

The re-jetting though can push the engine too hard? I'm realizing now he said there's a simonini pipe too "with proper jets." I'm assuming that means he re-jetted.

BuddyRaton · Post by **BuddyRaton** » Fri May 03, 2013 12:42 pm

zmargoli wrote:
That said if he doesn't, and if he doesn't agree to let me get it checked out by a mechanic before buying, I'm curious for more opinions like BuddyRaton's on if a bike that won't run at all would be worth the cost.

The more I've read around this forum and about bike problems, the more I like the idea of investigating myself, learning to clean the carb, replacing the spark plug, going through the diagnostic process and getting it running myself. Though I'm technically inclined I would say, I have pretty much no experience with the nitty gritty of small motors beyond reattaching my buddy's loose speedo cable.
Thoughts?

Anybody that works on their own scooters started sometime. Nobody was born knowing how to work on them!

There is a ton of information and instructions on line and print and people that will help online and in person.

If you want to learn my suggestion would be to find a low priced vintage in reasonably good shape. Start out by working on stock motors...that way you can look up what the original set up was. Check with local scooter groups, I know there are some vintage scooter heads in your area.

Don't be afraid to ask for help. Most scooter heads are happy to help someone. Just remember that they will help...not do all the work!

It's funny but sometimes at rallies people think the vintage people are snobby but what I have found is that when we get talking about repair tricks, mods etc the rest of the world just kind of goes away.

There is no better felling (almost) than that first time a motor starts after you have taken it all the way apart and put it back together!!!

Start with the simple stuff...like carb and clutch rebuilds and work your way up.

My first carb rebuild probably took two or three hours. Now it's a half hour including removal and re-installation.

Just be careful1 You can wind up with a bunch of scooters!

az_slynch · Post by **az_slynch** » Fri May 03, 2013 6:04 pm

BuddyRaton wrote: Just be careful! You can wind up with a bunch of scooters!

+1!

I need a few months off and a nice grant so I can work through my fleet.

zmargoli · Post by **zmargoli** » Fri May 03, 2013 11:04 pm

Ha! No fleet for me in Manhattan anytime soon I don't think! Part of what would be hard about doing work is I'd have no garage, though I've seen folks do it on the sidewalk before...